Full Series Official "The Clone Wars" Series Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Which established bad guys died? other then the ones I mentioned?

 

Well you had given a pretty specific definition of what it means to be an "established" character; which was ironic considering unlike TCW, there really are no arcs at all in Rebels. There were plenty of characters in TCW that many would consider are "established" that died over a span of at least an entire arc of episodes. This video certainly does a better job of showing some pretty familiar characters in the series meeting their demise.



Edit: This video has a few more not shown in the other (can't forget about Steela).

 

Savage Opress they marketed quite a bit in various media, I think his death is different than the rest who are more throwaway characters. He was a big hit, they killed him off prematurely like they did Ventress.

 

Okay so let's count established characters as people who have appeared in 5 episodes. That leaves us with only a few in Rebels Tua, Grand, Fifth and 7th sister that's it while the clone wars has
Savage, Pre, Satine, Fives, Asajj and I am being generous with the last one since she died in a book.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that Rebels might outdo TCW by the end of this season

 

Talzin died, an no-one can say she wasn't a major antagonist.

Plus, technically, all the Jedi died, just no in the show itself.

 

There aren't that many established characters in Rebels to make that kind of impact. I highly doubt they'd kill off a significant member of the Ghost Crew. If anything, maybe they'd kill off

Spoiler

Callus

, of whom is borderline significant even if it's an established character.

 

I think the problem is not them being established, is them being mostly antagonists in the story. The emotional disconnect is greater. Tua was not an antagonist, but still, a last minute defector which death was treated like "blink and you miss it".
The TCW characters in that list are a mix of good guys, bad guys and anti-heroes, and most of them were treated as more or less protagonists in their own stories when they died. So that made it more impactful.

 

I would single out Ventress, Talzin and Savage as particular loses since they appeared in lengthy screen time sequences and were somewhat developed, story and character wise. Most of the characters they killed off were created specifically for the toon, often to be killed off, or obscure characters from the movies/EU that were also expendable assets for much the same reason. But they at least took some time to eventually "kill them off" as its not a complete devaluing of their characters as we often got in the films.

 

I agree since only one good character has died on rebels who has not a bad guy. It was back in a inside man.

 

Rebels could have had more deaths on the good guy side if we followed various (though still chronological) Rebel cells instead of just the Ghost Crew.

 

When did Ventress die? I actually just rewatched the entire Clone Wars recently, online, had nothing else to do, and plus had previously missed many episodes when saw it on TV. Her last episode I remember her in was in late Season 5, episode 19, when she is attacked by Barriss Offee, who went bad or whatever, who disarmed her, took her light saber and mask, and impersonated her to go after Ahsoka. But Ventress didn't die though. Anakin later caught and questioned her, and also let her go without killing her.

When did she die? Was it in "Rebels"? Because I am only starting to watch that one.

 

In the Dark Disciple novel.

 

SergeyX2017 Dark deciples is worth the read for a clone wars fan, but it's not a very good novel IMO.

 

I would have no problem if better canonized version came about in animation.

 

My kids and I are watching TCW together and we got to the Mortis episodes last night. I loved it! It was super weird and leaves things up for interpretation. Also, my kids are super pumped about the build up for Maul's return.

 

Did they already know that he would return before watching the show?

 

Happy Birthday to...



...Genndy Tartakovsky, producer/director of the other "Clone Wars" series.

(Sorry, I wasn't sure of where else to post this.)

 

It's weird, but probably a little of yes and no. They're six and almost 4 so they know what happens to Maul in episode 1, but they've seen toys for clone wars and rebels so they get that he's still around. The older one grasps the concept of how they're episode films and then other eras can get explored along the timeline, but for the younger one that's a little over his head right now. We are all just waiting now to see how Maul makes his return, that's the part that's getting us pumped up.

 

Thanks; I'd missed that thread.

 

I noticed something when watching Sphere of Influence:


The Neimoidian guard helmet seems to be very reminiscent of Vader's helmet, much more so than the helmets seen in ROTS.

Was this intentional, to create a link between the 2 helmets?

 

No, it's intentional because that's how the Neimoidian's helmets are in the movies.

Although back when AotC was released, some people assumed Vader was on the Geonosis hangar because of the unintentional similarity. It was always a mere background Neimoidian.

 

But the helmet from the films is much shorter:


The rim is less pronounced. I suppose it could be chalked up to TCW's exaggerated art style though.

 

I got the Rogue One visual guide today and I once again started thinking how weird politics of Onderon-operation was in TCW. Visual guide like episodes back then talk about Republic not being openly wage war against CIS on Onderon so they secretly supported Gerrera's rebel group. This is still very weird claim in the larger context of the Clone War that was an open conflict between the Republic and the CIS and Republic was very able to attack Geonosis and Umbara for example (and even considered attacking Mandalore) while their population openly supported CIS. They were also able to help Mon Calamari in their conflict with Quarren. Why they couldn't similarly openly support rebels on Onderon and claim Rash is usurper and puppet what he was.

Was it because King Dendup making some treaty with the republic, Onderon having some special status and unlike other CIS-worlds not in the war with the Republic or whatever this was not explained in the episodes- not in the canon guides in a way that would make perfect sense to me. Why Republic would have any need to accept King Rash any more than self-acclaimed Emir of Ryloth Wat Tambor for example? Because he was democratically elected leader seems not to be enough reason since Republic is at war with CIS that seems to be sort of democracy as well at least it claims to be one (surely it is conspiracy more than actual state though).

It seems to me that writers of the show somehow forgot that it was not the cold war but a very hot one in what TCW's Onderon-episodes took place. Waging open war is not possible in a cold war (like in Afghanistan in which Onderon is probably based on)but in the Clone Wars they were at open war so difficulty to attack Onderon which was part of the enemy shouldn't have been there purely because political reasons. Releasing the population from the CIS occupation like on Christophsis or on Ryloth should've been possible on Onderon as well. On Umbara it seemed that majority of population was on CIS-side but it was no reason not to attack the planet.

Am I just stupid or do anyone else recognize this as an oddity in The Clone Wars -show? I would like to hear Dave Filoni or Pablo Hidalgo answer this question in a way that difference between Onderon and other CIS worlds attacked openly by the clone army clearer.

After all I think TCW didn't show enough of these battles, strategies and the war itself and focused too much on other stuff like R2 and 3po adventures, jedi mysteries, witches and bounty hunters etc. How Republic planned to end the war?- What CIS- supporters planned to do -how to defeat the Republic and what then? How did jedi beliefs affect the way jedi generals made decisions what planets to defend and where to attack- how did non-jedi officers like Tarkin raise in the ranks and how they would have done things differently etc.- these are interesting questions left mainly unanswered in episodes.

 

I think the implication was that Onderon was a heavily Separatist world, and thus a Republic invasion would have been both difficult and resisted by the populace. Therefore, the Jedi trained the rebels to gain support with the people, so that they could convince them to support the Republic by the end.