Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by KED12345, Apr 4, 2013.
I really hope that the Rebels aren't presented as "terrorists" fighting a "benevolent" Empire.
I hope they are in at least one arc.
The entire show shouldn't be done that way but different perspectives are far more interesting than being dictated (pun intended) as an audience which side we're "supposed to" be on.
I mentioned in the other thread the lack of perspective on TCW Separatists as anything other than as electrocution-happy cackling thugs. The one attempt to portray a "good" Separatist was pretty lame, and got turned around later when Bieber started squealing about vengeance.
Rebels needs to do better.
If you haven't already, you might want to check out I.M.P.S. The Relentless. It's a fan made series with very high production quality, acting, effects work et al... oh and it's narrated by Peter Cullen (voice of Optimus Prime). It's told from exactly the POV you describe... it could pretty much be called an imperial propaganda film. It follows the lives of imperial troops and service personnel, and casts the empire as a benevolent, peace-keeping, order-enforcing entity fighting terroristic militants, smugglers, pirates and general assorted scum.
I can't recommend it enough.
Part 2 was split into 3 pieces on youtube for some reason:
Part 3 isn't out yet. It's slow going and usually takes 2 or 3 years per release. Part 3 was supposed to be out at some point in 2013 though I don't know if it's still on schedule. We'll see.
There may be people (clones included) in the Empire who mean well, but the fact is that the Empire is a malevolent dictatorship that's eager to fire upon unarmed protestors.
Well, yeah. But if all the characters saw them that way, Palpatine would have never accumulated as much power as he did, and the Alliance wouldn't have taken 20 years to form well enough to win a major battle.
What about all those Senators who cheered when Palpatine declared himself Emperor? What were they thinking? I'm interested in their perspectives on this, not just a story in which the good guys wear white (or brown), the bad guys wear black (or armor), the end.
I wasn't disputing that. Just pointing out the existence of IMPS when you reminded me of it, by talking about the Empire being depicted in a good light.
It should be noted that quite a lot of the Alliance's best men are former Imperial military. Including Han Solo (though admittedly he didn't defect directly from the Empire to the Alliance, but he ended up with them eventually). Once-loyal Imperial servicemen who became disgusted with the oppression and atrocities they were being told to be part of, and defected.
I have no problem with characters who incorrectly believe the Empire to be good.
If you ever played TIE Fighter you have to deal with at least two admirals who are defecting to the Rebellion. One of them was honorable, disgusted by the empire. The other was only after the money. Zaarin and Harkov. You get Zaarin after being put under Thrawn's command, his ship gets blown up and he is killed. Harkov gets captured and hauled in front of Vader, whereupon this happens:
In the OT, the clones seem to have become just like the battle droids they once fought against. I wonder if Rebels will reflect that.
Since you watch a lot of anime, do you know of many that do a good job focusing on the villains, like western cartoons like TCW and Transformers Prime do?
Tarkin was a moustache-twirling villain in ANH.
My personal favorite anime of all time is Legend of Galactic Heroes, a story in which who exactly the "good guy" and the "bad guy"are will depend heavily on your own personal philosophy of life. An argument could be made either way.
Nadia: Secret of Blue Water is some classic Gainax that gets you close to the villain Miss Grandis.
Rozen Maiden does a lot of that. And also Red Garden, which is fascinating for other reasons (it's set entirely in New York, and it's interesting to see what the Japanese think that being an American teenager is like). Tiger and Bunny, too - which is just a great show on anywayl.
On the more comedic side, there's Astro Fighter Sunred.
LoGH is one of the best written space operas in existence, truly deserves a mention.
Though let it be said that the show does truly have some despicable villians, they're just not quite as obvious to everyone in universe at the time... their motivations are either well explained enough, or suitably ambiguous. I highly suggest the show to any fan who can enjoy massive fleet battles, older anime, and a long series with a lot of well developed narration and exposition.
Though Rebels will be an entirely different beast, I suspect... but still, I have no doubt we'll see the Empire from multiple views, just as Filoni 'finally' addressed the issue of the populous developing anti-Jedi sentiments late in the war in TCW's final arcs.
Yeah, it would probably be best to borrow a line from George Lucas and say that in LoGH there are heroes on both sides - and villains on both sides. Which side on balance is the "good guy" and which is the "bad guy" is something that will depend on how you see the world.
Even among the characters themselves - sometimes the "heroes" do dishonorable things, sometimes characters who start off as morally questionable rise to the occasion and become better people, sometimes your heart breaks as you watch characters you like make terrible mistakes, sometimes it's hard to tell the difference between "evil" and "ruthless in fighting for a good cause"... the show can get very morally complex.
Ah, thank you. Nadia is one of my all-time favorite anime series like EVER. And indeed it does a great job in focusing on the villians, but not just with Grandis, Hanson and Sanson. The whole empire run by Gargoyle is show perfectly: operating in secret, describing their interntions of world domination, their origin story, how their society is working and built up, how their superweapon, the Tower of Babel operates and everything. The contrast to the actual "good side" is amazing.
Fushigi Yuugi also does a terrific job with the portrayal of the enemy side, the Seiryuu warriors.
The only anime I like is Outlaw Star, but this Legend of Galactic Heroes show sounds pretty cool.
As much as I love it, I have to say that LoGH isn't for everybody. As Carl Horn once put it: "Just because it's long and boring doesn't mean it isn't good". It does have stretches of being boring, slow-paced, convoluted, and overly complex. But if you stick with it, it can be very rewarding.
If you want something that moves at a TCW pace, LoGH might not be your thing. The closest western scifi show I'd compare it to would be Babylon 5, which could also be slow and complex, and wasn't for everybody.
Considering the marketing potential, I'm surprised they didn't make a show about the big 3 in between the OT movies.
On another note, since the TCW Order 66 preview has flying Super Battle Droids, perhaps Rebels will have flying Stormtroopers.
Things were different back in the 70s and 80s. Thy couldn't have done the kind of high-quality, serious storytelling we saw in TCW (at least when it was at its best).
Let's not forget how things turned out when they tried making an animated series out of another popular action franchise of the era:
TCW already had flying clone troopers, on several occasions. Flying stormtroopers are almost inevitable at some point.
I meant taking place in between the OT movies. I didn't mean from 1977-1983.
Thanks for the recommendations, after watching the trailers for them Tiger and Bunny and Astro Fighter Sunred seems like the ones that I would like the most since they seem to have more of a sci fi/ fantasy setting than the others.
It seems to me that anime tends to better than western cartoons in terms of having the villains win more and being less predictable. I'm looking for animes that have alien/monster characters not just humans.
T minus approximately three hours until an amazing... 15 seconds.... of Rebels. Well at least it's something. I'm predicting a logo and "coming Fall 2014", some John Williams, a Ghost flyby, a TIE flyby, a Stormtrooper... and at least one shot of the main heroes.
Thanks for the reminder. I really hope I don't have to burn my TV tonight.
I doubt there will be enough content to set off any alarms.