Fanclub New Jedi Order / Legacy of the Force Fan Club

Discussion in 'EU Community' started by Adalia-Durron, Jul 3, 2007.

Moderators: Bardan_Jusik, Sinrebirth
  1. Adalia-Durron Former RSA/EUC Empress.

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2003
    star 10
    I preferred it when you said I was naughty.... [face_devil][face_mischief]
  2. zark Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2009
    star 4
    But she certainly is that!
  3. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I don't get how Jacen Solo undergoing character assassination is compelling.
  4. Adalia-Durron Former RSA/EUC Empress.

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2003
    star 10
    How are we assassinating his character? We all know where he's heading.....we're just discussing his path.
    Last edited by Adalia-Durron, Nov 29, 2012
    tsunami1138 likes this.
  5. Skywalker_T-65 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2009
    star 6
    No, not us. He means the authors wrecking Jacen.
    Zeta1127 likes this.
  6. Adalia-Durron Former RSA/EUC Empress.

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2003
    star 10
    Oh?! I get it! Sorry mate ;)
  7. Skywalker_T-65 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2009
    star 6
    I agree with Zeta on that at least. However, I view that Jacen's character assassination started back in Traitor with Crazy Bird Lady, which I've found to be a somewhat unpopular opinion :p
  8. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I have never been so completely put off by Star Wars novels before. How could Jacen Solo, the hero of the NJO, ever become Darth Vader II, a knockoff of his grandfather during the Clone Wars, in a scenario that screams a copy of the Clone Wars?
  9. tsunami1138 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2012
    star 1
    He becomes a Sith Lord because he has a vision which seems to indicate that the only way for the Light Side to emerge victorious in the future is him falling to the Dark Side in the now. He's trying to make the galaxy a better place for his daughter.

    EDIT: That's all IIRC, of course. It's been a couple of years since I read them.
    Last edited by tsunami1138, Nov 30, 2012
  10. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I know that, but its too derivative of his grandfather for me to take it seriously.
  11. zark Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2009
    star 4
    For me it's just too dumb to take seriously. I mean seriously? He couldn't have told anyone about this and gotten help? He just goes on a mindless killing spree of family members and innocents. Brilliant Jacen.
  12. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    Exactly, too derivative of his grandfather, done poorly, to the point I have no interest in reading the post-NJO.
    Last edited by Zeta1127, Dec 1, 2012
  13. Darth_Kiryan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    I seriously think that is being really generous.
  14. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I have called Darth Vader II a cheap knockoff before.
  15. Darth_Kiryan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    Jacen going Sith is beyond pointless i thin watching grass grow is more exciting.
  16. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I sure don't see the point of it either, along with just about everything else I heard about DNT, LotF, and FotJ.
    Last edited by Zeta1127, Dec 2, 2012
  17. Sinrebirth Immortal Mod-King of the EUC and SWC

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2004
    star 8
    But if you haven't read it for yourself, how can you know? That's my opinion, any who.

    As someone who did read it,we all know why Jacen couldn't tell anyone - he couldn't, for fear of Tenel Ka and Allana's lives. As demonstrated, the secret wasn't very well kept when spread out, and Allana is now in terrible danger. Then Jacen watches the GA walking through incompetence and sabotage towards a civil war it will lose through said incompetence - a civil war caused by nothing more than fear, fear that the Yuuzhan Vong War could happen again, a horror filled five years made much worse by an incompetent government to the point that the galaxy arms itself to the teeth. Throw in a faction spreading dissent while creating secret fleets and rearming the most dangerous super weapon in history... I'm sorry how was a soft softly approach going to work? Was Lumiya helping along the conflict? Yes. Was she the root? No. The root was five years of hell that nearly brought the galaxy to its funeral.

    In the novels, Jacen is resisting the necessity of becoming a Sith every step of the way. He is constantly checking that he's not repeating his grandfathers path, and it is not the same. He even flow-walks back to Order 66 to watch his grandfather. He is trying to find a solution on his own. It's arrogant, but it's believable for me. He didn't make a decision that wasn't grounded in utilitarianism. The deaths he caused were, in his mind, necessary. The key death in book 5 was in self-defence, you'll note, as well. Would he have killed them (avoiding major spoilers for Addie), had the issue not been forced? We don't know.

    Did Luke manage to stop the war happening? No.

    Did Jacen's sacrifice end it? Yes.

    On a mundane plane, Jacen was right. In context (as is often the case with the madness the dark side creates), he made things worse for the galaxy in the long term. Was it foreseeable by Jacen? Not in the slightest. Was it a direct consequence? Hell yes. But there was no way anyone could foresee FotJ - a cacophony of events thirty millennia in the making... The legacy of the Celestials the Great Hyperspace War, the Clone Wars, the Galactic Civil War and the Yuuzhan Vong War all coming together to begin the End of Time, as the Killiks called it.

    What happened next doesn't reflect on Jacens decisions, but it does provide context as to why he did the wrong thing.
  18. zark Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2009
    star 4
    I just feel like if he had taken an hour to talk to a family member, one who cared about him and would listen, the whole thing could have been avoided. The only positive about the series for me was jacen going on and on about being all-powerful and then getting openly embarrassed by Luke time and again.

    Sent from the future using psychic implants.
  19. Skywalker_T-65 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2009
    star 6
  20. CPL_Macja Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 29, 2008
    star 5
    But even in NJO Jacen didn't listen to his family... why would he listen to them ten years later when he felt like the only person who could save the galaxy?

    Sent from a Galaxy far away via R2-N6
    zarkinfrood likes this.
  21. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I don't believe Jacen Solo would ever fall to the dark side, especially for similar reasons to those of his grandfather, its as simple as that. I don't like the direction the universe has been taken, not a single thing about it. Why would I want to read about the hero of the NJO becoming something I can't envision him as?
  22. CPL_Macja Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 29, 2008
    star 5
    The only similarity between Jacen Solo's fall and Anakin Skywalker's fall is that they are blood relatives nothing else. Anakin's fall was due to his own selfish reasons to save his hidden wife. Jacen's fall was due to him arrogantly thinking that he alone could save the galaxy.

    But through his fall has brought about the pathway for the Force to be brought back into the balance that his Grandfather threw out of balance on Mortis.
  23. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    You're assuming I care about Mortis, when I said I didn't like a single thing the post-NJO did, I meant it. I wanted something completely different out of the post-NJO, smaller Bantam-style conflicts on the backdrop of the recovery from the Yuuzhan Vong War.
    Last edited by Zeta1127, Dec 2, 2012
  24. CPL_Macja Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 29, 2008
    star 5
    Technically speaking the events on Mortis are PRE-NJO. They were events that happened during the Clone Wars. And because of a decision made then the galaxy has been steeped in conflict since.

    The Vong invasion exposed what had already been there, the core of the Republic riddled with the cancer of political corruption surrounded by the idealists who were hoping for a brighter future. Everything had to change, its was inevitable to be tumultuous.
  25. Zeta1127 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I know Mortis is from TCW, and I don't like anything from TCW either. I feel completely left behind by TCW and the post-NJO. I am only going to even read X-wing: Mercy Kill for two reasons, out of respect for the X-wing series so Del Rey continues the series, and it seems like a prime example of what I wanted out of the post-NJO.
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