Obesity is a choice

chibiangi You know, I came up with a pun by misspelling assumption to illustrate the true meaning of the word, but it probably wouldn't go over well with the mods.

I did not say "My BMI is lower than the grams of fat in celery" or "I work out once a day 8 times a week" or I have the "one type of body size and shape." I just said that I am careful and as such healthy and in shape. Use whatever definition of healthy and in shape you want; is there anything wrong if a person is proud of themselves if they are so?

 

Yeah, a girl in my ROTC unit could easily pass the Army Physical Fitness Test, but had to loose a significant amount of body fat to meet the standards. I know from experience that it's certainly possible for some people to live a totally sedentary lifestyle and be thin. From when I was in out of shape a couple years ago to now, the only visible change is that my arms are bulkier; but having exercised a lot, I can run a whole lot faster and farther.

 

Some of the most unhealthy people I know are fairly skinny.

Skinny =/= healthy, by any means.

 

what relevance is your point? no one is argueing that unhealthy-thin is a good idea - it could as equally damaging as unhealthy-overweight.

 

But if you were to systematically exclude the obese from benefits, isn't that totally unfair because there is a whole group of people who for their lifestyle choices are just as big as a drain on the system? Anorexia is just as much as a choice as obesity, why aren't they forced to pay the full cost of their care? Why not a barf tax with a fat tax?

 

How many times do I need to repeat myself before people 'get' my point. I'm all for making those who end up requiring excessive healthcare through their own actions be responsible for their own costs. This specific thread is on obesity, and how it is a 100% choice.

 

I'm a little confused here.

Who, in this thread, has argued that BMI is a good measure of obesity? I haven't argued that. I'm pretty sure that malkie hasn't.

If no one is arguing that it is a good measure of obesity, why are you using it to make your point? We're all pretty much in agreement there.

Kimball Kinnison

 

BMI cannot be a good measure of obesity, muscles weigh more than fat But I don't think anyone has argued something like that.

I'd again point out that American/Western, or whatever we call it, lifestyle is one that just has to trigger obesity. Even if you work out, your body will still put on fat if you eat too much - as folks in the US or the UK do (I won't mention other examples as I don't know about any statistics about the problem).

Dudes, West is just too rich. We produce/absorb more edible goods that we're capable of digesting.

 

I'd prefer to actually see the data, and experimental conditions rather than rely on the interpretation from a journalist. I'm not bringing the whole thing into question, but perhaps when you boil the data down the conclusions are somewhat different from the media spin.

 

Complete Organic Pregnancy?

Hm, I see a derail coming... What does organic food have to do with obesity?

 

It's great when that happens. What did you do, the South Beach Diet? Even a balanced traditional diet followed rigidly doesn't usually afford that much weight loss.

 

unlocked and revived by request.

 

I totally agree with you on this issue. Those who are obese are far more likely to suffer illnesses as a result of their excessive overeating. That's not to say that everyone who's fat is going to get diabetes or have a heart attack, but those that do so often can trace the cause to obesity. Therefore such people who eat to abundance should be expected to pay for the additional healthcare that they require.

The universal cure for most diseases and illnesses is regular physical activity. It's as simple as that. That's not to say everyone who exercises will live a long, healthy life, but their physical conditioning improves their immune system significantly more than if they lived a less active lifestyle. Exercising the cardiovascular system is also important to reducing the risk of heart failure, while inactivity makes a person very prone to heart disease.

 

Gut bacteria not a choice

Yep, those fat mice made a choice to be fat alright.

 

Fat people don't need bacterial transplants to get slim, they just need a treadmill.

I'm always unsure on issues such as the "evidence" that suggests obesity is not related to poor diet and lifestyle. It's entirely possible such findings are fabricated in order to stop pressure on government and healthcare services to divert funds and resources dealing with the issue.

After all, there used to be "evidence" that said Smoking wasn't bad for you. Only when it became overwhelmingly apparent that it was in fact very bad were the messages changed.

Excuses are always thrown around, like being "big boned". What does that even mean?
If I stripped a fat person down to just a skeleton, their bones wouldn't be bigger or thicker then my bones, they are the same.

 

1) The first bold comment is a statement that is false. Obese people are likely to suffer illnesses because of their obesity, not because of overeating. In fact, overeating may not even be present.
2) I thought the cure for most diseases and illnesses was medicine.

 

You can be skeptical about "evidence." But not by just putting skeptical quotation marks around words. You should you know, post facts and stuff. Also those fat rats clearly just didn't run enough, nothing else could have been a factor.

2) I thought the cure for most diseases and illnesses was medicine.

Not if you're a Chiropractor.

 

Most areas of medicine advocate the use of lifestyle modifications, or medical devices when possible.
It's all about using what is effective..

So what's effective for Obesity?
Proper diet
Proper Exercise
and , IF needed, medications. That's a BIG if, some states even restrict diet pills to certain BMI levels

 

1) The first bold comment is a statement that is false. Obese people are likely to suffer illnesses because of their obesity, not because of overeating. In fact, overeating may not even be present.
2) I thought the cure for most diseases and illnesses was medicine.[/quote]

When I define 'overeating,' I'm covering everything in regards to consuming more calories than the person burns off. There can and are many who are overweight, but exercise regularly. It all comes down to working out, but obese clearly eat more than they work off.

The best 'cure' is not medicine, but in preventive measures. If you get cavities on a regular basis, the best solution isn't to drill cavities; but in taking better care of your teeth. That doesn't mean you don't fix cavities, but it's not getting them in the first place.

Obese people don't exactly all have heart diseases within their life spans, but statistically are going to have a much greater chance of such health problems. Those who live an active lifestyle also tend to be healthier and fit. It's better to eat and exercise more than it is to reduce both.

Although diet and exercise are both important, physical activity is the more critical of the two. It's what improves your body's immune, cardiovascular system, and even mental health is improved. Physical discomfort causes your brain to increase the pleasure-inducing chemicals to counter to discomfort.

 

Preventative measures aren't cures. They're different things.

 

No, preventive measures are the best solutions to health problems. Not to mention financial problems.

Proof: My Grandfather had a heart attack before age 60. After that, he changed his lifestyle completely and lived to 90. It wasn't a minor alteration to his eating and workout habits; he would have suffered another heart attack if he didn't change and he knew it.

Health care reform? It's crap. You're not going to live a long life if you can get a surgeon to fix every disease and ailment that comes from laziness and excessive eating. It's by far more expensive to repair damage after its done than it is to prevent it from happening.

 

The point is, though, that no amount of exercise was going to UNDO the first heart attack from happening. Prevention prevents something from occurring, not curing something that has already happened.

 

Yes...? Your point being?

Preventive measures are always the best solution to most problems. It doesn't help you once you've become too fat and lazy to do anything about a heart attack, but the best way to survive a second is to not have it. Rather than invest billions into health care systems, it would be far better to invest in preventive measures. For those who don't take the preventive measures, they should pay for the emergency resources. I will not have anyone be encouraged to continue living a sedentary lifestyle.