~~Official Expanded Universe Discussion Thread~~ Current Topic: Backlashes against EU characters

You're crazy man. there's no way the Rebellion could survive against the unified front of the Empire. Assuming it's either Thrawn or Palpatine's clone at the command, they would not rest until every last trace of Rebellion was utterly destroyed of under control. Palp's super-weapons alone could take out whole planets of insurrection in the blink of an eye. And Thrawn's strategies were unparalleled.

 

Cmon....its thrawn.


*imagines waves of cloaked golan III's and ISD's*

 

seriously now. that's what I'm talking about.

 

Here is my timeline if Thrawn had not died at Bilbringi (WHICH HE DIDN'T! ):

5- ABY Thrawn leads his forces, and takes several major planets such as Thyfera, and Duro.

5.5- ABY Thrawn soon (6 to 8 months after Bilbringi) recaptures Coruscant.

5.6 or 5.6-ABY Pushes the New Republic into a Rebellion again, owning about 25% of the known galaxy.

6 ABY- El Clono comes into the limelight, attacking a few of the Empire's planets clost to Coruscant. Luke (yes, he is still alive in my plan) goes through the whole Ulic Quel-Dorma thing, Leia pulls him back durring an attack by Thrawn on El Clono's fleet. El Clono goes boom.

7 ABY- Luke forms the New Jedi Order, but having most of the same candidates as in the offical timeline.

8 ABY- Various warlords join under teh command of Thrawn (by free will)

10 ABY- With the help of the new Jedi, the Rebellion, slowly is able to gain some territory.

13 ABY- New Republic owns about half the known galaxy.

15 ABY- New Republic tries to establish peace, realising that Thrawn's empire isn't as bad as Palps'. Thrawn eventualy agrees.

25 ABY- Various Vong events happen. War lasts about two years.



And all theis while:

Dalaa rots away orbiting the Maw Instilation like she was ment to, and doesn't hurt anyone, save a few dumb troopers, and eventualy just rots out of existance (yay! )

 

Yes.

It is truth, with a side dish of wishfull thinking.

But seriously, I don't think that the Rebellion would be completely obliterated, since I think that they'll find they disagree far less with Thrawn's Empire than Palps' Empire.

 

Thrawn clearly was the best of the bunch followed very closley by Zsinj. I feel, had Zsinj still been alive and operating at the time of Thrawn's return from the Unknown Regions, that they would've made a particularly deadly combination. Further, as Zsinj represented one of the strongest and most successful warlords, siding with Thrawn would have pushed more of the smaller groups into the fold, simply fdor survival's sake.

The next question, Thrawn vs El Clono, is a much more difficult one. Operation Shadowhand took a good portion of the Empire's military resources. Even with the New Republic making it a two-front war, the odds would numerically be in El Clono's favor. Further, Palpy's got the Dark Side abilities and creatures he's cooked up. Granted, Thrawn did exploit the use of ysalamiri (I cannot fro the life of me ever spell that right. ) but would that be enough to tip the balance? Alone, I think not. However, if the Republic and Thrawn joined forces, IMHO, they could out-general El Clono and his forces, and ultimately destroy him.

 

Lank:

Interesting idea of Thrawn and Zsinj being a deadly combo for the Rebellion, one I think I would have to agree with. Between Thrawn more classical military genius and Zsinj's prefernce for deceit and more pirate-like activities, they definitely would have had the Rebels very busy in a variety of manners. The rebels probably would have a very difficult time combating such threats simultaneouisly.

 

I don't know too much about the military might of the individual warlords, but, based on how the New Republic struggled to repel them individually, (and, Jello you should be jumping up and down in excitement to hear me admit this ) I definitely think a united Imperial front could have thrown the fledgling government into disarray. Strength in numbers, right? If they had manage to unite, the NR would have had a great deal to fear.

 

lol

 

YES! My topic!

Maybe not all of them, but if he(Thrawn) could have brought the ones who were willing to help, such as Isard and Daala, Who being rejected by most other Imperials, would have joined Thrawn, I think they could have beaten the Repulic back, to atleast a point where they'd atleast call a truce, eachside controling a portion of the Galaxy, of course then Thrawn would gear up for a second attack after that.. I think it would have worked

 

For some reason I had debated this topic already...

I think with enough resources Thrawn would have been able to seriously challenge and MAYBE even beat the New Republic.

Thrawn, with the few resources he had, was already a serious challenge and was on the verge of defeating the New Republic in the TTT. More resources would have merely guaranteed a swifter and assured victory.

Would they fight for him, an alien (well put, Jedi-Aztek)? Probably not.

If they didn't, then Thrawn would have killed them much like Daala had done in Darksaber and assimulated their resources. Plus he could have kept them in line with his Noghri.

If you'd put all Imperial warlords under Thrawn's command, you'd get a too large group, too much opinions,

The Military is not a democracy and the warlords understand the chain of command. They would follow orders once they realized its in their best interests.

Though I still hold to my belief that the Rebellion would win in the long run though.

As I said in the NSO thread (i think that is where I last debated this), the rebellion would not have a chance against a unified Empire. They knew this and thus why they encouraged warlordism among the Imperials and lost severely whenever the Empire did, momentarily, unify. Under Thrawn's command the Rebellion was thrown defeat after defeat. Under the Reborn Emperor's command the Rebellion was thrown defeat after defeat. The only reason they overcame both oppenants is because they were able to divide the enemey, sow doubt among its men and had double agents on the inside. In Palpatine's case, he focused too much on Luke and perserving his life that he lost sight of the bigger picture.

Isard would be least willing to help Thrawn.

She would help none-the-less. She was working with Thrawn during the X-wing series.

 

Very well put.

but are there any more thoughts?

 

I know it was retconned to say that Isard was working for Thrawn secretly, but when exactly did they do that. was it Vision of the Future?

 

While we're on the subject of Warlords, does anyone know the whereabouts of Harsk and Teradoc during the Thrawn trilogy?

I know it was retconned to say that Isard was working for Thrawn secretly, but when exactly did they do that. was it Vision of the Future?

I believe there was a reference in X-Wing about Iceheart demoting an officer and having him serve under Thrawn.

As for the Rebellion vs. Unified Empire, I don't think there was ever a chance of an entity close to resembling a Unified Empire after Endor. The death of Palpatine and the ensuing power struggle and infighting fractured the Imperial system so badly, not even Palpatwo could even bring it fully under his control (i.e there were still a council of Warlords acting independently who attacked Coruscant).

Their last shot was with Daala, and she blew it.

 

Now....how many SSD's do you think would be left though?

And...would there still be the ESSD's and the SSSD's etc?

 

ok, here's how i see it:

you've got a bunch of imperial commanders that are all but tactical geniouses. they throw star destroyers into circumstances they're not prepared for, and they make their resources into predictable targets.

you've got thrawn, who is quite the uncanny tactition. he uses his resources to the best of their capablilities (like not wasting any ships beseiging coruscant) and he uses non-imperial elements along with diplomatic tactics to not be just another emperor.

though these other warlords dont make use of their resources, thrawn sure as hell could, and looking at the immense amount of coordination in his campaign, it wouldn't require too large an amount of other commanding officers to run a war.

the one thing thrawn was lacking in his campaign was resources: despite having cloning facilities and a bunch of free dreadnaughts, he was always seeking more resources. the reason: the empire never relied on tactics or elite forces in the past, it relied on manpower, and it was a government that was not in the habit of leaving worlds to be governed by themselves (the reigonal governors did have direct control over their territories) and it needed manpower to maintain that.

if thrawn had the manpower of whole of the empire, he could have kicked the new republic up and down the galaxy, he was quite close as is


feel free to attack and ask for clarification where nessisary

 

All the manpower, ships, and resources couldn't stop Rukh's knife. Even if Thrawn had consolidated more of the Empire, Leia's mission to free the Noghri would still have been his downfall.

 

you must remember that thrawn would have had all of his campaigning time with the additional forces before his assassination. he could have sent other forces to check on the faclon at endor, the new republic's coordination and space could have been greatly decreased, and mount tantiss (more so the key at the point when thrawn was killed than thrawn was) could be better equipped to handle native insurrection and infiltration enableing thrawns successor to have an inexhaustable supply of troops to use in finishing off the battered new republic.

 

And assumign Thrawn was able to unify the Empire again, Leia's attempts to win the Noghri on the New Republic's side would probably not have occured. For starters, the only reason she went to Honoghri is because of one of the Noghri recognized her scent and took her there. The only reason the Noghri betrayed Thrawn is because Leia revealed the truth about the droids. The only reason the Noghri even got a whiff of her scent is cause Thrawn sent them after her just to appease a Dark Jedi.

A Dark Jedi whom may no longer be a factor in a Unified Empire's victory over the rebellion. Meaning Thrawn would no longer have a need to send the Noghri after Leia and that chance meeting between her and the one Noghri would never have occured. So the Noghri betrayel may not occure in this scenario.

 

point taken.

Any other thoughts before we switch?

 

I think Thrawn may still have involved C'Baoth in his plans, if just to test his theory about the Force leading to greater coordination between strike forces.

With all the options of a Unified Empire, his patience would have been much smaller, and he may have indeed disposed of the Master before even sending a Noghri task force after Leia.

But I don't concede the Rebellion's defeat, even if Thrawn and Palpatwo joined forces. The Rebels would just need to figure out a way to involve the Ewoks, because everyone knows those little guys pwn3d the Imperials.