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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Ninety Things I Love About TPM

Discussion in 'Archive: The Phantom Menace' started by AdamBertocci, May 26, 2003.

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  1. BobaFrank

    BobaFrank Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 17, 2001
    I just want to say to Ree Yees that your comments are predictable, OLD, and I want you and every BASHER in the JC to know for the 2 years I've been on the JC how much I detest your views.

    Fine by me. I detest your views as well.

    "no comment."

    Unfortunately people like you Ree Yees and others on the JC have done nothing but run your mouth about the faults of TPM. You and every basher on here sickens me.

    I asked the author of this thread, as well as a moderator, if I could make counterpoints. And whaddayaknow - we agreed on some of the points. It makes the discussion a little more interesting than just "I agree" all the way down.

    "Why did you feel you had to voice counterpoints? That's the point I'm trying to get across. It is impossible to have a thread on TPM w/out some basher FEELING THEY MUST voice their dislike, concern. Haven't you all done enough negative damage towards TPM in 4 years?"

    I don't think I've ever been on a TPM thread where at least one basher didn't voice a negative opinion on TPM and most of the time no one asked for that opinion.


    Well, did anyone ask specifically for YOUR opinion in this thread? Man. People write what they feel and think, be happy there's diversity.

    "Don't give me that diversity crap. I'm as far away from PC as you get and always will be. Your right, people write what they feel but should remember the context of the thread and respect that. The thread never asked for counterpoints or debate. Just what people liked about it."

    You and every basher here are hypocrites to the highest degree. You claim to love or be a fan of SW yet you take every chance you can to degrade TPM. Your a disgrace to the name of SW fandom. And don't give me the crap of your opinion counts too. It seems that most of the time your opinion is all that gets heard.


    Seeing that I responded to this thread, AdamBertocci's opinions were certainly heard by me. Of course I love SW - and when something as tragic as SW movies coming out that I don't like - well, then I feel the need to discuss it. Call it psychotherapy.

    "Your telling me in 4 years you haven't been able to cope a little better with your negativity towards TPM? I mean come on now, There's been hundreds of "I hate TPM threads" surely you've seen them."

    It's unfortunate that TPM has become the "Bastard Child" of the Saga.

    I think "AOTC" is worse.

    "I think you and I actually agree on something."

    Where has all this hatred toward TPM gotten you in the JC?

    There is no hatred, only dissapointment.. I cannot believe it, and that is why I fail, or so Yoda said to me the other day.

    "I never thought I would be disappointed with a SW movie but AOTC did it to me. But, I don't go around every chance I get bashing it. I deal with, look at the good parts and fast-foward through what I don't like. Don't get me wrong I thought TPM had faults too but I still love it, and maybe I'll feel the same about AOTC too, but bashing it on the JC doesn't help."

    What is it that you hope to accomplish?

    What can one hope to accomplish by spending time on a message board? It's a tragedy that we're all here discussing movies instead of being out there making the world a better place to live.

    "Its not a tragedy. We do what we can. We come here to get away from the terrible things of the world. I wish we could make the world a better place. Hopefully Ree Yees people like us, our families and friends won't ever quit."

     
  2. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    (1) Thank you BobaFrank and all others who like my list.

    (2)
    Responding to Ree Yees' points that responded to mine that responded to his that responded to mine.

    Well, the OT monsters have a story purpose: the wampa to explain Luke's scar AND have a nice moment with Obi-Wan, the Rancor to gather all the heroes for punishment

    The wampa-scar thing is a good point. (LFL claims that they didn't add the Wampa-claw-face bit just for that; I think they're lying.) And he doesn't take up too much time in ESB, which I appreciate.
    As for the Rancor... don't you mean the Sarlacc? The Rancor is only there to punish Luke. As far as I'm concerned, Jabba could have just sent them all to the Pit of Carkoon as soon as Luke got there and the story would not have been hurt. (Although we would have lost a couple of great Salacious Crumb moments... and shots from below Carrie Fisher's bikini-clad body as she looks down the pit...mmmmm [face_love] )

    I think it's an OK movie, but it's not a family drama. I mean, I don't think George Lucas could pull off a movie like, say, "American Beauty".
    Okay, fine fine, no family drama! I was trying to say that Lucas could do scenes that weren't sci-fi nuttiness, lol.
    Hmmm... Lucas and American Beauty, huh? Well, I think Conrad Hall, not Sam Mendes, is responsible for half that film's awesomeness... but I dunno.
    Lucas' "American Beauty" could be interesting, but I think he'd get worried that he was boring the audience and have Kevin Spacey and Peter Gallagher have a drag race down Main Street.
    There would also be a cute pet puppy for the family. (Is there one already? I haven't seen it in over a year.) Regardless, in Lucas' version, he'd finish out every scene.
    And he'd probably be too chicken to show the glorious breasts of Thora and Mena.
    Oh, and Wes Bentley's character would want to make Flash Gordon-esque movies. ;)
    Finally, in the end (AMERICAN BEAUTY SPOILER) Lester would shoot first. [face_laugh]


    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  3. Padawan_Jess_Kenobi

    Padawan_Jess_Kenobi Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2002
    Great job Adam. You have once again paid attention to the small details and have brightened up TPM for some of us. :D I like how you stated the not-so-obvious scenes of TPM And expanded them.

    And quite frankly, I'll have to agree with BobaFrank quite strongly. The bashers are starting to seriously annoy me now. This movie has been out for 4 years now, and more people talk about how bad it was than how good it is. A lot of bashers seem to ruin threads by always saying how horrible, boring, stupid TPM is. I can't believe it when many bashers even have the nerve to say that TPM shouldn't even be considered a SW movie. At least half the threads here are being derailed with Bashers saying how they hate this and that. Now I'm talking about you specifically, Ree Yees, because it seems that Adam asked you for your opinion and took it well. Sure some of your constant, "I was almost bored to tears by this scene" and "I hated this scene" comments started to annoy me after a while, but I'm talking generally about all bashers. Its sad to say that it seems this forum is being overtaken by bashers. There aren't that many gushers around anymore, I can see that. Nobody can even consider the fact that this movie is a great one. Bashers take almost every chance they can get to degrade this movie.

    Also, its sad to see that many bashers think that the people who actually like TPM only like it because it is a SW movie. That is the most pathetic thing I have ever heard. Sure, we like this just because we have to. No. We like it because we see something in this movie. Bashers can't look deep enough to see the true movie. I've come to the impression lately that bashers are superficial when it comes to TPM.

    Its becoming something "cool" to bash TPM. Its sickening. Like BobaFrank already said, there are multiple threads that have been knocked off its course by a basher exclaiming how much they hate the movie. You have your own thread, "The Bashers Sanctuary" where you can degrade TPM all you wish. All I ask is that you do not bash this thread and throw out negative comments while people are trying to make positive ones. Some of us "gushers" work so hard to make a good thread, trying to bring positive comments. But all that seems to get noticed are when the bashers come along and manage to find something they hate about TPM. And that annoys me to no end.

    I've always had something to say about Bashers, and now that BobaFrank started it (not me :D) I've finally been able to voice them. I'm really sorry to derail your thread like this, Adam. I didn't want to, but I've had it up to here *puts hand at forehead* with bashers. Great list Adam, really great. :DI hope you continue to make these threads that look to TPM's good qualities as opposed to their "bad ones." *shoots a withering glare at bashers* ;)
     
  4. Cometgreen

    Cometgreen Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002
    I think bashers (and gushers, btw) are funny. I just get annoyed by the ones who call us mentally insane because we happen to like the prequels. AOTC is starting to become my favorite SW film yet. I guess my taste is so screwed up that I can't comment on any film ever again. :p

    Another great list Adam. Just like the AOTC list, I have to agree with every point you listed. Especially one of the last ones, referring to Obiwan's scream. I've loved that "No!" scream ever since I heard it on the trailer.

    "TPM clearly has the superior hats of the Star Wars saga."
    I don't know, we still have EpIII. Maybe the fall out between Obiwan and Anakin is over a silly hat that Anakin is forced to wear over the course of the Clone Wars. Some kind of "Dunce" hat. ;)

    Cometgreen
     
  5. Ree Yees

    Ree Yees Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2000
    ********Its sad to say that it seems this forum is being overtaken by bashers.*********

    Well, if you post something remotely negative/criticizing in the AOTC forum you'll quickly realize it's overtaken by gushers.
     
  6. Go-Mer-Tonic

    Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 1999
    I just remember the days when people who hated the subject of the forum in question were considered trolls. Here they seem to be encouraged to be as negative as they possibly can be.

    They even have a base of operations called "the Basher's Sanctuary".

    Notice how many posts that thread has, and compare it to all the other threads on the first 2 pages.

    I am one of the few remaining supporters of this film left here because quite frankly, the climate around here is just too negative. Fans of this movie would rather not hear the incessant, droning negativity that spews from some "fan's" daily routine here.

    That goes for the entire Force net actually.

    It seems to be run by people who are embarrased of their own fandom.

    The latest tirade of getting all cheap when Lucasfilm wants to offer more value added content on their site is more of the same selfish disrespect that a lot of fans have been expressing since Episode I came out.

    "I bought action figures and spent most of my childhood immersed in your fantasy world, now you owe me what I want, when I want it, and all for free!"

    Poor Force Net.

    So you won't be able to steal information from their pay section to post here on your fan site.

    Too bad for you.

    Maybe now you guys will have to actually come up with some of your own original content for a change.
     
  7. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
  8. royalguard96

    royalguard96 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 13, 2001
    Yes, let's try to get this thread back on track, shall we?

    My favorite part of your list Adam, is how you point out the big, obvious things as well as the small details that really give the SW universe a complete and finished feel. This is where TPM successfully picked up where the OT left off. The background details Gavin Bocquet incorporated into each scene was remarkable, and contains much of the film's charm for me.
     
  9. Go-Mer-Tonic

    Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 1999
    Sorry Adam.

    I loved the CG creatures. They all looked like they were really there.

    And especially Sebulba and Watto. I mean how freaky can an alien be and still be that believable?

    They way they moved, the way their weight shifted around, the way their lighting perfectly matched the real lighting of the scene.

    Just a huge leap from the dino's in Jurassic Park.
     
  10. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    I mean how freaky can an alien be and still be that believable?

    I personally think that Jar Jar and the non-Nasslike Gungans have the best "freakiness-to-real-looking" ratio payoff (if you take my meaning) of any SW creature yet. I could see something like that evolving on Earth with the right environment.
    The wampa is another thing I could see existing in real life too, but he's less 'freaky' looking than Jar Jar, and besides if you believe the right people there already ARE large humanoid monsters living in the icy mountains and eating people. ;)
    NOTE: I don't neccesarily criticize SW for not having realistic-looking aliens etc. If I wanted to see something that could really happen, I'd watch Star Trek. Sure, I don't believe that short green Muppet-people with floppy ears would ever evolve, but that doesn't mean I don't love Yoda to death.

    Just a huge leap from the dino's in Jurassic Park.

    Funnily enough, I think the Park dinosaurs are among the best CG creatures out there. Yes, sometimes they had the luxury of hiding in the dark and rain, but still.
    I also note that you never heard people whining about 'too much CG' or 'bad CG' back in 1993 for Jurassic Park. Because they didn't know they were supposed to look for CG and complain about it. Spielberg didn't go on TV and say "Look at all my CG work, people! I am a technogod!"
    Lucas, I think, does himself a disservice by making a big deal of how much CG he uses; it invites criticism. Peter Jackson uses just as much bluescreen work and reliance on CG effects, but doesn't neccesarily promote the digital work WETA does (even though he has every right to be proud of them). The only "Wow, this is digital, we are amazing" campaign I recall them launching was for Gollum, and of course he drew the most criticism of any major CG effect in the film.
    Sometimes you just gotta keep your mouth shut and not let people know what they should dislike. ;)


    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  11. Go-Mer-Tonic

    Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 1999
    I think they all looked great, but Jar-Jar and the gungans are humanoid. Watto is humanoid to an extent, but his gas-bag stomach floating was so bizarre. Sebulba is totally non-humanoid in the way he moves around.
     
  12. appleseed

    appleseed Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2002
    The performance they got out of Watto was something else, too. He's a completely believeable character. I think the scruffy CGI characters get better reactions than the cutsey ones-although my wife thinks Yoda is really cute too, so who knows?
     
  13. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    Responding (again) to one of Ree Yees' points in his loooong post.

    Ironic how the actor who portrays the most evil entity in the saga also is the actor who manages to save the most scenes.

    I agree that he definitely 'saves' a couple of scenes in TPM, because he shares so many with Nat-Nat (and as you may know I thought she was bad in that one).
    Funnily enough, I would give him the exact same credit for ROTJ as well. ROTJ, for me, does not kick into high gear until Luke, Vader and Palpatine meet up for tea and scones at the Death Star. Then all of a sudden the movie goes from a lackluster Muppetfest to sheer awesomeness that kicks butt and takes names. I chalk a lot of that up to Ian McD.
    It's the last couple of reels of ROTJ that save it for me and catapult it from potential last-place in the saga right up to third place.
    Gotta love the bad guys...


    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  14. Cometgreen

    Cometgreen Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002
    "The only "Wow, this is digital, we are amazing" campaign I recall them launching was for Gollum, and of course he drew the most criticism of any major CG effect in the film."

    Actually, it's the same for AOTC. Yoda was really the only new CG thing that Lucasfilm talked about a lot. I don't remember reading much about digital stunt doubles. SW, however, takes place on worlds that you know could never be shot here on Earth, so everyone knows that something is CG. I just love when people complain that a model is too CG like. :)

    Cometgreen
     
  15. Ree Yees

    Ree Yees Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2000
    Funnily enough, I would give him the exact same credit for ROTJ as well. ROTJ, for me, does not kick into high gear until Luke, Vader and Palpatine meet up for tea and scones at the Death Star. Then all of a sudden the movie goes from a lackluster Muppetfest to sheer awesomeness

    I have to agree, the Emperor is very cool in "Return of the Jedi". I used to like the Jabba's Palace scenes, but the "Special" Editions have ruined them a little for me.
     
  16. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    Just thought I'd up this, seeing as the trend has caught on.

    Mods, my thread is the original. Just compare the dates. No nasty locking for redundancy please! :p



    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  17. Grilled-Sarlacc

    Grilled-Sarlacc Former Head Admin star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2001
    This thread is one of the best I have seen in this forum. Very well done.
     
  18. Darth_Zoo

    Darth_Zoo Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 15, 2002
    Great work on the list!

     
  19. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    Spectacular list, Adam. Reading threads like this is what makes me a bigger TPM fan every day :D

    I am definitely going to watch TPM and make a list like this of my own soon... would anyone like to read it when I do?

    -sj loves kevin spacey
     
  20. DamonD

    DamonD Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 22, 2002
    Sure, always nice to hear new thoughts.
    I'm looking forward to JBro's TPM thread, too :D
     
  21. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    God, look at all this. One simple thread in the AOTC forum leads to five threads from me, responses in similar format, even imitator threads along a similar theme.

    I've created a monster.



    GOOD. [face_devil]



    Rick McCallum loves you! (He's even got a list of ninety reasons why.)
     
  22. Durwood

    Durwood Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    Adam's initial post was very well done. ReeYees' rebuttle was just a waste of bandwidth. Let's keep the bashing to the "sanctuary."
     
  23. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2002
    Durwood, I've asked for that bit of the discussion to be dropped...

    ATTENTION MILITANT BASHERS & GUSHERS

    PLEASE DO NOT TURN THIS INTO A BASHER-GUSHER THREAD

    Please talk about the points made on the list, not the people who make them.
    Unless, of course, you wish to praise my infinite genius. :p


    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  24. The Dark Lord of London

    The Dark Lord of London Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1999
    Very good post, the fond memories of the Phantom Menace are flooding back!
    One of my fave bit is when Qui-Gon is burning through the blast door, complemented by a nice rendition of the Force theme!Awesome stuff.
     
  25. keokiswahine

    keokiswahine Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2000
    Adam, waiting for your last 10 things to make it a full hundred. TPM grows on you... :) :D
     
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