Discussion Official Sequel Trilogy / Legends / Expanded Universe discussion thread

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens - Spoilers Allowed' started by YoureNotJonesy, Nov 2, 2012.

  1. Lurknomore Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2014
    star 3


    I think you hit the nail on the head. Isn't the plan to release a movie every year? Episode - Spinoff - Episode - Spinoff - Etc... And that's not even mentioning the new books and other merchandise they're going to be releasing on a regular basis as well. It'll be significantly less than 37 years before the canon universe exceeds the Legends universe in size.

    With $4.5 billion+ dollars to make back, I don't blame Disney for clearing the decks. Every EU novel/game/comic/etc. they canonize is one less slice of space and time they could fill with their own product. The new is naturally going to be more lucrative than the old, especially with tie-in movies coming out every year to stoke up and expand the fan base.

    That's not to say that I resent what they're doing. Even though it's purely a business strategy, the result is that they're going to be pumping more canonical entertainment into the Star Wars fandom at a faster rate than ever before. That's good enough for me. :p
    Last edited by Lurknomore, Apr 28, 2014
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  2. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6

    Well no, Luke wouldn't just be part of the Jedi Council. As of Ep VI, he is the last Jedi in the galaxy. EU or no, when the Order gets rebuilt, it will be rebuilt by Luke. That by default makes him the Grand Master of the Jedi Order.
    Last edited by Chancellor_Ewok, Apr 28, 2014
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  3. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    Isnt Grand Master an EU term? :confused:
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  4. lakhota Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2014
    star 1
    I guess that makes sense because technically leia is not a Jedi, she could have the force in her or the mediclorines thingy . So what you're saying Luke could be the Grand Wizard
  5. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6

    First of all, given the scope of the EU, I think we're going to be seeing a lot of EU terminology simply because we don't know what else to call things, so get used to it. Second, again given the scale of the EU, I would not be at all surprised if the EU became fanon, again simply because there so much of it. Third, this just proves my point. There are going to be people who have no familiarity with Star Wars outside of Ep. VII and don't understand what Star Wars Legends is supposed to mean and are now confronted with two continuities that are totally contradictory. Instead of making things clearer, they're going to be even more confusing.
  6. lakhota Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2014
    star 1
    Yeah it's really hard to not call an apple and Apple, obviously a lot of terms, Captain ranks ,ships and species were created by the Expanded Universe. So making reference to new items seen in the movie similar or the same in the Expanded Universe is going to be difficult unless it just slap a random name on it. It's going to be really hard for the designers and costumers to come up with unique and different variations that have not been written about. Who knows this might make it more difficult for Disney in the long run
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  7. Lurknomore Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2014
    star 3


    Something tells me that when LFL used the words "demand will keep them in print" with regards to Legends, they meant to imply that only Legends products which continue to sell really well will continue to be sold at all. And when the new movies, books, video games, etc. get off the ground, Legends will become less and less in line with the canon universe and sales will drop precipitously.

    Basically, I think the whole "Legends" brand is just a ploy to placate EU fans for a few years until the majority of them have moved on and embraced the new timeline. By then, Legends will most likely all be defunct and no longer sold under any label.

    It's difficult to underestimate the degree to which the new movies will propel the fan base in their direction. As well as the degree to which a lack of new material will render the Legends timeline obsolete.
    Last edited by Lurknomore, Apr 28, 2014
  8. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    ^Fully agreed, I can see much of the EU going print on demand or just a few back copies in wearhouses within a decade.
    My point was there was no need to call him grandmaster or assume after 30 years Leia couldn't be at his level. You put it as a given.

    Yoda was also never refered to as grandmaster in the movies or TCW (to my recollection there anyways), he was always just the oldest and wisest so the others respected his words but Yoda never pulled rank like Luke did in the EU. Yoda was even kinda imprisioned by the rest of the council in the final arc of TCW.

    So back to my point, maybe we should question if this term will carry over or not into VII since their is no reason of current canon material to suspect it will. I get that EU terms will be used, and fully support it, but since this thread deals with the EUs impact on VII I feel we're supposed to question those terms here, no need to be so hostile. ;)
    Last edited by Ryus, Apr 28, 2014
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  9. Beezer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    The prequels have already contradicted quite a bit of the Zahn Trilogy. He wrote about a bunch of things involving the Clone Wars which were thrown out the window, not to mention Yoda going to Dagobah in hot pursuit of some Sith Lord or something like that..... He sounds like he is quite a bit of denial. Probably just trying to keep his books on selling.
  10. JLG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2005

    Lucasfilm/Disney's vision for that time period might be completely different. Lucas's own vision of the ancient Sith was always vastly different than the EU's, to the point that they were forced to retcon his ideas beyond recognition to make it work.

    If they stick with Lucas's version, the Sith were just a couple thousand years old, the founder of the order (the EU's Darth Ruin) and Bane existed at the same time, and Bane took on a male apprentice instead of Zannah. If they stick with this going forward, KOTOR just wouldn't make any sense.
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  11. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Unless they stuck every Sith in the 1000 year Sith War period.
  12. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    What's to say that Darth Ruin and Darth Bane didn't exist at the same time. When Bane turned to the Dark Side and became a Sith Apprentice, the Sith were basically just really dark and warped version of the Jedi Order. It was Bane who reinstituted the Rule of Two after killing off all the other Sith Lords.

    As for the Disney vision of the Star Wars continuity, the pre-Ep. I content all could have been retained, IMHO, because most of it was designed to set up the PT, and the Old Republic content is set so far in the past, that there's more than enough space for Disney/Lucasfilm to insert whatever additional content they want to cook up without affecting the pre-existing material. Same goes for the Han/Lando Adventures and the Han Solo Trilogy.
    Last edited by Chancellor_Ewok, Apr 28, 2014
  13. BigAl6ft6 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    The Han Solo trilogy is tied into Han's origin fairly tightly and a possible Han Solo: Origins spin-off movie could invalidate a lot of that. On the flipside, the Han Solo Adventures by Brian Daley are self-contained Han Solo and Chewie romps during their smuggler years. Unless a Han Solo spin-off covers every single moment of his life right up to him telling Old Ben and Luke "I'm Han Solo, Captain of the Millennium Falcon" at the Cantina, the Solo Adventures trilogy could still fit. A.C. Crispin's Solo origin novels, not so much.
    Last edited by BigAl6ft6, Apr 28, 2014
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  14. Beezer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    Not necessarily. If they want to explore the origins of the Sith, and we have reason to believe that is possible, then they might have to de-canonize The Old Republic.
    Last edited by Beezer, Apr 28, 2014
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  15. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Especially if they make Darth Ruin 2000 years or later before the movies be the first time the Jedi and Sith fought each other.
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  16. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6

    No they don't. What we thought Obi-wan meant when he talked about the Old Republic in Ep. IV and what he actually meant when we finally saw the Republic in its prime in Ep. I turned out to be two totally different things. Besides, the Republic is explicitly stated to be over 20,000 years old and has been reformed at least twice its history, and we actually only know a little of that history anyway, so there's plenty of room for new content without worrying about contradicting the EU content.
  17. thecurseofchris Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 12, 2013
    star 1
    I agree with you. I can remember going to the Star Wars section in the late 90s/early 00s and it was all post-ROTJ books. If you go to bookstores nowadays, it's full of the most recent Star Wars books, as well as the "hits" of the older days (Heir to the Empire, for example). You don't see any of the X-Wing books anymore, or I, Jedi, etc. Eventually, these EU books (especially those who aren't labeled as legends) will become collector's items.
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  18. Beezer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    It really depends on what they have in mind. For example, if they decide that the Sith came into existence 1,500 years ago and were thought to be extinct 1,000 years ago, then that pretty much wipes out all the Old Republic Sith Lords we thought we knew.
    Not anymore...... :D You must unlearn what you have learned, my friend.
  19. Mystery Roach Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2004
    star 4
    I'm guessing he meant by Obi-Wan in ANH (over a thousand generations...).
  20. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    I actually see I, Jedi every time I visit my bookstore... its stuff like New Rebellion or Crystal Star that I don't see. I typically see the first four X-wing novels too, not that later ones featuring Wraith Squadron save the resent one which is kinda a shame since they're funny as can be, I also often see the Hand of Thrawn, Shadows of the Empire. I usually see the first 3 New Jedi Order and Clone Trooper books too. Its rare when I see more than 3 prequal books excluding the movie novelizations or a book with Darth in the title.

    The other series I always with many copies are the series I also often see on major paperback massmarket displays are Heir to the Empire, Jedi Academy, Darth Plagues, Darth Bane, Choices of One, Scoundrels, Kenobi, Revan, Legacy of the Force, and the Fate of the Jedi series. For the most part the bulk of it is just like it was in the late 90's/early 00's all post RotJ stuff with a few set before thrown in (some TOR, the Darth books, prequal novelizations). So yes, recent books are more popular but I do usually see quite a bit of early EU post RotJ greatest hits too at my book store. Mind you books sales are tracked by local market demands so that does explain why you and I see different books where we each live, that said I do see a trend that being the movie novelizations, Darth books, post RotJ greatest hits, and all the latest paperbacks (Solos like Revan and Choices of One, and the latest two series LotF and FotJ)

    I also see a few guide books, the Jedi Order/Sith handbook, Darth Vader and Son + Vaders little Princess, and a few gag Star Wars books like Wookiee Cookies, lightsaber thumb wresteling, and Wookiee/Astrodroid translation soundbooks.

    Comic Wise I always see Legacy, the Ominbus's, Dark Empire, Clone Wars, and the latest stuff.

    Im in a book store at least once a week and I always out of curiousity see what Star Wars stuff they got. All I can speak to is my local market of course. All that said the Star Wars books in my lcal stores since the Disney takeover has shrunk from about a full book bay on average too two shelfs on average but I suspect that's more due to a lack of a new series following Fate of the Jedi and just a few new books beyond that actually making it to print... that should bounce back September when all the fans rush to by the Rebels new book and Christmas when the following one comes out that's part of the new Canon (curiosity will bring the fans back all hoping for hints for VII or at least Disney's direction for the franchise).

    Its after the new Canon books have been out a while that I suspect the old EU books will start seeing declining demand. Followed by them disappearing from most locations, to becoming order online only (or ebook status), a while after the out of print save ebooks format.
    Last edited by Ryus, Apr 28, 2014
  21. Beezer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    Ohhhhhh..... I never took that statement literally.... after all, in E2 Palpatine says "I will not let this Republic that has stood for a thousand years be split in two." So his timeframe is entirely different from Obi-Wan's.

    I always considered both statements simply to be euphemisms meaning "a very long time" and not meant to be taken literally, especially since they contradict each other.
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  22. Mystery Roach Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2004
    star 4
    I don't see it as a contradiction. I take it as meaning that the Republic has stood in a peaceful state for a thousand years, but that the Republic and the Jedi existed for a lot longer before that. There's also the lines about how "the Sith have been extinct for a millennium", "the oppression of the Sith will never return", "once more the Sith will rule the galaxy", and "at last we will have revenge", which lead me to believe that a thousand years prior the Sith had gained control of the galaxy but were defeated by the Jedi, and that the thousand years of peace which followed were what Palpatine was referring to.
    Last edited by Mystery Roach, Apr 28, 2014
  23. Beezer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    I think that is a convoluted contortion at best.

    Eh, it doesn't matter. The Old Republic from the books and games is now history, pun intended. We will just have to wait and see what Disney has planned.
  24. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    No, no, no. KOTOR is just a game lost in the scramble for its own gratifaction. It can be retconed, or not sold anymore. But if it makes itself more than just a game, with fans devoted to its ideal, and if retconning doesn't stop those fans from loving it, then it becomes something else entirely.

    A Legend, Mr. Beezer.

  25. Darth_Downunder Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 5, 2001
    star 5
    That's a very kind interpretation. More likely that it was a good old fashioned continuity error.
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