JCC "Nice guys."

Oh. Yes.

Thanks Harps. I don't get* anxiety at all and privately harbour suspicions that people with low psychological resilience are lizard men agents not adapting to their cover.

* as in, don't get anxious and also don't understand how people can't control it.

 

Why does she have to be "plucky"?

Men work for each other, high fiving each other. Women often have vitriolic friendships, especially in less developed societies. Basically, situations from telenovelas happen, on a smaller scale. The support network is not really a support network.

Makes sense now. And that SAD is more serious, yes; though blaming people for having it is kinda...strange. I should know, people with GAD are assumed by others to have SAD and that can be tricky.

SAD - I cannot be there. <does not go>

GAD - I am going there. <once there> THIS BUILDING WILL COLLAPSE ON ALL OF US.

 

I'd like to say that I have anxiety, and my anxiety does involve avoidance of certain things entirely. Especially situations that feel unsafe.

 

Anxiety is related to the autonomic nervous system. And no, it cannot be controlled. I'm not sure if you were sarcastic here or not, but not all types of anxiety are "eeek, social situations" and they can result in things such as spasms, diarrhea and a lot of other ugly things.

 

I feel similarly about anger - have never lost control to anger, never said or done anything in anger that I later felt was irrational or ill-judged. Individual brain chemistry and all that, though.

 

Your insights into the male psyche are accurate and valid.

Note: That was sarcasm.

The entire problem we have right now is that the assumed ideal behaviours are hardwired into the human psyche from a young age by way of social expectations, systemic bias, etc.

Whilst the outcomes are different, both genders are crippled by straddling a transition point between the old view of gender and an emergent new one. It's difficult for a lot of people who lack confidence to adapt when the old model assured them of a wife/husband if they just behaved like the movies said.

You demonstrate a lack of experience or a lack of empathy pretending it's only hard for women and easy for men. It's only easier by way of the construct being more positively phrased.

Ah yes, I was being sarcastic hence the lizard people comment.

 

Anger is an emotion, anxiety is an umbrella term for a bunch of conditions that can impact one's quality of life. And most forms of anxiety are completely unrelated to NiceGuy and NiceGirl behaviour. Those people are (by)products of their envirovment, not mentally ill.

And I stand by what I said - it's technically easier to fix a NiceGirl than a NiceGuy because the behaviour of NiceGuys is still considered somewhat normal, while the whole romcom Cinderella type of things are slowly dying off - thank goat for that.

 

Where on this earth is Nice Guy behaviour considered normal?!

 

Hey Harps,
Did you manage to catch Food Star this season?
I thought they made the right choice.
What say you?
Regards,
Vin

 

The last paragraph could not be any more wrong and you have no right to assume how experienced somebody may be. People can be experienced, yet choose to look at things from their own POV, which is what you're doing, after all. You can be as wrong as I am and we can both be right. But ironically, by acknowledging that these people are not unicorns, I seem to be taking real world into consideration more than you do.

What further bothers me about that statement looks just like some "I know things, I've been around the block11!!!1111!111!" narrative, some particularly sneaky form of putting people down, related to negging. Are you really resorting to something...that...low?

The first paragraph is not any different from what I said. However, the second...I just see no reason to defend those who are still privileged in developed societes, not even to think about the underdeveloped and undeveloped ones. I don't intend to have empathy for men for behaving that way, because the society is more likely to overlook their flaws and glorify them for something, eventually. NiceGuy could become, say, a TopNerd, a startup owner; NiceGirl will be an internet meme (see: overly attached girlfriend).

Also, you're talking about gender roles, not gender - the difference is huge. Gender is a far broader topic. Just like the thing with SAD referring to the wrong disorder - terminology needs to be correct, these issues mean a lot to people experiencing them.

 

When you make prescriptive statements about something, and that statement is a blanket generalisation and therefore as wrong as it is right, it doesn't give the impression that you've considered just how ****ed up traditional gender roles are for both men and women.

When it's suggested that you're in fact wrong and you double down, it doesn't give the other statement about how nice girls are more likely to change much credibility either.

You talk about the overly attached girlfriend meme, have a look at this happy fella:




What was the first thought? Of course he has a neckbeard? Or course he wears a fedora? Of course it looks like he ate two smaller Nice Guys? He probably works in IT?

The only benefit Happy Face above has is that he's a man and therefore on paper benefits from systemic bias in favour of males. In practice, he's probably not really seeing those benefits.

 

Hey, Vin,

Yes I did, and they absolutely made the right choice!

Sincerely,
Harps

 

Did your son agree.

 

He didn't watch with me, this time.

 

Oh I missed that last night! Who won?

 

Spoiler

Eddie Jackson

Spoiler tagging "Food Star" results on user request.

 

Something told me "this isn't a good thread to read right now" and of course I opened it anyway. What a great thing to read as I'm thinking about and doing my best to deal with my lifelong anxiety issues (which happen to be on my mind this evening, due to events in my life today)

Your post was truly depressing and distressing to read, for a variety of reasons.

 

Why?

Aside from tongue in cheek lizard men comment, you're surprised someone who doesn't experience something can't understand what it's like?

 

You don't have to understand it... having compassion doesn't require understanding.

Also, here... I'm sure you've experienced all of these, alone, at one point or another... imagine them all at once.

Symptoms of anxiety attacks include:

• Surge of overwhelming panic.
• Feeling of losing control or going crazy.
• Heart palpitations or chest pain.
• Feeling like you're going to pass out.
• Trouble breathing or choking sensation.
• Hyperventilation.
• Hot flashes or chills.
• Trembling or shaking.

 

I was probably being too flippant, so I apologise KW. I've had bad experiences with people who had had broad anxiety disorders, depression etc who've been parasitic leech ****s and that's not a fair representation, it's just a few people so...

Harps, nope. Maybe trembles in a fight or flight situation in which I expected a fight and the situation calmed down. But otherwise, nope.

 

It can also take other forms, which I didn't really understand until recently. Being highly irritable, highly sensitive to sensory input, unable to form coherent thoughts, catastrophizing, and so on.

Edit: I should say that I experience anxiety more in those ways (and always have) than from the traditional list.

 

Yeah, that's what I meant. You've probably experienced them (one at a time) in a context that is not anxiety related... excercizng too hard, scary movie, etc etc

 

Catastrophizing is quite terrible. It's like your danger meter decides to malfunction 24/7.

Anxiety is difficult to cope with, but not everyone is a parasitic leech when they have it.

For those who are, it's usually not intentional. It's hard to find something you understand and feel good about when you have anxiety. A lot of people feel lost and confused, because their mind won't quiet down. So if someone makes you feel comfortable or safe it is tough to let go even in a toxic situation, because you fear the unknown. Anxiety is all about the unknown. If we knew everything, we wouldn't be afraid of what we didn't know. You also can fear that you will lose the person and be subjected to life without them, so you try to cling to everything. I went through that stage, though I usually clung to things instead of people.

Also: that picture is kind of hard not to stereotype with all the text overlay...

 

Yes, I think when I said my experience was limited and it wasn't a fair representation, it definitely needed you to say "not all..."

And that picture absolutely stereotypes, and I know that the comments I made - the neckbeard, the fedora, the weight, the "does he work in IT" - were probably all reactions we had. In whole or in part.

To argue this is not a meme but overly attached girlfriend is? It was a bit silly.

 

I just wanted to clarify for the better of society what can go through someone's head. More for personal reasons. If you needed the info, great, if not, someone else out there does.

I was referring to the snippets of his profile pasted over the top. Your comments were right, I think everyone has those thoughts even if they don't want to admit it. But it's harder to get a first impression when the text on the picture so obviously has "nice guy" written all over it.