Clone Wars Official "The Clone Wars" Series Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by RevantheJediMaster, Jul 15, 2005.

  1. Darth Valkyrus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2013
    star 4
    What's the red faced guy on the left?
  2. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    Perhaps it is a Zeltron. Sorry I posted in a Clone Wars thread; I was just following the previous poster.
  3. credar Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 18, 2011
    star 3
    Quick question, what episodes have extended cuts? I was going to start rewatching the series and I want to see the "full" episodes.
  4. Darth Valkyrus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2013
    star 4
    I'm wondering which episodes have Anakin Force-choking someone.

    I know he choked Poggle in Brain Invaders, he choked the Zygerrian queen, he choked an Ithorian barkeep on Nal Hutta during the Deception arc, he choked Ventress in TWJ, but I can't think of any others. Am I missing any?
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  5. ColemanKcajFTW Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 14, 2014
    star 1
    Well it's technically not a Force-choke, but he does throttle Dooku during their second duel of Naboo. Oh, and we see him Force-choking Clovis in Padme's apartment in one of the S5 trailers. Other then that, I think you're good.
    Last edited by ColemanKcajFTW, Jan 30, 2014
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  6. Embomania Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2013
    star 1
    Force-choke sounds like the new rape. Just sayin'.
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  7. Darth Valkyrus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2013
    star 4
    Basically I want to put together a video of all his chokings in order. From Poggle right through Needa. Or JerJerrod for that matter, if I can find that clip somewhere.
  8. 07jonesj Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2010
    star 4
    This is the list of episodes with extended cuts on the DVD/Blu-Rays.

    1.2: Rising Malevolence
    1.3: Shadow of Malevolence
    1.5: Rookies
    1.10: Lair of Grievous
    1.19: Storm Over Ryloth
    1.20: Innocents of Ryloth
    1.21: Liberty on Ryloth
    4.10: Carnage of Krell
    4.13: Escape from Kadavo
    4.19: Massacre
    4.20: Bounty
    5.14: Eminence
    5.15: Shades of Reason
    Last edited by 07jonesj, Jan 30, 2014
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  9. Embomania Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2013
    star 1

    I don't think his choke victims would want to relive that experience. They're just now accepting that they can live a normal life after being force-choked. This just has "bad idea" written all over it.
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  10. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    Make sure you play the Imperial March throughout.

    It's the best absolute indicator that choking is bad, mmmmkay?
  11. Contessa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2013
    star 2
    No.

    Stop.
  12. Watto Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 13, 1998
    star 4
    @credar just to set expectations, almost all of these are indistinguishable from the original versions. There are no extra scenes, just extra snippets that were cut for violence. Microseconds really.
  13. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    Ventress kissing the clone before killing him is worth watching.
  14. ColemanKcajFTW Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 14, 2014
    star 1
    Or just meaningless stupid dialogue for the droids.
  15. Mia Mesharad Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Having recently gotten my hands on The Bounty Hunter Code: From the Files of Boba Fett and having found that there was a not insignificant amount of TCW-related content in the book, I figured I would share some of what stuck out to me for anyone interested.

    [IMG]
    The Box, from the eponymous Season 4 episode and the "Bounty Hunter" story arc, is shown to have been acquired by the Bounty Hunters' Guild, used to test and train new recruits from the Guildhouse on Serenno.
    Quoted Text (open)
    "Sure, some Guild initiations are as tough as you've heard. The Box is no rumor. It's a sealed cubic arena at the Guildhouse on Serenno, built by the psychotic Phindian inventor Moralo Eval during the Clone Wars. It's been chewing up rookie hunters ever since.

    What they like to do on Serenno is toss a half-dozen fresh-meat hopefuls into the Box at the same time, with a guaranteed membership to the first to crawl back out. What's in there? Whatever the programmers cook up. The Box is a challenge simulator made of shifting panels, and behind those panels is lots and lots of pain in one form or another.

    I'm not saying you'll die inside the Box. Of course, I'm not saying you won't, either. All I know is that on my last run out that way, the resupply crates stacked next to the maintenance hatch were labeled 'DIOXIS GAS,' 'INCENDIARY PROPELLANT,' and 'INDUSTRIAL CUTTING LASERS'."

    By 4 ABY―the same year Return of the Jedi takes place―Boba Fett notes that "The Box is mobile at last report. Bwahl the Hutt has got it on a tour of kajidic strongholds, torturing enemies for entertainment."

    [IMG]
    The ever-quirky Doctor Nuvo Vindi is shown to be a bit more dangerous than his somewhat goofy appearances back in Season 1 would have you believe. "There's a story that Dr. Nuvo Vindi gassed every agency on Ord Marsax the day after the Republic upped the bounty on his head to 250,000 credits." He also evaded more than a dozen bounty hunters attempting to capture him, leading them on quite the chase. Unfortunately, there's no telling whether this took place before his TCW appearance, or if the crazy doctor escaped Republic custody later on.

    The typically polarizing Ziro the Hutt has some page time devoted to him, mostly in a cautionary fashion.
    Quoted Text (open)
    "Because a good chunk of [underworld bounties] are posted by the clan leaders of Nal Hutta, a "crime" can be anything that made a Hutt cranky. A chef who put too many fleek eels in the pudding, for example. An animal wrangler for the dungeon menagerie who was on duty when the nos monster died of old age.

    I remember one singer, 20,000 on his head, and all he did was mispronounce the Huttese grantu chato ("wonderous one") as grantu choto ("wonderous runt"). Sure I felt bad when turned him over to Ziro's goons, and I sighed a little when I saw them toss him out the window of Ziro's 700th-floor penthouse. But a smart hunter goes where the credits are."

    Apparently, Bossk also worked for the guy on a job or two, though he was a bit more stingy with the payouts than Jabba.

    [IMG]
    So, anybody remember that Lux Bonteri's fancy holotrace device from A Friend in Need? Well, Jason Fry and the other authors did. I don't know what it means for Lux's fate, but it seems that his holotracer ended up in the Bounty Hunter Guild's possession by the end of the Clone Wars.
    Quoted Text (open)
    "In the Guild's data vault on Fusai there's supposedly a holotracer that can track any HoloNet transmission back to its source. I didn't believe it at first, because encrypted comm transmissions that come from military, government, and underworld sources are masked with S-thread dupes and message noise. But they say a blackmailed Gree built the holotracer for the Japrael sector Separatists back during the Clone Wars, and that the Guild got it from Legate Lux Bonteri before the war's end."


    [IMG]
    Fans of the Season 4 episode Bounty may be amused to know that the episode's Kage Warriors are held up as an example worth emulating when it comes to learning how to board a moving hovertrain.
    Quoted Text (open)
    "On worlds with high-pressure atmospheres, like Quarzite, the locals move all crossplanet shipping with a network of subtrams running through vast subcrustal caverns. The Kage Warriors of Quarzite have their own techniques for raiding these transports, which should come in handy for any hunter needing to board a hovertrain:
    * Match speed with the hovertrain, and come up alongside the joining of two train cars. The Kage Warriors use native mounts called milodons, but you can get the same effect with a speeder bike."

    Dengar isn't all that amused by the instructor's writings, and in his own annotations, mentions that "She makes jumping a hovertrain sound easy. Maybe she should try it while under attack by Kage Warriors."

    Sadly, it seems that the Republic's BARC speeder bikes, used by many a clone soldier and Jedi General, fall out of fashion once the Clone Wars end. By the time of the Original Trilogy, unused spare parts are plentiful, and a credit-pinching citizen of the galaxy could assemble their own for next to nothing. Also, under the Empire, the Zygerians from Season 4's Slaves of the Republic arc make a significant comeback. Controlling the Slaver Syndicate, they become heavily involved in the Imperial-era slaving operations on Ryloth and Mandalore, among others. They steer clear of Kashyyyk though, since Wookiee slaves are the Trandoshans' turf.

    [IMG]
    "Because we were willing to die for our cause, we became the Death Watch, led by the Secret Mandalores. To ensure we would be led by the most powerful, we decreed that any warrior could challenge the Secret Mandalore for leadership of Death Watch. And as our symbol of authority we chose the Darksaber, an ancient weapon liberated from the Jedi long ago."

    The second part of The Bounty Hunter Code comes in the form of a Death Watch manifesto―Ba'jurne Kyr'tsad Mando'ad―written by the terrorist sect's founder, Tor Vizsla. Right off the bat, though, there's some in-universe suspicion that Tor may not have been the Vizsla who wrote it at all, put in actuality Pre. "I wonder if Vizsla really wrote this," writes Jango Fett, leaving notes in the copy he's left for Boba, "He was a thug. Sounds more like Priest, or Reau. Maybe the younger Vizsla. That one likes speeches." There was plenty to say about the New Mandalorians, though as it's from Death Watch's POV, none of it is good. Some history and background of each faction is there, but nothing that The Essential Guide to Warfare and Shadow Conspiracy haven't already covered, minus the now present slant of Tor Vizsla's prejudice.

    Following up on Pre Vizsla's sentiments from Season 5's episode Eminence, we see that hardliners like Death Watch have deemed themselves the Aka'liit―the "Mandalorian Faithful"―opposing the "Faithless" New Mandalorians. We also get some good callbacks and connections between TCW, Knights of the Old Republic, and Republic Commando, as Vizsla notes: "The divisions between the Faithful and the Faithless split every clan: members of the Ordos, Fetts, Kryzes, Awauds, Priests, Gedycs, and, yes, Vizslas, belonged to both sides in our struggle." Of Satine and Clan Kryze, he adds: "One of my kinswomen, the Duchess Satine Kryze, had been sent offworld as a child by her father, a mighty clan warlord, and she fell prey to the lies of the Jedi. After her father perished in the Great Clan Wars, she betrayed his memory by becoming the leader of the New Mandalorians. Aided by Jedi tricks, she became the newest Anti-Mandalore..."

    All the while we have notations by Jango calling out Vizsla's lies and the distortions he attempts to pass off as history, and Boba putting down a few notations of is own as an older man planning to pass along the book to his own daughter, Ailyn. Hondo Ohnaka got a chance to put down some of his thoughts as well, and delightfully in-character, he hilariously cuts down Vizsla's antiquated ideals and belief in an honorable death at every chance, leaving notes for Boba that it's better to get rich, get drunk, enjoy yourself, and live to an old age than die for some dumb idea. He does, however, continue to note his lasting respect for Jango. Aurra Sing didn't pass up her own chance to put in her two credits, dryly mocking Vizsla and Mandalorian culture, while openly considering selling the manifesto out from under Boba, musing that Satine might pay well for information on her enemies.

    [IMG]
    The last part of the package comes in the form of the separate memoirs of Cradossk, leader of the Bounty Hunters' Guild during the Imperial era, and father of Bossk...though not a proud father. The memoirs―entitled Making a Killing―were originally dedicated to Bossk, but the dedicated was crossed out and replaced with "For Boba Fett. I WISH you were my son." Needless to say, they have some issues. There's a good bit of TCW-content peppered throughout the old Trandoshan's history, including the fact that when he was young, he took his own father-son trip to Wasskah, the Trandoshan moon featured in the two-part finale to Season 3. Cradossk knew of Rako Hardeen, and recounts hearing about Obi-Wan's impersonation of the hunter from Season 4's "Bounty Hunter" arc, and notes that although Sinrich's holoshroud device is cool, it's massive power needs and inopportune flickering make it worthless to him and the Guild.

    Cad Bane gets mentioned, as Cradossk recounts Bane swooping in on Bounty Hunter Guild contracts posted by Hutt lords during his early career as an independent bounty hunter. They met once, and Cradossk offered him entry into the Guild, but Bane declined. Cradossk doesn't get into it, but Boba's notes indicate during their prison stay, Bane told him that Cradossk had attempted to trap and kill him, but Bane escaped, yet made no move to kill Cradossk for undisclosed "professional reasons"...whatever those were. Cradossk also briefly mentions some of the other bounty hunters from TCW, notably most being the ones Bane worked with like Cato Parasitti, Robonino, the Weequay Shahan Alama―whom he calls a "nasty piece of work"―and Todo-360. He's not exactly a fan of Bane's, as the Duros hunter tended to regard his partners as expendable, something Guild hunters are thought to be above doing as a group of true professionals.
    Last edited by Mia Mesharad, Jan 31, 2014
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  16. Todd the Jedi Mod and Inquisitor of SWTV

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Oct 16, 2008
    star 5
    Thanks for going through all of that, Mia. Great stuff on The Box. And yay! Any new information on the good doctor Nuvo Vindi is always welcome. :D
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  17. Circular Logic SWTV Interview Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2013
    star 4
    Yep, excellent info!

    This serves to reinforce the idea that Nuvo Vindi, despite his goofy disposition, was actually quite the Genocidal Maniac, and a fearsome opponent to even the multitude of bounty hunters sent after him.

    The info about the Darksaber is most intriguing, and confirms that in the following picture from TBHC (via Mark McHaley's art) that Tor Vizsla held the Darksaber at one point, before it was passed onto Pre Vizsla:
    [IMG]

    I love the Hondo annotations! There is some truth to his words, and I'm sure Boba took those to heart later in life:
    [IMG]

    Oooh, what a burrrrnnnn for poor Bossk from his own father! Could that have contributed to some professional jealousy, or did Boba and Bossk remain good friends throughout?
  18. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    Cradossk has become an increasingly complex character over the years. It would be neat to see him in Rebels, especially juxtaposed with Bossk.

    [face_laugh] That completely aligns with Tor's personality in the comics -- "Great guys, we just won us a planet! Let's go get drinks and pick our next target." Pre's TCW Mandalores were a regimented army by comparison.

    Out of curiosity, was Cato Parasitti's fate mentioned? She seemed like something of a loose end in TCW. Then again, I suppose that could be said for every character who ended up in jail...
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  19. Revanfan1 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2013
    star 6
    I found it hilarious that Boba decides that Vizsla couldn't have written it. :D

    Also...so Satine and Bo-Katan were originally Death Watch, and Satine "betrayed" them? I figured it was the other way around–Satine's family were always New Mandalorians, and Bo-Katan joined DW on her own. Interesting to see the truth come out.
    Mia Mesharad likes this.
  20. cwustudent Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2011
    star 4

    When he was Governor of Concordia, was Vizsla pretending to be a New Mandalorian?
    Interesting about Satine.
  21. Mia Mesharad Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Yeah, the authorial voice of the manifesto is much more articulate than what you'd expect from Tor via Open Seasons, so it seems very right that someone who actually knew him is calling BS on the whole thing. The connection with Pre is a pretty good one under the circumstances of the manifesto, written after both the Mando Civil War and Great Clan Wars have already ended, at a point when Death Watch's armor and organization is starting to take the shape of what's seen in TCW, when it seems logical that Pre would've really started to get involved. I'd wager that if he wasn't outright ghost writing it, he was definitely coaching Tor.

    No, unfortunately not. She doesn't get much of a mention beyond being another name Cradossk uses to condemn Cad Bane's poor treatment of his supposed allies.

    Clan Kryze was, like many clans at the time leading up to the Great Clan Wars, divided in its loyalties between the New Mandalorians and the warrior clans. When the Clan Wars began, though, the clan's chieftain―Satine's dad, possibly Bo-Katan's too―was definitely on the side of the warrior clans, though which side he stood on in the New Mandalorian/Death Watch ideological schism is unknown. He did, however, send Satine off world to Coruscant to shield her from the fighting, leading her to eventually return with Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, and join the New Mandalorians. For what it's worth, Vizsla considers it a betrayal of what her father would want...but then he would think that regardless, wouldn't he? And as you know, Bo-Katan took the opposite path, staying with the warrior clans and eventually falling in with Death Watch for a time.

    Yes. After suffering severe losses in the back-to-back conflicts of the Mandalorian Civil War and the Great Clan Wars, followed by the subsequent hunt-and-dismantle operations Jango conducted that ended with the death of their first leader Tor Vizsla, Death Watch became a much quieter, much more underground sect. They placed a much greater importance on stealth and infiltration, needing prominent players in well respected positions to gather intel, direct investigations away from their activities, look out for potential sympathizers to recruit, and acquire resources.

    There were, however, numerous members of Clan Vizsla who legitimately did support the New Mandalorians. Just not Pre or Tor.
    Last edited by Mia Mesharad, Feb 1, 2014
  22. Revanfan1 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2013
    star 6
    I really want this book. I mean, really. Literally the only downside of it all is that it doesn't say what happens to Bo after The Lawless. :cool:
  23. Circular Logic SWTV Interview Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2013
    star 4
    I believe Vizsla felt a sort of kinship with Satine's father, who was chieftain of Clan Kryze. I'm not sure if Satine's father was a member of Death Watch, but as Mia's quote indicates, each clan was split up into several different loyalties: True Mandalorians (the warrior clans of Keldabe), Death Watch, and the New Mandalorians. I'm sure Mia can elaborate on this further. To that end...

    Clan Vizsla had members from each side. I wouldn't be surprised if Pre Vizsla publicly referred to himself as one of the New Mandalorians, publicly separating himself from the Death Watch allegiances of Tor, while privately acting as the Secret Mandalore of Death Watch and seeking ways to undermine Satine's leadership.

    Edit: Ninja'd! LOL
    Last edited by Circular Logic, Feb 1, 2014
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  24. vong333 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2003
    star 4
    well, it looks like the clone wars were snuffed again at the Annie's. No annie awards for the show.
  25. Contessa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2013
    star 2
    Aaaand...book bought.

    Amazing post, Mia. Really great of you to post all that.
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