*OFFICIAL THREAD* The Obi-Wan / Anakin Duel

I just saw a clip from the ROTS dvd where NG basically says that the only difference between Obi-Wan's power of 8 and Anakin's power of 9 is the dark side. He said that Obi-Wan and Anakin are basically the same kind of fighters because they come from the same line (Yoda-Dooku-Qui-Gon). He said they are BOTH aggresive in their fighting (as opposed to the thinking that Obi-Wan was on the defensive the entire time). He talked as if they were pretty evenly matched (while some people seem to act like Anakin is a lot more powerful than Obi-Wan).

Do you have the exact quote from Gillard regarding this? Did he mean that before Anakin turned to the dark side he was a level 8, and after he turned he was a level 9? Could this mean when he was fighting Dooku in the beginning he was only fighting at level 8, and after he gave into his anger when Obi-Wan was knocked out he started fighting at level 9? In the article "Dueling Jedi" from the OS, Gillard said: "Obi-Wan is at a level 8, which is where Anakin starts. But Anakin jumps to level 9 -- and the difference between 8 and 9 is enormous. A Jedi can get to level 9, but that's the difference between light and dark. The duel actually gives you quite an idea about these characters, because Anakin has learned the fighting, he's enormously talented -- but he hasn't learned the mental side of it." I also remember Gillard saying that it its risky to get to level 9 when you're as young as Anakin because the temptation is there and it can go either way- and the dark side is not the way to go.

 

It's just as I always suspected then, and maintained on the forums.

People freak out about a 9 but almost dismiss an 8.


My point has always been, when you become THAT powerful, 7,8, and 9, the difference becomes FAR less than say an 8 and a 4.

That's why all of these ridiculous assertions people make that Sidious would "destroy" Obi-Wan, or "Anakin had his way with Obi-Wan" etc etc is rubbish. ALL of the heavy hitters in the films, are close enough in power and skill to where no one truly "owned" or "destroyed" anyone. That's ridiculous to suggest that.

Obi-Wan ,Yoda, and Mace represented the very best the lightside has ever produced.

 

While power alone may not determine the outcome of a fight, it is still very important to it. As I said in my previous post, if your more powerful than your opponent and your focused on the task at hand you usually come out the victor. That's not saying that an 8 would automatically lose to a 9, but it definitely is an important factor to the fight.

 

Yeah the duel should be redone as long as it's not obvious it doesn't fit (like when Han steps on jabba's tell. God help us! Another "let's remind 'em we have CGI before they forget" move)

Cuz let's face it, you can spew the # system all you want to with these guys, they looked like a 2 and a 3 in ANH.

Technology is a wonderful thing. Use it where you can, but don't abuse it and make it out of place. If it can be bettered, i'm all for it.

 

This is slightly off topic, but still deals with Obi v. Anakin, I know what the lyrics mean in English "Grievous are the crimes of the Empire" but for the life of me I can't find the Sanskrit translation, and I've tried a handful of google searches. Anyone know?

I'm absoulutely fascinated by language.

 

I think personally that though people accuse me of personal bias and overestimating Obi-Wan Kenobi, I believe it is quite the contrary in that people underestimate Obi-Wan.

Obi-Wan consistently doesn't tolerate or put up with all that Hyped Sith Bull****. He is the perpetual force for good, and the hero of the saga that transistions to Luke, whereas Anakin is the anti-hero.
He faces opponents without fear despite the odds being occasionally stacked against him.
The story itself may be about Anakin, but Obi-Wan always drives the story forward, certainly in the Prequels.
He talks trash to all of the villians and is just generally fun to watch and a good hero archetype.
I think people diss on Obi-Wan because he isn't flashy or "cool."
He is a very reserved, stoic character. He doesn't adopt a badazz persona such as a Maul, or evil Anakin, he simply quietly gets the job done whatever it may be, sacrificing the glory.
People always google eye the bad characters or the Sith, because they have presence and intimidate. But all along there is Obi-Wan simply doing what he does, and at the end of ROTS comes out the ONLY hero to have a victory in a film where the bad guys COMPLETELY and utterly win.

You know Obi-Wan is a badazz when he refers to his OWN name later on in ANH with reverance and awe LOL!

"Obi-Wan Kenobi.....Obi-Wan, now that's a name I've not heard in a LONG time, a long time."

 

Yeah Obi-Wan took a victory....but IMO so did Mace before Anakin betrayed him.
I think between Kenobi and Windu the Jedi showed they were very powerful and more than capable of destroying the Sith Menace.....if only they didn't have to fight the War on dual fronts defending against former Jedi in Dooku and then Anakin.

I think Kenobi is the perfect mix of spirituality and power......
I'd also put Yoda and Mace in that mix, but because of OT bias I feel Kenobi embodies the essense of the Jedi spirit attainable by a normal moral person with a good heart.
I think it takes more than that to reach Mace and Yoda's level.

 

Obi-Wan is the man. He has the best lines in the saga. The simple "I don't think so" with Dooku in AOTC in his somwhat pompous British accent is just fantastic. And the overly selfconfident (or something) "sith is our speciality" in ROTS is equally cool. He looses both times, but what the heck.

I also feel that OBW is generally underestimated. In the Griveous fight we see how good he is with a lightsaber. He is almost laughing at the efforts of Griveous, even though he knows that Griveous was a feared Jedi killer (look at OBW grin in that scene, amazing). I don't think OBW would have done that hadn't he been sure of his powers as a Jedi.

The fact that Yoda tells OBW that he can never become strong enough to defeat the Emperor, it just shows us how powerful Yoda and Mace are, and that really Anakin isn't all that. If he was, he would easily beat OBW - the emperor sure would. I would claim that OBW throughout the PT's show himself superiour to Anakin, not so much in saber techniques and so forth, but in wisdom and alternative solutions.

OBW's strengt and wisdom was just too much for the reckless Anakin!!

 

The fact that Yoda tells OBW that he can never become strong enough to defeat the Emperor, it just shows us how powerful Yoda and Mace are, and that really Anakin isn't all that. If he was, he would easily beat OBW - the emperor sure would. I would claim that OBW throughout the PT's show himself superiour to Anakin, not so much in saber techniques and so forth, but in wisdom and alternative solutions.

Well technically Anakin never loses to Obi-Wan, Darth Vader does. I'm sure you were talking about both of them in your post, and it is easier to call the guy in the suit Vader, but I just wanted to clarify that Anakin Skywalker died in Palpatine's office.

So you honestly think that because Anakin lost to Obi-Wan it proves Obi-Wan is better?

"Obi-Wan of course defeats Anakin in Ep3, but winning one fight does not necessarily make one the best at it." - Nick Gillard

I think I posted this in my last two posts but I'll say it again, Anakin lost it mentally when he saw Obi-Wan come from Padme's ship. His anger clouded his vision and he couldn't think straight anymore. Obi-Wan recognized this ofcourse but that doesn't make him a better. Also don't forget that Obi-Wan TRAINED Anakin and he knew his fighting style and skills better than anyone else. It is said in the Making Of Revenge book that this made it possible for Obi-Wan to survive as long as he did. The book mentiones Anakin as the most powerful Jedi TWICE. Obi-Wan may have been better on this day given the circumstances, but that doesn't make him better all the time.

 

well anakin is a little better of a fighter but obi has been fighting longer and more duels
but i think it was one of the best duels in star wars history

 

personally i think most of the people that thought the duel of fates from tpm was better was cuz of that over played song. the duel was incredible, wish it were longer tho

 

yeah

 

Even Sidious said Obi faught Anakin at the only time he was vunerable.Which was on mustaphar. Sidious used the discreption, " He was between two worlds."

 

Sorry if this question's been asked before, but why did Anakin jump right next to Obi-Wan when he could have jumped a good distance away from him and not gotten sliced?

 

Because at the time of The Duel, Anakin's newly found power in the Dark Side has made him very arrogant. And because of his arrogance, he doesn't think straight and makes mistakes.

 

That's a fair point, but I like to look at it from another point of view. Anakin used his anger, just like Obi-Wan had done in TPM to kill Maul. Obi-Wan pulled off a very similar move and came out on top. Anakin tried the same sort of thing, but because Ben had tried it himself, he knew the weakness of the move. Hence the "Don't try it...". Because of that, Anakin got sliced.

 

That?s a great point; Obi-Wan did use the same technique to take out Maul. I don?t think, however, that Obi-Wan used his anger to do it. Obi-Wan?s anger got him in that predicament in the first place, he was over-aggressive and that?s the reason he was left hanging for his life. While he was hanging, he calmed down, thought about what he was about to do and then executed it, unlike Anakin. Anakin didn?t take the time to think about what he was doing and let his anger decide his actions, and ultimately his fate.

 

Well the reason Obi-wan won i think was due to the simple fact that Obi-was was better suited to beat Anakin. For if you read the book, which many do not, it talks about why Obi-wan always gives ground it's just his way, that is his personality. Well Anakin is a hot head who can't control his emotions or his strikes. For I think Obi-wan and Anakin are equal. I think Obi-wan is the faster fighter and a better defender well Anakin is a stronger offensive fighter and much stronger. Hence they are equal due to there differnt quailties.

 

after watching the battle again i just think lucus really messed up because he failed to convey how powerful anakin was becoming since he had turned to the darkside. the fact that obiwan was so competitive with him, its hard to believe anakin was stronger than before. I think what would have been great was if obiwan was about to be killed my anakin and yoda showed up and he had to battle both yoda and obiwan and after anakin fighting like crazy against both of them then he gets tricked as he did before. I mean to me that would convery, right now vader is the most powerful force user in history and obiwan and yoda barely beat him.

 

Anakin slaughtering an entire temple full of Jedi showed how powerful he had become. Obi-Wan was competitive with him during the duel because he has trained and fought alongside Anakin for about 12-13 years. He knows Anakin?s moves during battle, the same as Anakin knows Obi-Wan's. That?s why the fight is pretty much a draw up until Anakin makes a mistake.

 

right now vader is the most powerful force user in history and obiwan and yoda

LOL, firstly Vader is NOT the most powerful force user ever (even if he is the most profound duelist ever!), Sidious and Yoda are, and secondly, Yoda would wipe the floor with Anakin stand-alone.

 

LOL, firstly Vader is NOT the most powerful force user ever (even if he is the most profound duelist ever!), Sidious and Yoda are, and secondly, Yoda would wipe the floor with Anakin stand-alone.

With a lightsaber Anakin/Unsuited Vader might be the best, but Yoda and Palpatine have a better mastery of the force.

 

I had no real problems with the lightsaber battle- but a wasted opportunity, in my opinion, was the "Force push lock" - the fact that both Anakin and Obi-Wan go flying back cements their place as equals when we should have seen a demonstration of Anakin's overwhelming power at that point. Anakin should have "won" the lock, sent Kenobi flying back and then the duel should have continued as it does.

My general viewpoint is that, in a pure lightsaber duel - Anakin could defeat *ANYONE* but Obi-Wan. Mace, Yoda, Sidious. Anyone. He was the greatest warrior of the Jedi Order.

He *wouldn't* beat Yoda and Sidious overall however, because they have a greater knowledge of the Force... but that's not the point I'm making.

 

i disagree with what pretty much everyone is saying. first of all, hayden christenson says in the chosen one bonus feature on the dvd that vader's fighting style is different than anakin's ("more agressive and brutal") and second anakin would be able to defeat yoda and sidious in the future when he would reach his max potential, have we all forgot when sidious says to yoda "you will not stop me darth vader will become more powerful than either of us"

 

Again, that doesn?t necessarily prove that Obi-Wan is a better fighter than Anakin, just that he knows his moves inside and out.

They key to that is "in the future" and "when he reaches his full potential". Let's not forget that he never does reach his full potential. He was very, very powerful pre-lava. He could've been extremely powerful and able to destroy the likes of Yoda and Palpatine if he didn't get burnt up. He never got to his "max".