main
side
curve
  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit On the Origins of Empire and Rebellion: The Rebel Alliance and Imperial Sourcebooks

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Grand Admiral Paxis, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    West End Games. More commonly known as WEG. Speak that name in any Star Wars forum and many are quick to cling to it like the doctrine of a timeless religion or just as swiftly dismiss it as outdated work: brilliant in its own time, but ultimately overwritten by newer movies and decades worth of authors who carried on without knowing what it set out or dismissing it without a second thought. If there's one thing I've learned over the years, this debate will never be solved. Or, at least, not by us. But regardless of where you fall on this spectrum, one fact is ultimately undeniable: the legacy of what WEG set out for the Star Wars universe continues to be felt to this very day

    This undeniable fact became abundantly clear with the release of Rogue One and the resultant sources released around it, all of which can trace ideas, concepts, and in-universe realities back to the original Rebel Alliance Sourcebook released by West End Games in 1990 and the Imperial Sourcebook released in 1989, both of which had second issues published in 1994. Both of those books (or, at least their First Editions) are even older than I am, but I'm fortunate enough to own copies of them. Not to toot my own horn, but as a matter of fact, I happen to have been born right in the middle of that sweet spot where I have the deepest adoration for everything WEG rooted deeply in my understanding of Star Wars, but grew up in an era where many of its most controversial proclamations had long since been overwritten by later sources which I never had any reason to question.

    With this background in mind, I would humbly like to offer my own review of the Rebel Alliance and Imperial Sourcebooks produced by WEG, in the same vein as Havac and Jello's review of my personal WEG favourites, the Adventure Journals, or Charlemagne's review of the (undeniably) best Galaxy Guide. Unfortunately, to the best of my knowledge, very little - if any - over either source has been transferred over from Legends to Canon. This is an incredible shame, as anyone who has read the sources themselves or the reviews on this forum can attest. Thankfully, I can't say the same for the RASB or the ISB, and I will endeavour to mention any Canon references I can in this review. I encourage everyone to mention any I happen to miss. Furthermore, chapters between the two reference books which cover the same topic are not in the same order between copies. For example, whereas Chapter 4 of the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook covers capital ships, this topic is covered in Chapter 5 of the Imperial Sourcebook. For the sake of coherency, I will proceed with my review in the order outlined in the table of contents in the RASB, jumping between chapters in the Imperial version as needed to ensure that I'm always discussing the same topic.

    I hope you enjoy my review of these wonderful and important sourcebooks, and can forgive any delays I have between chapters, which unfortunately tends to happen with real life - despite my sincerest attempts to turn it off!
     
  2. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    The even older Star Wars Sourcebook probably contributes a big chunk too - with these two carrying on where it left off.
     
    Jedi Knight Fett, BigAl6ft6 and Sarge like this.
  3. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    In starting this thread, I noted that the chapters in the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook and the Imperial Sourcebook covering the same topic sometimes came in different orders. Just in case anyone doubted me, the former starts with a Prologue and then an Introduction, whereas the latter starts with an Introduction and then a Prologue (You fools, you blissfully ignorant fools! The egg is truly upon your faces for ever doubting the Herculean effort for which I have now volunteered to deliver unto you!) Fortunately, these two chapters across the two sourcebooks only comprise five pages total between them, so I can at least kick this off to an easy start, beginning with the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook.

    ******************

    The Prologue of the RASB is titled The Growing Rebellion and consists of a letter to Mon Mothma from Arhul Hextrophon, Executive Secretary and Master Historian of the Alliance High Command. That's right. Many of you have heard of the old EU conceit of in-universe documents (which conveniently explain glaring errors away as the mistakes of IU rather than OOU authors). But who knew that it started off this early, back in the ol' WEG days? Either through brilliant foresight or sheer coincidence, this system provided an easy "out" for the many facts established by WEG that would later be overwritten. (Unfortunately, this kept happening to such an extent that I always wondered why fans like Hextrophon and his protégé, Voren Na'al, so much, considering that the only in-universe explanation for why they're always getting their facts wrong is that they suck at their jobs).

    Regardless, Hextrophon explains that the RASB we're reading is really the in-universe result of an official history of the Rebel Alliance commissioned by Mon Mothma since its very beginning. Furthermore, Hextrophon adds the sheer volume of documents available means that the real report is 680,000 DSUs in length, taking more than 700 hours to read assuming that one can maintain the already high reading rate of one data screen per 15 seconds. Personally, I'd much rather read that version because I'm a massive nerd, but Hextrophon assures us that he had Na'al whittle it down to the essentials so that it can serve as an introductory manual for new Rebel officers. He also notes that the section on the origin and early years of the Rebellion was severely hampered by the destruction of Alderaan, which wiped out entire records that documented that period. Not only does this show how vital Alderaan was, Hextrophon describes Mothma as "one of the only people who has been with the Alliance since the beginning," and gripes that he only had a small pool of people to work with besides her after that serious loss. However, he can thankfully guarantee that the later sections on the Alliance's military strength, Intelligence branch, and underground network are much more reliable. He concludes by noting that the report is as accurate as possible, in light of these time and resource limitations.

    The introduction then begins by noting that the Old Republic is dead and gone, the Jedi Knights have been extinguished - possibly forever - and with the rise of the Empire, "Across millions of worlds, untold billions writhe in the terrible, implacable bonds of tyranny. There is a darkness in the galaxy, and it is called the Empire." Yikes, Hextrophon! Either this Master Historian is really a Master Propagandist or he's really skilled at framing the extent of autocracy on a galaxy-wide skill right from the get go. Regardless, he assures us that there is a light to oppose this darkness and it's the Rebellion.

    In describing the origins of the Rebellion, Hextrophon notes that it started off as a collection of scattered, disparate cells which possessed no unified command, no supply chains, and no communications between them. This idea was most recently captured in the Rebels TV series, and many are quick to point to WEG as the origins of it. However, WEG paints a slightly different story. You see, the Empire drove these worlds to the hills, asteroid clusters, and the far fringes of the galaxy, but in doing so was forced to impose new laws, raise new taxes, and imprison people even amongst its more privileged worlds. Mon Mothma and Bail Organa (who never trusted Palpatine to begin with) finally realised he was mad and tried turning to a force to oppose him. Unfortunately, the military was under his control, the Senate was impotent, the Jedi were dead, and the Corporate Sector Authority and other business groups were more interested in profits than ideals. In their desperation and with little hope of success, they turned to the Resistance (capital R, and an unadopted formal name for the proto-Rebellion). While most "Resistance" groups remembered the corruption and abuse of power of the Senate, were used to working on their own, and "had no reason to trust Mothma or Organa," many of their more visionary leaders realised the need for a galaxy-wide movement to succeed and put their differences aside to join them. Through this process, the Rebel Alliance was born, wedding the wealthy Core World Senators and nobility with the Outer Rim resistance groups. Despite early setbacks, the alliance worked better than any of its partners dreamed, culminating in the Rebel victory at Yavin - the framing time reference of the RASB's commissioning.

    The depiction of the Alliance being formed from a number of disparate cells is a theme faithfully recounted in both Legends and Canon. Legends shows the Alliance being formed mostly from the unity of the Alderaanian, Chandrilan, and Corellian resistances, along with others, while the second Han Solo trilogy features a pre-Rebellion meet up between groups - including the Duros and Tethan resistances - which resist centralisation. Canon follows in this vein, showing some of the Outer Rim resistance cells such as Phoenix Squadron and Massassi Group which eventually coalesce into a formal rebellion. However, what I find most interesting here is what wasn't picked up - namely that despite opposing Palpatine from the beginning, neither Mothma or Organa were trusted because their public personas led to them being regarded as a bunch of privileged Core snobs (and Senators, no less) butting into the resistance of the Rim which had long survived without them. Obviously, WEG existed long before the PT and had no advance knowledge of the events of the Clone Wars. However, many of the broad strokes of the Core/Rim divide it paints mesh neatly with the Loyalist/Separatist split that the PT would establish later on - a theme which I will be revisiting throughout.

    ******************

    As mentioned, the ISB starts with the intro and then the prologue, although I'll review them in reverse order. The Prologue, The Might of the Empire, once again reveals the in-universe conceit that the entire sourcebook is an in-universe report compiled by Hextrophon to Mon Mothma. However, unlike the RASB, which Hextrophon (mostly) guarantees the accuracy of, the ISB is assembled from intercepted communications, stolen documents, reports from various agencies, and other such sources, most of which can't be independently verified. As such, many claims should be regarded as high-level rumours at best and deliberate attempts at misinformation by the Empire at worst. Fortunately, Hextrophon assures us that this probably isn't the case in his view (he'll be proven wrong due to the IU nature of the source later being contradicted), and even the falsehoods can be ignored by reading between the lines of these official sources. He also describes the ISB as a companion to the "work in progress," the Official History of the Rebellion, Volume One, which we know OOU as the RASB. Weirdly, whereas in the RASB he signs off with a "Respectfully, Arhul Hextrophon," he signs the ISB as "I remain your humble servant, Major Arhul Hextrophon." Considering that the ISB technically came out first, I'm hoping this was just an attempt to brown nose Mothma, which was subsequently slapped down and made him more "respectful" in future. Otherwise, Garm Bel Iblis (who wasn't around when either source was released but was later slotted in), who was presumably privy to this document, had a damn good reason to be creeped out by Mothma's growing power...

    The introduction is rather short and sweet, merely noting that the Empire consists of a thousand-thousand worlds which it keeps in its grasp through superior military might, capable of subjugating every world, every system, and every race. While the Old Republic was once a utopia protected by the Jedi Knights, it fell into corruption, allowing Palpatine to take power and proclaim his Empire. When individual worlds resisted, the Empire began an unprecedented military build-up, culminating in the construction of the Death Star and the dissolution of the Senate. While this was intended to bring about a reign by fear of force, the Rebellion managed to destroy the Death Star, and the Emperor has ordered the might of the Empire to crush the Alliance and end its dream of a New Republic. This section concludes with an OOU statement explaining that the ISB is set directly after the Battle of Yavin, and features documents to explain its change in policies and tactics in light of their defeat. More on that to come...
     
  4. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    We kick things off with Chapter One of the RASB, titled Birth of the Rebellion. A heck of a lot of material is covered in this chapter, including an explanation of how the early Resistance cells united into a formal Rebel Alliance and the structure of the Alliance Civil Government and High Command. Fans of the Rogue One Visual Guide will see a lot of the material from this section faithfully replicated and applied to the Alliance Council from that film.

    The History of the Alliance

    Hextrophon notes that there was a Resistance long before there was an Alliance, with cells springing up "almost immediately after Senator Palpatine became President Palpatine and began his long campaign of oppression." Naturally, WEG came out before the PT, so it can be forgiven for not anticipating Lucas would opt for the grander title of Supreme Chancellor for the head of the Republic. Still considering that he traces the origins of the Rebellion back to before Palpatine crowned himself Emperor, we can assume this refers to Separatist holdouts, Republic-backed insurgencies which were more independent-minded than Loyalist (Onderon, for instance), and other similar groups. These groups were isolated, uncoordinated, and no match for the Imperial Military, with rebellious systems being quelled one by one.

    In one of the weirder passages, Hextrophon begins by noting that "Even now it is unclear who is the true creator of the Rebel Alliance as it exists today." The reason he says that may be because he's trying to ascribe credit to a singular figure, because he immediately contradicts the previous statement by claiming that both Mon Mothma and Bail Organa played pivotal roles. (This was prior to Zahn introducing Garm Bel Iblis as a third co-founder, with later WEG pieces like The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook massaging him in to the events they go on to describe herein). Mothma and Organa were described as friendly adversaries, who both shared common values but followed different means of accomplishing them. Organa had already been a Senator for years before Mothma entered the Senate as a young firebrand, "putting forward visionary - some said "wildly impractical" - ideas for social change." By contrast, Organa was more of a realist and even a bit of a cynic after his long service in the corrupt Senate. While Mothma preferred making loud, passionate speeches to little effect, Organa preferred working in the system to actually get things done.

    A pretty interesting sidebar called "From the Official Records of the Senate of the Old Republic" captures this neatly, showing a debate between Mothma and Organa. Mothma accuses Organa of not realising the peril the Republic is facing, claiming that the Senate must act immediately to restore the values their government was founded upon or face destruction. Organa agrees with her substantive point that the Republic is in greater danger than it has ever been, with corruption everywhere, basic services breaking down, and the Navy out of control. However, he believes that the Senate can do nothing about all these things if it continues to get mired down in endless debates over what he mockingly calls the "big issues," instead of actually doing the real things it can build consensus on. Mothma mockingly retorts that Organa proposes to "repair the plumbing while our ship plunges into a sun!" while he replies better that than achieving nothing at all. I really liked this debate because it shows that despite their shared goals and values, Mothma and Organa weren't always on the same page and their movement is a broad church united by anti-authoritarianism but not necessarily political ideology. The idea of Mothma and Organa not always being on the same page is an old one, and it gets referenced a bit in sourcebooks. Unfortunately, it rarely ever translates into stories, which usually depict the two as easy allies with little friction if any between them. Another interesting factoid is that the two reference a "Madam Speaker," an obscure reference that got overlooked in later sources since the Speakership was held by Mas Amedda. Either this debate is so old that it precedes the Valorum administration, or perhaps Sly Moore occupies the Speakership whenever Amedda is away for whatever reason.

    Despite their differences, Organa and Mothma worked closely together to stop Palpatine attaining the Presidency of the Republic, showing they opposed him pretty early on. When it became clear that they would fail, Mothma started speaking of revolution, a fact that mortified Organa given his whole 'change the system from within' approach. Mothma even later joked that she was convinced that Organa might report her and have her arrested, until the Ghorman Massacre changed his mind. One of the pivotal moments in the formation of the Empire, the Ghorman Massacre occurred when peaceful protestors demonstrating against new taxes blocked off the starports, only for a Republic warship under the command of one Captain Tarkin to land anyway, killing dozens and injuring hundreds more. Not only did Tarkin not face any punishment, he was promoted. Naturally, this is one of the events that got retconned timeline-wise: the Ghorman Massacre occurred under the Empire, not the late Republic, and Tarkin was more than just a mere Captain by then. Still, the real meat of the story remains and got transferred to Canon - even being cited by Mothma during a speech in Rebels. Organa was so horrified that he started using his role in influential Senate committees such as Finance, Appropriations, and Intelligence Oversight to funnel credits, weapons, and information to rebel groups under the guise of his duties.

    In fact, Organa was so good at playing the Imperial loyalist that when Emperor Palpatine ordered Mothma arrested for treason, one of his lapdog Senators told Organa about it. He pretended to gloat along with him and then immediately informed Mothma, allowing her to escape Coruscant about two minutes ahead of the ISB. Mothma went on the run and started openly working with rebel groups to unite them whilst coordinating with Organa, who eventually returned to his homeworld to prepare them for war once he felt he had accomplished all he could do in the Senate. The passage notes that Organa even convinced them to renounce their pacifism, although as later sources make clear, this only happened quietly and behind the scenes, with Alderaan maintaining a pacifist façade. The idea of Organa being a trusted Loyalist - to the point his fellow Senators would trust him with the knowledge that Mothma is about to be arrested - is woefully underused in storytelling. Indeed, everyone seems to suspect Organa of being a traitor but just can't prove it. I'd love to read a novel about Bail hobnobbing with the worst kinds of Imperials like he's one of them, only to use their insider gossip against them by funnelling it along to Mothma.

    The Corellian Treaty: The Birth of the Alliance

    Now able to openly meet with Resistance groups, Mothma started working to unify them against the Empire. Though her fame allowed these groups to gain greater access to important nobles and industry leaders for funding, many were suspicious and worried she was just an Imperial plant. However, she was eventually able to get the three largest Resistance groups to sit down during the Corellian System Meetings to hammer out an agreement - the Corellian Treaty - which provided the organisational basis for the Rebel Alliance. It specified that individual Resistance groups would maintain their original structure and have autonomy in their own space, but Mon Mothma, with the help of an Advisory Council, had complete control over supply, recruitment and training, inter-ally communications, intelligence, and all space operations. Some argued that Mothma was assuming dictatorial powers which rivalled those of the Emperor. Indeed, Mothma believed that such centralisation was necessary given that the Rebellion had to focus on freeing the entire galaxy rather than individual worlds - and, considering how cold the calculus was, local interests couldn't be trusted not to put the entire Alliance at jeopardy when the Empire inevitably cracked down on their worlds. However, she did not want to be a new Palpatine and ensured that the Treaty included a provision opening her position up for election every two years, at which point representatives from all Allies were obligated to meet for a vote. Despite the sheer number of times this occurred, Mothma has always run unopposed, showing the faith others have in her despite these concerns about her power. Another interesting section of the Corellian Treaty stipulates that once Resistance groups sign up as Allies, they must remain a member of the Alliance for the duration, with the agreement "forever binding, until the Empire is destroyed." (In this context, Garm Bel Iblis is a Treaty violator and his splinter resistance group is actually illegal under Alliance law. No wonder he stayed in hiding and armed himself against Mothma even after she took Coruscant!)

    At any rate, the Rebellion grew at an astonishing rate once the three main groups were united and others saw how well they functioned together, flocking to join them. Anonymous, untraceable donations came in from wealthy families and corporations, ships were purchased via dummy corporations or "stolen" from sympathetic governments, recruitment efforts were put in place on populated planets and safe worlds were established to house the families of its military members. This led Mothma to believe the time was right to counter the Empire's narrative that they were just a bunch of pirates, criminals, and anarchists intent on overthrowing the Empire for personal gain, and she issued the formal Declaration of Rebellion to set the record straight. Millions of holo-copies were distributed by Alliance Intelligence and, in a surprising indicator of just how much resources they had, copies could be found on "virtually every planet in the Empire" "within days." Unfortunately, it worked a little too well: several systems immediately and openly declared their support for the Rebellion, with these so called "Secession Worlds" suppressed by the Imperial Military in a matter of weeks. On the plus side, during their brief taste of freedom, these worlds transferred as much of their resources off-planet and into the hands of Rebellion as they could. The Succession Worlds unfortunately received few mentions since then. I think EGTW established Mon Calamari as one of the few successful survivors, and we can probably extrapolate from known rebellions during that timeframe. Gerrard V seems like a prime candidate, for example. Anyway, the Imperial Propaganda Bureau immediately set to work trying to discredit Mothma and the Declaration, but by then it was too late: the people had become aware of the Rebellion and, in doing so, sympathetic to its cause. A sidebar contains a full copy of the Declaration of Rebellion which, if I'm remembering correctly, was repeated verbatim in Star Wars Propaganda, bringing it back into Canon.

    A trio of sidebars in this section also show how individual Resistance groups were integrated into the Alliance, using the Atrivis sector as an example. The first sidebar, titled "Atrivis Sector," notes that that region of space was one of the foremost territories in opposition to the Empire. However, the planets Fest and Mantooine had a long history of petty bickering and distrust, leading the Resistance in the sector to be fragmented and suspicious of each other's cells. (This would be a great local conflict to turn into a Clone Wars proxy civil war, with one cell being a Separatist holdout and the other being a former Republic-backed insurgency). Despite this, the Mantooine Liberators grew strong enough to capture the Imperial garrison on their world, confiscating all of its arms and equipment. However, instead of fleeing into the wilderness like a more experienced group would have, they foolishly bunkered in and broadcast their triumph, encouraging the rest of Mantooine to join them in revolt. Because the garrison was the first in their system, they were unaware the Empire also maintained a strike fleet in orbit of Fest's moons. The Fest Resistance Group, naturally, was aware but had no contact with Mantooine. In "Regrouping Atrivis," the Mantooine Liberators are decimated by the Imperial Navy, although the Fest group remains uncompromised. Learning the value of cooperation, Fest establishes a Mantooine arm and other groups throughout the sector, eventually unifying into a single Atrivis Resistance Group. They become far more efficient, stepping up their raids and setting up a secret base on Generis. However, they have a worrying epiphany: if the Resistance in one system can be lost because it had no contact, then surely their sector-wide resistance could suffer the same fate because they have no contact with their neighbours. This naturally segues into "Atrivis and the Alliance," where Mothma comes to visit and bring the Atrivis Resistance Group into the Alliance. Having worked for hard to overcome their differences, the ARG leaders were reluctant to surrender control. However, Mothma convinced them that the benefits outweighed the costs. She wanted to turn Generis into an Outer Rim comms centre linking up Resistance groups, and even offered to establish a Starfighter base on Generis to protect it (the ARG apparently had "no starfighters at all," which does make me wonder how they managed to be very effective). They signed the Treaty of Generis, binding them to the Alliance for the duration of the war.

    The Alliance Now

    All of this naturally led to the construction of the Death Star and the lead up until Yavin. Alderaan was destroyed and other "trouble planets" were warned that they might be next, but despite being shaken, most Rebels held firm to the belief that the Empire had to be opposed. Indeed, they also recognised that while the power of the Death Star was unimaginable, it also had limited use. Many Alliance bases were hidden on Imperial planets and if the Empire destroyed them, other loyal worlds would have no choice but to rise up for their own survival. At any rate, the Alliance won at Yavin and there is a massive upheaval in the Imperial ranks. Many high-ranking officers have been demoted or executed, a shake-up has occurred in the hierarchy, and Darth Vader has been put in charge of a new anti-Rebel task force centred around the Executor. By contrast, the Alliance is now working together better than before, now looking to its own younger generation for inspiration instead of its renowned Old Republic heroes.

    This chapter also finishes with a lengthy and detailed breakdown of the Alliance command structure and Civil Government. It's an incredibly lore-rich passage but I've already written quite a bit and want to leave open some space for discussion. But not to worry. I'll be back to finish up this section relatively soon!
     
  5. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    I only have the second edition of the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook (which I somehow did not actually realize until today). Are there any significant differences in the text, or just mechanically?
     
  6. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Sorry, I completely forgot to mention which copies I was using in the introduction. My copy of the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook is also the Second Edition, although my Imperial Sourcebook is the First Edition. My understanding is that there is very little difference between the two, with most of the changes relating to the game mechanics, RPG stats, and the overall layout. However, I think the Second Editions also include some additional pictures, the odd sidebar or two, and the occasional edit to the main text but nothing too substantial. But if I'm wrong, hopefully someone can point that out so I can keep the differences in mind and refer to them where possible.
     
  7. Dr. Steve Brule

    Dr. Steve Brule Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Very interesting! I have the ISB, but never got the RASB.Haven't read the ISB in years, though, so a lot of this will be new to me, no doubt.

    On the topic of the central control of the Alliance, I felt like Saw Gerrera in RO was pretty much the Bel Iblis of the new canon. Too bad he got killed and his group was turned into cannon fodder for stories where they don't want "the" Rebels to be the bad guys.

    In terms of Palpatine being elected "President", Michael Kaminski showed that there actually were some cases in 1977 where Lucas used the term "Chancellor", but it doesn't seem to have stuck, obviously. It's also interesting (but maybe not surprising considering this was coming out around the same time) that the Farlander Papers document that came with the X-wing game has a backstory segment that covers a lot of this same info too, including Mothma and Bail being opponents in the Senate, but teaming up to oppose Palpatine even before he was elected President, and the Ghorman Massacre happening under the late Republic.

    The Farlander Papers also has some stuff I'll be curious to know are in the ISB/RASB too, like the Clone Wars ending well before Palpatine's rise to power, and it being wide knowledge that Palpatine is a dark sider and Vader is a fallen Jedi. The Farlander Papers also refer to Mon Mothma as Chief of State, so I'm curious if that title is used in the RASB (or ISB) because if not, that omnipresent title might have its origin in a computer game manual, which would be kind of funny.
     
    Grand Admiral Paxis likes this.
  8. Nom von Anor

    Nom von Anor Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 7, 2012
    It's interesting that after the Thrawn Trilogy came out, they didn't include Garm Bel Iblis as one of the founders of the Alliance in the Second Edition of the RASB. I wonder why. Maybe because it was prepared while the Thrawn Trilogy was still coming out?
     
  9. The Positive Fan

    The Positive Fan Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2015
    I owned the first and second editions of both sourcebooks, and to the best of my recollection there were no changes to the text whatsoever between them. The only differences were in the RPG stat blocks and some minor formatting changes.
     
  10. sidv88

    sidv88 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 2005
    I remember that Rebels was supposedly incorporating the RPG stuff, but I was shocked to find that the Corellian Treaty was not included in the show at all! The closest thing we had to a formal founding of the Alliance was Mon Mothma's episode. And even then the Rebel Alliance seemed fully formed, with Dodonna as General, and they had Yavin ready to run off to (they even skipped Dantooine!)

    I just wished that, for a show called Rebels, we got the political and legal and formal aspects of founding a Rebellion alongside the front line work of the Ghost crew.
     
    Dr. Steve Brule and Daneira like this.
  11. Dr. Steve Brule

    Dr. Steve Brule Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 7, 2012
    It's insane to me that Rebels just skipped over Dantooine in particular. I would have liked to have seen the Corellian Treaty and Bel Iblis but wasn't holding my breath on either (was very pleasantly surprised that Ghorman got a mention, though). But no Dantooine!?
     
  12. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012

    Gerrera strikes me as a mash-up of Garm Bel Iblis and Earnst Kamiel, the terrorist leader of the Justice Action Network. Like Garm, he broke away from the Rebellion to wage his own private war. And like Kamiel, he's a violent radical considered too extreme for the Alliance due to his willingness to kill civilians to achieve his objectives.

    That's really interesting. It's strange to think that the term Chancellor was being used even back then. Even stranger that it never caught on, given that it came directly from Lucas.

    [/quote]

    I can't remember the details about Palpatine and Vader off the top of my head, but the timeline of events like the Clone Wars and the establishment of the Empire can be a bit... murky. Some references are completely outdated with the release of the PT, while the meaning of others can be stretched a bit to be true from a certain point of view. As for the title of Chief of State, it's used here (along with quite a few other positions that showed up elsewhere), and it'll be in the section I cover next.


    Thanks for clarifying! Strange that there weren't any changes in the main text itself, but I'm always happy to learn my job will be easier.


    I've been pleasantly surprised by all the WEG references that turned up in the show, but I do agree that some of the omissions are a bit strange. Brushing past Dantooine so quickly is definitely one of the stranger ones, especially since they went to the trouble of actually including it in the show in the first place. As for the Corellian Treaty, I would have loved to see an actual meeting of various cell leaders hammering out an agreement, as opposed to a bunch of ships popping up after Mothma calling them followed by the end credits. Maybe we'll get lucky and it'll be an off-screen moment that appears elsewhere in future.
     
  13. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Fun thread idea (and a reminder I really fell behind in the SWAJ thread).

    WEG is a blessing both in that it established the EU, but also, the fact that it set up the fundamental backbone is probably largely why it's still felt in a post-reboot world. Good ideas made it fundamental, and as such, it colors everyone's views of basic SW worldbuilding.

    It's also remarkable just how consistent the early history of the Empire really was with the prequels anyway. There are inconsistencies, but somehow the backstory -- drawing on just the tidbits that Lucas gave us -- largely still works.

    I suspect that the ANH novel exercised a strong influence, since that's probably where most people got the title of president from.
     
  14. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    I don't think Saw Gerrera is really the new-canon equivalent of Bel Iblis, because I don't think he's supposed to be on the same level of influence as Mothma or Bail. He's the leader of a splinter Rebel movement, not a co-founder who changed his mind. Though I guess that sort of fits with, as Paxis has mentioned, the fact that Bel Iblis had to be retconned in alongside them anyway and is not to be found in this original material.

    ...I mean, I kind of thought we were supposed to infer that already.
     
    JediBatman likes this.
  15. Grand Admiral Paxis

    Grand Admiral Paxis Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I'm glad we've got a good discussion going so far. I'll be taking a brief interlude before addressing Chapter 1 of the Imperial Sourcebook because I have an upcoming work deadline but, in the meantime, I still have this chapter to finish. As mentioned the structure of the Alliance High Command and Civil Government seen in Rogue One is a faithful picture of what we see here. High Command is depicted in Chapter 2, the Alliance Military, so for know let's focus on the Civil Government.

    Politics

    With the history of the early Rebellion previously outlined, the sourcebook then goes on to describe the actual structure of the Alliance and its political institutions. After the victory at Yavin, the Alliance has been given greater credibility as an opponent to the Empire and works hard to translate that into political connections with local governments. Systems in the outlying systems of the Outer Rim, which once feared Imperial reprisals, have now been emboldened. Even if they're unwilling to fully cast their lot in with the Rebellion, they are less willing to cave in to Imperial threats and surreptiously supply money, equipment, and troops where they can. Unfortunately, the opposite is true in the Core Worlds. The Imperial Propaganda Bureau is working hard to keep people dismissive and distrusting of the Alliance - even the Battle of Yavin is regarded as the result of the incompetence of the Imperial officers involved, as opposed to a sign of Rebel strength. I find this fact particularly striking, since we know from other sources that the Empire tried to sweep the entire affair under the rug. I imagine that once Alliance propagandists got the word out there and it became impossible to hide, the Empire's counter-propagandists decided to change the narrative by throwing Tarkin and his command staff under the bus. The problems of recruitment in the Core are further compounded by the fact that, on the off chance a governor or Moff actually wants to meet with the Rebellion, their entire staff is just riddled with ISB agents which make it too risky.

    Hextrophon argues that for the Alliance, success in politics is just as important - if not more so - than military victories, although the two are often interlinked since the latter provides legitimacy for the former. He cites the famed Mon Calamari shipbuilders, who threw in with the Alliance several years before the Battle of Yavin, as a prominent example. Although the Empire is capable of bringing devastating reprisals to Rebel worlds, it takes time and effort to properly find and punish offenders, with the Imperial Navy incapable of being everywhere at once. Indeed, in the case of Mon Calamari, the Empire is aware of their treason, but knows they maintain a formidable defence fleet and hasn't been able to "spare the ships from other, more important, duties to break through the Cals' defences and reduce the annoying planet to rubble." I would poke fun at AdmiralNick22 since the Empire apparently found the Mon Calamari a mere annoyance and thought whatever else they were doing at the time was more important than crushing them but... well, we all know how that turned out, so I guess the Rebels got the last laugh there. Nevertheless, this is a small comfort to other worlds. They know that the Empire can't deal with every planet that rebels, but they're worried that they will deal with their planet.

    The Civil Government

    The Alliance command structure consists of two main organisations: the Civil Government and the military High Command, the latter of which answers to the Minister of War, who bellows to the former group. A neat graphic shows the hierarchy of the Civil Government quite well. At the top is the Chief of State, Mon Mothma, who is aided by an Advisory Council. Below her is the Secretary of the Cabinet, an official who presides over the various Ministers, and then the Alliance Cabinet itself which consists of the Ministries of Finance, Education, State, Industry, Supply, and War. Below that are the Allied Commands, the various local resistance groups which have formally signed up as members of the Rebellion. These Allied Commands usually structure their own local governments in the exact same way as the Civil Government. A "Chief Executive" heads the Allied Command, served by a "Secretary of the Allied Cabinet. The Allied Cabinet has the same portfolios as the Alliance version, except the head of each portfolio is a "Secretary of X" rather than a Minister.

    The Alliance is headed by the Chief of State, which even Hextrophon acknowledges is an elected dictatorship. Mon Mothma is the first and only CoS, with almost unlimited power over the Civil Government. Her decisions can only be overturned by a two-thirds majority of the Advisory Council, and if that ever happens, she'll be ousted from her office as well. A further check on her power comes from an election every two years with representatives from all the Allied Governments, with each getting one vote and a simple majority prevailing. However, as per the Corellian Treaty, the position is to be abolished once the Emperor is deposed, killed, or resigns his position, at which point the Advisory Council will immediately assume executive power and convene a Constitutional Convention to implement a "Second Galactic Republic." Besides that, Mothma can pretty much just do whatever she wants. She believes that the primary job of the Civil Government is to aid the military in the war effort, leading them to focus their energies on supplying, maintaining, and expanding the military. She's responsible for planning overall military strategy, mobilising the war industries of Allied worlds, and keeping the military well-supplied. On the diplomatic front, she's responsible for the Alliance's relationship with governments that are not Allied members, and is also the final arbiter in any disputes between Allied governments. Finally, she is also responsible for caring for the well-being of every individual affected by the Rebellion. In one of its few limitations on her power, the Corellian Treaty orders the CoS to "direct all resources not required in the war effort to alleviate the suffering of those whose lives have been disrupted by the Rebellion." Of course, it's a classic example of a well-intentioned but mostly useless government policy, as even Hextrophon has to concede that almost all their resources are vital for the war effort and only the most unfortunate victims ever receive this aid. Still, it puts the stories we see of Alliance humanitarian missions in a whole new light: not only is it an act of generosity from a resource-strapped organisation, its so deeply rooted that its a foundational principle of their constitution.

    Mothma is supported in her activities by the Advisory Council, which is comprised of seven representatives from the Allied governments "who have given the most lives to the battle against the Emperor." Obviously, this isn't a position that anyone would ever aspire to but it ensures that those worlds which suffered the most at the hands of Imperial tyranny have a direct say in the running of the government. Princess Leia is entitled to a position on the Council, since Alderaan was an Allied government, but she refused a seat since she preferred to devote her efforts in other areas. As the name implies, the Council's role is advisory and their power is limited to approving or disapproving of Mothma's decisions. However, as mentioned, if five of the seven members disapprove they can dismiss the CoS. They also have a great deal of moral authority due to the circumstances of their membership, so Mothma tends to listen carefully to what they have to say and avoids making decisions they would disapprove of.

    The Alliance Cabinet

    While Mothma and her Advisory Council are in charge of creating new policies, the responsibility for executing them falls with the Alliance Cabinet. Each Cabinet Minister is in charge of a specific portfolio, with each member being chosen for their intelligence, drive, and ability to get things done. The Secretary of the Cabinet is responsible for organising and running their meetings, also chairing them when Mon Mothma is unavailable. They also oversee the training of staff given high-level security clearance and provide these beings to the Ministers to aid them in their duties. Every attempt is made to keep each Ministry lean and efficient: while a Ministry can contain thousands of bureaucrats spread across dozens of Alliance worlds, each Minister only has a personal staff of less than 50, including secretaries, assistants, coordinators, and other functionaries.

    The first of these portfolios is the Minister of Finance. Under Legends, this position actually predates this sourcebook, being held by the Viscount Tardi in one of the best issues of the original run of Marvel comics. Unfortunately, whereas Tardi (or at least his human-replica droid impersonator) was an honourable gentleman, the NeU has filled that position with Senator Nower Jebel of Uyter - someone who seems substantially less likely to utter the phrase "You insult my honour, Lord Vader! I swear, I'll kill you with my own hands!" Still, we can always dream. At any rate, the Minister of Finance does exactly what one would expect them to do: raise the money necessary to pay for the Alliance's war. They also have some interesting mechanisms for doing this. Firstly, they can impose taxes on Allied governments, although this is seen as quite onerous given that most member worlds are also still publicly Imperial, and have to pay the Empire's taxes as well. Secondly, the issue Alliance War Bonds, low-yield, long-term investments that can be redeemed for their value plus interest 5 to 25 years after the war ends. Stock analysts note that it's really not a sound investment, but most people who buy them just want to help the war effort and aren't really expecting to make a profit off them, so it hardly matters. Finally, the Minister is responsible for issuing their own currency alternative to the Imperial credit, the Alliance Credit (AC). The Alliance tries to maintain parity, with one AC possessing the same value as the Imperial kind, but only their supporters really agree to that fiction. On the open market (or rather, the black market, since the Empire maintains that ACs have no value and presumably outlaws them), there's an exchange rate of 25 ACs to 1 IC. It's interesting that they set an actual exchange rate to it. One would suspect an illegal currency issued by a rebellion to fluctuate pretty goddamn wildly but they don't really go into any more detail.

    The Minister of Education is a surprisingly Orwellian title, given that their role is to provide oversight of Alliance Intelligence and oversee the propaganda effort. They mostly oversee Civil Intelligence, which focuses primarily on passive intelligence-gathering, such as monitoring public Imperial broadcasts, as well as monitoring the government for Imperial infiltrators. The more serious and dangerous espionage work is covered by Military Intelligence, although Civil Intelligence maintains liaison officers in most if their System Branches to ensure that the Minister is kept up to date on all important information. The Minister of Intelligence oversees the Propaganda Bureau, which tries to counter Imperial portrayals of the Alliance and get a more accurate picture out there. The issuance of the Declaration of Rebellion convinced the Empire to step up their own propaganda efforts against the Empire, but the Minister has still managed to have successes in this portfolio, including overseeing the distribution of 20,000 holotapes depicting the destruction of the Death Star to the public. While the Minister went unnamed in Legends, the ROVG shows it is held by Senator Tynnra Pamlo of Taris.

    The Minister of State oversees the Diplomatic Corps and handles relationships with non-Allied governments. This position is also the most important in the Cabinet since, in the event of the Chief of State's impeachment or death, the Minister of State takes charge of the government until a new CoS can be appointed. The holder of this position has never been identified under Legends or Canon. However, under Legends, Leia Organa was the first Minister of State under the New Republic and I can only assume that she carried this over from the Alliance days. I've always had a theory that she held this position after inheriting it from her father, since Bail strikes me as Mothma's most likely heir-apparent.

    The Minister of Industry oversees the Alliance's limited production capabilities, which is probably an easy job since the Rebellion doesn't have much at all. In fact, it has almost no large factories whatsoever, with the exception of one or two hidden on safeworlds and a couple of planets like Mon Calamari which have openly thrown in with the Alliance. The Minister mostly charges these facilities with producing vital war materiel which cannot be easily acquired through other means: starships, heavy artillery, ground vehicles, etc. All of the other stuff like clothes, medpacs, and small arms are either manufactured in small cottage industries on Imperial-controlled worlds, bought on the black market, or stolen from the Empire. The Minister was never identified in Legends, although in Canon, the position is held by Senator Vasp Vaspar.

    The Minister of Supply is responsible for "begging, borrowing, or stealing the food, clothing, and other supplies necessary to keep the Alliance Fleet and Armies in the field." On the surface, this seems like an easy job, since the Alliance's hidden safe worlds produce a surplus of crops. However, the problem is less about production than it is distribution. The transport of supplies is overseen by Alliance Support Services, a branch in the Minister's portfolio which is always short of transport ships to bring goods where they're needed. Under Legends, the Minister of Supply was Ral'Rai Muvunc, who also served as the Supreme Commander of Ordnance and Supply. This suggests that Ministerial portfolios in the Civil Government can also be held by military heads of High Command.

    The Minister of War is responsible for overseeing the military effort and turning Mothma's general directives into concrete military strategies. They oversee the Chiefs of Staff who form the military High Command which are addressed in the next chapter, although they leave most of the operational details to them, focusing more on grand strategy and coordinating their efforts with the other Ministers. The Minister of War has never been identified in either Legends or Canon. However, Garm Bel Iblis strikes me as a suitable fit for the Alliance's early days, prior to him breaking away to lead his own war effort. Maybe even Ackbar would be a suitable figure, given the previous example of Muvunc.

    Allied Commands

    Finally, there are the Allied Commands, which are the governments of individual Allies and Sector Forces of the Alliance. They're answerable to the Alliance High Command and Civil Government on most important issues, but maintain limited autonomy in their regions. As mentioned, the structure of Allied Commands mimics that of the Civil Government, but with different titles (Chief Executives instead of the Chief of State, Secretaries instead of Ministers). However, there's much more variation due to cultural, political, or species differences which sometimes necessitates a divergent structure. In some Allies, the Chief Executive is a planetary ruler and their Cabinet secretaries are all members of their family. In others, they're all elected by the people, a political body, or randomly drawn by lot. Sometimes the Executive is not one single being but a group, a hive intelligence, a corporate board of directors, or a legislative body, and sometimes one being controls multiple Cabinet positions. The position of High Command is that the local Commands know the best way to govern their own people and respects these differences, provided that, say, "the Minister of Industry can call the Secretary of Industry for Churnis to find out how many tons of ore Churnis Sector can produce in the next five years and get a quick, correct answer." As long as things work smoothly, the Alliance respects the internal politics of its Allies.
     
  16. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I. As I've always said, Leader Mothma is a dictator who only sought to supplant Palpatine with herself.

    II. It's kind of excellent how well canon has reflected the WEG Alliance civil government.

    III. Speaking of canon, I feel like Bail and Mothma have reversed positions-- but only partially. I suspect WEG's cautious, overtly loyalist Bail is drawn from the ANH Radio Drama. I always liked that portrayal. In canon, Bail is one of the first to create a cell and drive resistance. Mothma is a little more cautious and pragmatic. That said, Mothma's still the firebrand who gets exiled and Bail still prefers to work within the Senate as opposed to outright war (remembering the Clone Wars, a nice touch). So it's still largely consistent with WEG, if textured a little differently.


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    BigAl6ft6 and Daneira like this.
  17. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 14, 2006

    I noticed with the Rogue One guide books the writers appear to be returning to the roots and cutting away the additions and retcons where necessary. If anything, it has made it alot simpler to understand the Rebel Alliance now and even the Empire's structure as being covered in Rebels, particularly with ISB and Inquisitors.
     
  18. sidv88

    sidv88 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 2005
    Garm Bel Iblis, is that you?

    I would think that the average galactic citizen, after the Empire's details come out that Palpatine was a Force user, would be wary of any Force users having high office. If Mon Mothma can't even left a rock, then I doubt people would be worried about her being a dictator. Even if she wanted to be, the average citizen would assume that without the Force she wouldn't get very far (unlike Palpatine).

    Leia however is a massively different story. I know that aside from a few cute lines about clones the new trilogy doesn't seem to be referencing the prequels much. However, I just don't see how Leia can escape accusations she's starting the Clone Wars all over again in a bid to gain power. She and her son are putting on a show of fighting, like Palpatine and Dooku before them, so that Leia can gain emergency powers for her and her Resistance etc. And it's now widely known she's Vader's daughter and thus a Force user.
     
  19. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I mean the central thrust of Bloodline was that Leia's bid for first senator was destroyed by the discovery she was Lord Vader's daughter. It shed all her actions in a very sinister light.

    But I'm not convinced Mothma escaped those allegations simply because she wasn't force sensitive. I have to imagine a lot of people, especially former Seppies, distrusted her. That's presumably why she went so far to disassociate the NR from the OR.


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    Ackbar's Fishsticks and sidv88 like this.
  20. comradepitrovsky

    comradepitrovsky Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2017
    Moffs are bad.

    Moff. Mothma. Moffma.

    Coincidence? I think not.

    Thus, by logical reasoning, Mon Moffma is bad. The prosecution rests.
     
  21. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1998
    Arhul Hextrophon... Now there's a name I've not heard in a long time.

    Thanks for the stroll down memory lane; I'm looking forward to the rest of it.
     
  22. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    Ooooh, I had that one! I totally poured over it as a kid for all of these delicious details. Great gateway book.
     
    Sarge likes this.
  23. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    WEG did an amazing job with creating a historical background for the SW universe back when they were really, really restricted; much like building the galaxy in a time when LFL didn't want it defined.

    Great stuff so far. Keep it up!
     
    Sarge, Iron_lord and Daneira like this.
  24. Dr. Steve Brule

    Dr. Steve Brule Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 7, 2012
    I think part of the reason the WEG stuff seems so timeless, especially on the Imperial end, is that they didn't base it on the existing Evil Empire of the time. Some of the Imperial bureaucracy is clearly vaguely inspired by the Soviet propensity for acronyms and contractions and tangled bureaucracy, but there's no, say, Imperial Commissars to reference another dystopian space empire RPG emerging at the same time. The movies very clearly centering on World War II imagery (albeit with some Vietnam in ROTJ) probably helped that cementing. Versus now, for example, the tendency in genre fiction and gaming seems to be "let's make as heavy-handed allusions to current politics as possible."

    That being said, if WEG had been allowed to venture post-ROTJ at the time, I wonder how they would have depicted the Empire's collapse after Endor. I feel like in that case, the temptation might have been stronger to tie it into the contemporary collapse of the USSR.
     
    Havac , blackmyron and Daneira like this.
  25. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I could buy Pestage as a would-be Gorbachev.


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    AdmiralNick22 likes this.