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ST Nostalgia elements in TFA: Too much or too little?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by ray243, May 9, 2015.

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Is there too much or too little Nostalgia elements in TFA?

  1. Too much

    38 vote(s)
    62.3%
  2. Too Little

    14 vote(s)
    23.0%
  3. Have to wait and see

    9 vote(s)
    14.8%
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  1. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host star 9 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Why is there no "I don't care" option?
     
  2. thejeditraitor

    thejeditraitor Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    in your mind my young padawan.
     
  3. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    If the nostalgic references don't work, killing off Jar Jar might. Not to derail this thread, but is there any point besides blatant hatred? :rolleyes:
     
    Blazer-Smith likes this.
  4. thejeditraitor

    thejeditraitor Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    humor.
     
  5. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    To those who dislike Jar Jar and/or TPM, methinks.
     
  6. ray243

    ray243 Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 26, 2006

    A good story doesn't pander to the readers and audiences' every need. It's what separate professional writers from fanfic writers. Star Wars in the hands of fanboys is doomed to go on the same path Star Trek did.

    It's funny that the main reason for the new Trek's film relatively success is people commenting on how different it is from the old Star Trek movies, and it wasn't made by a fan. I've a very strong distrust of fanboys running the show, as being such a massive fanboy can cloud's people judgement as storytellers.

    EP 7 is supposed to be a good story, not a series of nostalgic elements tied together merely to please the fans. Nostalgic moments doesn't work if the story is weak.
     
    Andy Wylde and Shamear like this.
  7. Acroyear

    Acroyear Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 24, 2001
    One can look to Ep. 8 and hope that Johnson will think outside the box.
     
    LUH-3417 likes this.
  8. KenW

    KenW Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2015
    If you watch the Plinkett reviews again, you will see in his summaries what he thinks Star Wars is supposed to be. Same with the "Dear JJ Abrams" video. The people who agreed with these summations are getting their way with the new movie. Rather than looking at how many millions of people liked the saga, Disney looked at how many millions of people liked those videos. Yes, those videos have millions of fans, but how many more people do you think are prequel fans than are Plinkett fans? I can show you millions of likes for AOTC videos too. It's like the powers that be think they can avoid fan division by placating one group, but they can't. The one thing we all have in common is we liked Lucas' core saga stories (not all of us liked all of them, but some or most), and they threw those out. Too many people confused nitpicking with hating. How could suits know the difference? I want a movie, not a social media campaign.
     
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  9. Artoo-Dion

    Artoo-Dion Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 9, 2009
    And what makes you think the story is weak?
     
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  10. Acroyear

    Acroyear Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 24, 2001
    Prima facie evidence points to the usual story where the bad guys have a super weapon and the good guys need to stop them. And then there's something about a misplaced lightsabre being returned to its owner. [face_dancing]
     
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  11. Artoo-Dion

    Artoo-Dion Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 9, 2009
    None of that strike me as weak if the execution is good.
     
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  12. Pliolite

    Pliolite Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 3, 2014
    TFA's story can be weak (if the rumors are true I'm not rating it too highly just yet...) and the movie as a whole still work. The main thing is dialogue and performances.

    TFA is going to have amazing visuals and action, much like TPM, yet it should trump TPM by having performances with some life in them (Watto aside, who showed more life than anyone, despite being a CGI character from 1999) and less-cheesy script and direction ('you were right about one thing, Master; the negotiations were short...' :_|[:D]). This is coming from someone who loves TPM, incidentally. Yet I know the story is weak. On the contrary, AOTC has a much better story, yet is far weaker than TPM in most other areas (imo, of course).

    So story is certainly not everything! Look at the Hobbit films... Tolkien had a brilliant story there yet they still managed to mess it up.
     
    Blazer-Smith, TK327 and Artoo-Dion like this.
  13. beedubaya

    beedubaya Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jul 15, 2014

    I am genuinely worried about prequel backlash having influenced JJ Abrams to the point where he will completely ignore them. I'm worried that he will try so hard to recreate the original trilogy and please fans who hated the prequels that he won't move the saga forward. I think it's too early to tell for sure though. Despite having two trailers, we know very, very little about this movie. What we do know is that the marketing is really hitting the nostalgia hard, but the movie might be just right. I really hope this new trilogy finds a balance between appealing to OT fans, moving the saga forward, and having at least some connections back to the prequel era.
     
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  14. Artoo-Dion

    Artoo-Dion Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 9, 2009
    It's the first of a trilogy, so its main job is to lay the groundwork for what's to come. I really don't expect it to be a radical departure for that reason alone. However, I also fully expect it to be approached so that no prior knowledge of the PT or OT is required to understand and enjoy the story.
     
    Immortiss, TK327 and Force Smuggler like this.
  15. ray243

    ray243 Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 26, 2006

    Good execution doesn't necessarily mean the film itself is good in the long run. JJ's films is well-executed, but often they don't have much lasting appeal in the long run. The prequels, even if they don't have the best execution gave the fans lots of stuff to talk about because the ideas were generally interesting.

    A well-executed film without a good idea would be another run-of-the-mill box office filcks that people would forget about after some time. A forgettable Star Wars movie is something I think will just bore my mind.




    A film can't be created for the sake of laying the groundwork for other films Look at what this approach has done to the Spiderman franchise.

    Not being daring with Star Wars will please some of the nostalgic fans in the short run, and highly likely to ruin people's perception of it in the long run.
     
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  16. Artoo-Dion

    Artoo-Dion Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 9, 2009
    Before we continue, what exactly are you trying to discuss in this thread. Story? Design? General mis-en-scene?
     
  17. Acroyear

    Acroyear Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 24, 2001
    I thought I read quite some time ago that when Abrams and Kasdan were working on the script that they weren't overly satisfied that they had the strongest story they could offer. But then again, the source of that report probably wasn't the most credible.
     
  18. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    We have 8 and 9 for the radical departure. 3 and 4 had plenty of similarities. I expect the jump from 6 to 7 to be similar to 3 and 4. Makes it more of a continuation from 1-6. If it is a continuation would't we want it to tie into what came before? Makes sense to me anyway.
     
  19. PymParticles

    PymParticles Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Oct 1, 2014
    I remember last May 4th Harry Knowles reported that there was a period of time where the script read far too similarly to A New Hope, but that as of the time the article was written they had gotten it to a place that all involved parties were pleased with. I took that to mean Arndt's draft vs. the Abrams/Kasdan shooting script, but that's just an assumption on my part, and Knowles validity is up in the air, as well.
     
  20. ray243

    ray243 Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 26, 2006

    That is a bad idea, because if Abrams created the villians in EP 7 ( aka a new version of the Empire), other writers and directors would be forced to conclude JJ's story as opposed to being more creative and bold in their vision. We can't have more unique villians because directors like Rian Johnson who seems more creative than JJ do not have a choice.

    To me, JJ as the first director of new Star Wars films limits the creativity of other directors. I do not want JJ to lay the groundwork. Him laying the groundwork for Star Trek has essentially forced the Trek franchise into a corner.
     
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  21. Vehgah

    Vehgah Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    May 8, 2014
    There's no such things as too little. Nostalgia's nice, but the important thing is whether or not it's a good story that fits with the mythos.
     
    One-Eyed Gran likes this.
  22. One-Eyed Gran

    One-Eyed Gran Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 13, 2014
    For me, the balance between nostalgic and new elements (at least in what we've seen so far) has been the "lock-in" factor for Disney and J.J. Abrams' handling of this movie.

    I've been pleasantly surprised that the nostalgia factor is pretty authentic and not cloying.

    Truth be told, my excitement for seeing the traditional bits and characters has subdued, and I'm very much digging (with reserved optimism) the "new" in this movie.
     
  23. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I'm sure that there are plenty of other interesting things in TFA that will be picked up in 8 and 9.
    Besides do we really know who the heck made the script yet? JJ? GL? KK? Kasden? Iger? Someone else?
     
  24. Artoo-Dion

    Artoo-Dion Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 9, 2009
    Ray, all I end up getting from your posts is "JJ is bad and therefore TFA will be bad and I can't separate out what I prefer from what is the right way to make a blockbuster sequel with $4b riding on its success."

    I mean, "I do not want JJ to lay the groundwork"? Too late, it's happening. I suggest you make your peace with this or movie on.
     
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  25. Toonimator

    Toonimator Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2006
    What we've seen so far is less than 4 full minutes of footage and a handful of photos/props...while many elements will obviously appear throughout (stormtroopers & various specialty troops), they're probably only releasing 'nostalgia' stuff--plus a few new characters--to fire up the fans... the bulk of the 'new' will be in the film itself, and we'll likely see some of that in the first proper trailer.
     
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