only pain will you find

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by darth_frared, Nov 25, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    hey. :)

    i haven't seen this discussed here, so i'm having a go at it.

    obi-wan and yoda recalibrate the signal and see all the dead bodies. they detective around and think they were killed with a light sabre. they never once wonder who it might be. just before they are going to leave anyway, obi-wan thinks there might be something on the security recording. but yoda tries to stop him. he says, 'only pain will you find'.

    my questions:

    a) did yoda know? and how did he? i know this might come off as silly, but did he actually suspect something from anakin all along?

    b) had obi-wan not asked, when would he have wanted to tell obi-wan? and how would obi-wan have believed him? i mean, yoda just saying, alright, you know, it was anakin, would not have made much sense without the recording, would it?
  2. ticopuma Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 2005
    star 5
    i think yoda knew that it was him when he saw that they were killed by a lightsaber. im guessing he sensed that it was him
  3. ticopuma Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 2005
    star 5
    (no message)

    srry 4 teh bouble post. internet is screwy
  4. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    A) Yoda seems very upset(for Yoda)when saying that "this one, by a lightsaber". He thought the Prophecy might be misread, knew about Palp's influence on Anakin, and had seen/heard what had happened on Corusant. Getting into the Temple most likely would've needed someone on the inside to accomplish. Maybe he saw Anakin as the most likely suspect to perform such a betrayal.

    B) If he and OW were going to "destroy the Sith" he would've had to tell OW, or discuss it with him until OW figured it out also. Since Yoda couldn't be in two places at once. ;)
  5. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    If he and OW were going to "destroy the Sith" he would've had to tell OW, or discuss it with him until OW figured it out also. Since Yoda couldn't be in two places at once.

    totally. he would have to tell him, no doubt. i was just wondering how he would have done that without the recording. i think padme's reaction to obi-wan talking was one of disbelief, so what do you think obi-wan would have said? uhm, okay, if you say it was anakin, sure.
  6. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    Hopefully using better theraputic counseling skills than he did with Anakin. [face_whistling] I thought of something like the Oracle talking to Neo; she doesn't tell him flat out what's up, but leads the conversation to that point where Neo can figure it out.
  7. IH2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2005
    star 2
    Doesn't Yoda react in the film by rubbing his head or something after mace is killed and Anakin turns? I am at work and can't pop in the DVD. I always thought that this was the moment he felt through the force that Anakin had turned and his feelings were confirmed when he saw the light saber killed padawan.
  8. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    yeah, he does (rub his head). i'm just wondering, if he's so set to get to work on destroying the sith, then how long would he have wanted master kenobi to ponder the issue?
  9. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    I think it's apparent Yoda knew who it was. He didn't want to tell Obi-wan, because he knew it would be hard for him. He figured it out based on his last conversation with Anakin, what he sensed three years ago and the fact that Anakin's presence is lingering. Yoda felt a massive disturbence in the Force. There are bodies marked with a Lightsaber. He knows that Sidious wouldn't have lead this attack directly. Not with everything at stake.

    Beyond that, I dunno what Yoda was going to do. At best I think they were going to leave Courscant and go into hiding. But with Obi-wan looking at the holocams, he realized that they would have to face the Sith now. He could've told him that it was Anakin without looking, but Obi-wan had already figured it out as well. He just wanted to be sure his instincts were wrong.
  10. Carnage04 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 5


    Treading on EU material, but at one point in the novel, Anakin can sense that Obi-Wan had been in Padme's apartment. In fact, he can feel traces of others who had been there by the force imprint that they had left. I think this feels completely plausable as an "In Universe" explanation. Oi-Wan sensed it. He already knew. I think it "Who..Who could have done this" was more of a rhetorical question. He already knew the truth but it was too staggering for him to believe. Given the fact that Anakin's body wasn't lying amidst 500 dead clone troopers is a pretty good give away too. If Anakin was in the light and the temple had been stormed, it would have taken ALOT to take him down.

    Another thought is that Obi-Wan and Anakin share a bond, and Yoda seems to share a bond with the Jedi as a whole. They probably both can sense Anakin is still alive. Anakin would not have just packed up and left if the temple was being stormed if he was in the light.

    Carnage
  11. 2Cleva Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 28, 2002
    star 4
    It seems as if Yoda knows it was Anakin as soon as he did it, just as he knew when he was slaughtering the Tuskens.

    I believe Yoda knew what had to be done as soon as he found out who the Sith was. He wasn't going into hiding without a fight. That decision was made before Obi-Wan saw the telecom.
  12. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    i find it very plausible that obi-wan already knew but kind of wanted to suspend belief, if you take my meaning.

    i'm wondering when yoda would have bothered when i think the security recording was clearly the best way to convince obi-wan. had yoda, on their way out, just said, alright, it was anakin, didn't you sense it, i'm not sure obi-wan ould have accepted it. it's quite the turning point for everyone.
  13. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Yoda would've probably told him once they were out of the Temple. And would've had Obi-wan meditate on the Force. But he also knew that Obi-wan would search his feelings, which is why he warned him.
  14. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    Well, the scene is a paralell to ESB when Luke enters the tree. Luke brings up going to it, Yoda warns him, Luke goes anyway. OW brings up needing to know, Yoda warns him, OW watches the security hologram anyway.
  15. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    And would've had Obi-wan meditate on the Force.

    have they got time for this? we must move quickly... ha, no, wrong character.
  16. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    a) did yoda know? and how did he? i know this might come off as silly, but did he actually suspect something from anakin all along?



    of course he did,because he rules[face_devil],and no i dont think he suspected anakin before.




    b) had obi-wan not asked, when would he have wanted to tell obi-wan? and how would obi-wan have believed him? i mean, yoda just saying, alright, you know, it was anakin, would not have made much sense without the recording, would it?

    i think yoda owuld have found a way to convince kenobi.but its a good question though[face_thinking]
  17. JASTERSLEGACEYV2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2005
    star 1
    well this goes back 2 my whole"yoda being evil" thing, if yoda did'nt tell ob1 then he would'nt have gone 2 mustifar and whinney and his sister would have a mother and vader( who i suspect yoda does'nt like also) would never been killed and palpatine would have died so it adds strength 2 the "yoda is evil" opionion of mine. by now u all think i'm a wac-job but just consider it: wat if yoda is evil and that yoda's "clouded meditations" r him just not wanting 2 say aything that would hurt him riasing 2 the top of the sith ladder. u ever consider that?
  18. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    Bartender...a double one of what he is having please...
  19. JASTERSLEGACEYV2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2005
    star 1
  20. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    first of all who talked of an evil yoda ??

    second ,waht do u mean by straight shots ?? that you will use language that people will actually understand?? if that then go ahead
  21. jedi_ethan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 2005
    star 3
    I think there is an easy answer. Yoda may have checked the recordings before, while Obi Wan was doing something else.
  22. EwokThatCried Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2003
    star 4
    OBI-WAN: "Who could have done this?"

    I thought it was kind of odd. I mean, they know there is a sith on the loose, so you would think their first suspicion would be that the sith master finally made a move.
  23. voodoopuuduu Classic Trilogy Trivia Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2004
    star 5
    u want straight shots 2?

    Heck with the shots, gimme the whole darn bottle. :D

    I think there is an easy answer. Yoda may have checked the recordings before, while Obi Wan was doing something else.

    Well thats fine, but the question is : Why wouldnt Yoda want Obi-Wan to look there too, for proof ?
  24. Jedi_Momma Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2005
    star 2
    Based on Yoda's reactions on Kashyyyk, I'd say he definitely felt it when the Chosen One turned. And then put 2 + 2 together when he saw the Temple.
    NB, Yoda did not tell Obi not to look at the recording - I think he knew he had to - but he was warning him to prepare himself for something awful - pain even beyond what he had already been experiencing. Because up until that point, Obi was deep in that river called DENIAL.
  25. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    As we see, Darth Sidious doesn't like to fight if he has to. Dooku was the Apprentice and he's dead. So is Grievous. The question remains, who lead the Clonetroopers. Obi-wan doesn't think it was Sidious.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.