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CT "Noooo" in Return of the Jedi

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by Charlie512, May 23, 2013.

  1. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    No, you're right. But Pauline Kael really hated the OT and took every opportunity to bash it. However my point is, that if every critic was truly listened to and adhered to, no one would make it in Hollywood.

    This is true, but only more so because of the internet which has become the breeding ground for amateur critics. Before then, there were opinions to be sure, but there was a lack of a forum for uniting them.


    Of course not. The public can say what they want. That is their right. What is not their right is demanding it be a certain way, because they don't like it. Or thinking that he owes them. They can voice that opinion, but expecting a reality is another matter all together.
     
  2. Aegon Starcaster

    Aegon Starcaster Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 27, 2013
    I'll agree with all that. None of us has any choice but to deal with the opinions of others on public forums, or we can just decide that public forums aren't for us. I see having at least two different perspectives in any discussion as a good thing. I don't look at the two different opinions in this thread as something that would detract me from the forum. In fact, other people's opinions, including yours, in all the various topics is why I keep returning. I wouldn't worry about people making too many demands about the changes anymore. People might have wishful thinking, and hopes and dreams on this particular subject, but most of them know that changing the movies back to the way they were is unlikely for the time being. And as for the people who continue to make demands, rest assured, Lucas and Disney are listening to them, but not all that closely.
     
  3. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    I've been unable to take "NOOOOOOs" seriously for nearly a decade now. I literally cringe whenever I hear one. So when one is added into the absolutely pivotal moment of the series, I think I have a right to say that it diminishes the impact for me.

    Now, you can feel differently about it. But don't try and tell me what it does or does not change.
     
    T-R- likes this.
  4. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    What it changes for you, is your business. But to say that overall, that it would for everyone, then that should be objected to.
     
    Darkslayer likes this.
  5. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    Isn't that exactly what you're doing, though? Saying that it only makes a difference to a hardcore minority of fans?
     
  6. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    I am aware of the irony. Though it is often the same set of people that complain about any change made, which is why I pointed out that they are consistent. We never really get to hear a large, majority consensus on the changes.
     
  7. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    Yeah, that's true.
     
  8. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2013
    [face_laugh]This thread is hilarious
     
  9. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    You never saw the Artoo is secretly a spy for Darth Sidious debate.
     
  10. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2013
    Give me a link [face_rofl]
     
  11. Darth Raiden

    Darth Raiden Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Aug 28, 2013

    wait... WHAT!!!!!??????? o_O
     
  12. lbr789

    lbr789 Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2013
    :rolleyes: Really? Where was this?
     
  13. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    This was back in the ROTS Spoilers Allowed thread, in 2003. It ran through 2005. I had a big old debate with one poster, who had this theory that Artoo had a camera which recorded Anakin's actions and thus Palpatine knew all about it. He even said that when Threepio put his hand on top of Artoo's head during the wedding at the end of AOTC, he inadvertently blocked Palpatine's view. I think he also claimed that Artoo was the one who ratted out that they were on Tatooine in TPM. I suspected that this poster was either serious, or a troll. That thread is long gone by now.
     
    lbr789 and Team Padme like this.
  14. Merkual

    Merkual Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013
    I think I vaguely remember that thread,

    the one I remember the most fondly is the guy who was convinced that Palpatine did a "force "heh keh keh" on the invisible hand to lift up Kenobi to help out Dooku.

    Back on topic though:

    It was a useless change imo.
     
  15. Darth Raiden

    Darth Raiden Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Aug 28, 2013

    Just [face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl]
     
  16. T-R-

    T-R- Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 13, 2003
    the NOOOOOOO is worse than Greedo shooting first and just behind replacing Shaw.

    It doesn't fit. It doesn't sound like RotJ Vader. And why wouldn't Palpatine be like "wait, nooo, noooo what?" and look at Vader. It totally breaks the build as Vader is making his decision.
     
    TX-20, Skywalker Thing and Sarge like this.
  17. TX-20

    TX-20 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 21, 2013
    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO way! That happened?
     
  18. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    Yes, it did. There were all kinds of theories. Both serious and humorous. You stick around here long enough, you'll see some similar ones with the ST. More so after Episode VII comes out. That's when people will come up with ideas based on what is known.
     
  19. HevyDevy

    HevyDevy Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Lol @ R2 as a spy. That's out there, makes me wonder if people even watched the OT. But generally on the thread topic I think the change was unnecessary. In defence of the change it does break up the long time Anakin/Vader takes to make his decision, but as has been said, why would Sidious not be tipped off that Vader was about to turn.
     
  20. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    1. Sidious wasn't paying attention. He was too busy killing Luke to sense the conflict in Vader, during that time. Much less notice what was coming out of his mouth. Haven't you ever gotten so distracted that you didn't hear someone speaking. Or if you did, hear what they were saying exactly?

    2. That theory also extended into the OT.
     
  21. CommanderDrenn

    CommanderDrenn Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 19, 2013
    I intensely dislike the 'no's.' They ruin a little bit of the tingles I get when I watch that scene. I mean, what is the no for? Luke dying, or betraying the Emperor? I don't want these questions, I just want the magic of the original scene. I still get tingles when watching it, though.
     
    Sarge likes this.
  22. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    The first "No" represents the good in Anakin finally awakening as he vocalizes that he was wrong and the second one is his saying that he will not let his son die.
     
    Seagoat likes this.
  23. Seagoat

    Seagoat PT and Music Section Dictator star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2013
    I love this interpretation. It's almost like Anakin, for the first time, speaking directly to Vader. It just further reinforces the idea that they are two completely different characters.
     
    lbr789 and Darkslayer like this.
  24. TOSCHESTATION

    TOSCHESTATION Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 17, 2003
    Except they're NOT two completely different characters, unless one discards the Father Vader ret-con. It also needlessly complicates the story - "it" meaning, trying to have it both ways, i.e. they're separate and they're not at the same time. It's either one or the other; either Vader and Anakin are literally separate and the former killed the later, or Vader is just Anakin on the Dark Side.
     
  25. Seagoat

    Seagoat PT and Music Section Dictator star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2013
    In the eyes of the Force, they are indeed two different people.