Clone Wars Order 66 on TCW

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by EHT, Jan 21, 2012.

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  1. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    They fit very well as unconventional villians. They certainly are not mustache twirling Sith and I don't like Filoni's take either, but the mere fact that they veiw sentient living beings as a product is pretty cold.

    Ultimatly they are just alien and very different from humans, and human moral values for that matter. Their actions, in my eyes, make them villains by my standards - but they as a species don't have my standards. The mere idea that Filoni is going to simplify them to fit a villian of the week mold is a little concerning to me.
    TreborSabreon likes this.
  2. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    "Are they friendly?"

    "Depends."

    "Depends on what, Dex?"

    "Depends on how good your manners are--and how big your pocketbook is."

    This seems to enter into the debatable question of whether a business has any other obligation to society than producing a profit. There are those in our world who will argue that a business's sole obligation is to produce a profit for its shareholders. The Kaminoan cloners could be seen as taking this to the extreme.
  3. EHT New Films Manager

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    Sep 13, 2007
    star 6
    Maybe it's not a safe assumption, but I was under the impression that the clones and their reactions to receiving the order, carrying it out, and the aftermath of it all could very well be part of what is addressed in TCW. It seems odd to take it on with this show, especially with characters like Rex and Fives, and not address that angle. And if the clones themselves are part of what is addressed by it, the show will indeed need to show things that take place during the same timeline as ROTS. Just showing a meeting between Palpatine and Dooku well ahead of the time that Order 66 comes down, for example, would be different but would also feel incomplete.
  4. Alexrd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2009
    star 5
    They won't show anything during or after RotS. They will explore the genesis of Order 66, not it's execution or aftermath.
  5. FistoFan93 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 27, 2009
    star 4
    How sure are you of that? Because it would be nice to sort of see an episode focusing on each of the order 66 jedi-sequence casualties and starting shortly before the order seeing what the situation is, and ending with order 66. Taking Yoda/Luminara, Plo Koon, Aayla/Barriss, Stass Allie, Jedi Temple/Shaak Ti, Ki-Adi-Mundi that could be 6 really nice episodes.
  6. Executor_of_Order66 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 14, 2009
    star 2
    No offense but think of all the characters you just listed. Maybe back in season 1 I would have agreed with you TCW would have these episodes, but the episodes over the last 3 seasons have really only showed major movie characters. For TCWs to show these guys at the end, although we all would love it, seems highly unrealistic, as we are stuck with just stories about Anakin, Ahsoka, and Rex.

    After all, why devote an episode to a random jedi when we can watch 3PO and R2 travel the galaxy together because that adds so much to the star wars saga :mad:
  7. ShakTeeth Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 12, 2011
    star 1
    After the Umbara arc, I think it's pretty clear that the show will cover the execution of Order 66. It seems the writers are building up a story arc for Fives and Rex, and Order 66 seems to be the logical conclusion of that arc.
  8. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    The Neimoidians are worse in that respect.
  9. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    I do not watch ROTS all the way through, ever--but doesn't the Blu-Ray show Anakin killing Shaak Ti?
  10. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
  11. EHT New Films Manager

    Manager
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    star 6
    How are you so sure about that?

    Agreed, I think this seems quite possible at this point.
  12. Seerow SWTV★Manager

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    Jun 7, 2011
    star 6
    I tend to agree that TCW will overlap ROTS. The Clone War technically does not end at the start of ROTS right? I think they are building up to cover some ground in there. They'll move away from characters like Anakin and Obi-wan and give Ahsoka, Rex, Lux, Wolfpack, Satine center stage.
  13. QuangoFett Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 11, 2011
    star 4
    Though it's not directly related to Order 66, I'm very interested in Rothana and its role in the plot.

    It's just a contractor hired by the Kaminoans, apparently, but it's a mysterious Kuat Drive Yards subsidiary that gets involved in shady arms deals with the Kaminoans. The idea that a respected Core World conglomerate gets involved with a shadowy group of cloners - unknown to practically everyone in the Republic - is a fascinating one. Considering the ethical concerns about cloning, it reminds me of the UK's infamous arms deals with Saudi Arabia.

    The Kaminoans never struck me as anything more than just willfully ignorant of their products' use. The Kuati, however....
  14. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    What else is there to really know about order 66?

    Palpatine ordered the clones. He knew he would turn them on the Jedi at some point, so he either had that order implated/spread among the troops at some point during their training (or whilein the field, does it really matter?). The clones keep it to themselves, why would they let a possible thread to the Republic know of their order to deal them if/when they do become a threat? I just don't see what about order 66 needs to be explained or dealt with.
  15. EHT New Films Manager

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    Sep 13, 2007
    star 6
    Interesting that a post that is intended to question the value of further exploring Order 66 would make so many assumptions about the order and use so many "maybe this / maybe that" statements. :p
  16. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    So we'll find out when the clones find out about Order 66. Thats really the only question thats out there, as far as I can tell, and that was the only assumptions and maybe thats relaly in there.

    We know Palpatine ordered the army, we know the order came from him (the only other commanders were the Jedi, I doubt they created the order). We know the Clones didn't tell their Jedi commanders about it (or it wouldn't have been effective). How many assumptions am I really making?
  17. TaradosGon Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2003
    star 4
    The Jedi could feasibly have come up with it. Krell did major damage on Umbara, and realistically could have severely compromised the Republic military effort. The clones were obeying orders out of a sense of duty despite all this, and were hesitant to act out of fear of committing treason. A future episode could deal with future renegade Jedi, which could cause the Jedi and senate to develop Order 66 as a means by which the clones can legally kill their general in order to protect the Republic.
  18. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    The problem with the Jedi making the order as you have said would be 1) They would have put some kind of limit on it. A Jedi General would have to do something to warrent being killed, so that what happens int he movie would happen. Also, I doubt the Jedi would put an excution order out on themselves and their verison of order 66 probably would involve the Clones taking their general into custody. 2) What about Jedi who aren't generals? Is Ahoska a general? If the order is to protect the clones from the Jedi (and assuming the clones can excute the order without their Jedi generals endangering them first, which seems like a big loop-hole to me) where would it stop? Kill the General in who is endangering them? What about hte Padawan whos not giving orders? What about the Jedi who is not in command? What about the children, unless Anakin killed all of them. What about the Jedin in the temple who weren't in a battle field, and not endangering clones? I think there are too many loopholes in that story.

    I got this from wookiepedia

    When Revenge of the Sith first came out, some sources stated that Order 66 was preprogrammed into the clone troopers. However, George Lucas has stated that it was a "last resort" order, not preprogrammed. The order preceding Order 66 is Order 65, which stated that the Supreme Chancellor (had Palpatine not won the seat) would be removed from office by the GAR if the Galactic Senate declared him unfit for duty. The Jedi were obviously not aware of either order.
  19. EHT New Films Manager

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    Sep 13, 2007
    star 6
    Fair enough. I'm interested in Order 66, so I look forward to seeing what they do with this. On the other hand, just like with Darth Maul, it makes me pretty nervous that they could screw it up. :p
  20. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    No, he didn't, as far as we know. His master manipulated Sifo-Dyas into ordering the clones.

    That is not accurate. There was no official source that stated Order 66 was preprogrammed. It was a fan assumption. A source in November 2005 stated that it was not preprogrammed.
  21. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    Once again, EU.....doesn't matter. Its meaningless. But if you want to split hairs, and I KNOW you do, fine, Palpatine had a HAND in creating the clone army.

    We also know, cause Luca told us, while the order wasn't preprogrammed it was a last resort order that Palpatine obviously knew about. The Jedi didn't know about it, so it most likely came from Palpatine becaus the Jedi wouldn't put their own kill order out there and if the Senate did it, the Jedi would have heard about it etc....
  22. Watto Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 13, 1998
    star 4
    If you get anything from the Umbara arc, its that the clones can be individuals, and they are humans not droids. They do not always follow orders without questioning them first. This is what makes the Order 66 issue an interesting subject for the show.

    I posted this in the Carnage of Krell thread earlier, it's from TCW Blu-ray Season 1 featurettes:
  23. TaradosGon Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2003
    star 4
    If you look at Rex, he went from obeying orders without question (as the Kaminoans said the clones would in AOTC) to being one of the clones in favor of comitting "treason" against Krell. Krell's actions was really Rex's greatest test as far as pushing the limits of how far Rex would follow along with questionable orders. Dogma, who even among the clones is considered strict about discipline and obeying the chain of command, is the one to pull the trigger that kills Krell.

    One thing that hasn't really been explored (and hopefully will) is what Filoni has made the occasional comment about in regards to the galaxy at large probably not caring about nor understanding how the Sith are different from the Jedi. When there was a "Jedi Rebellion" the senate pretty much took Palpatine at his word and applauded the actions taken to "hunt them down." Few cared. We really don't even know what the senate as a whole thinks of the Jedi. They might be a valuable institution to the Republic, or they might be considered a group of monks that are a nuissance when they encroach on political issues.

    Order 66 need not be a secret from the Jedi. The senate could come up with the order in response to Krell (or there might be future issues with disillusioned Jedi coming into conflict with the clones). If the Jedi don't like it, it's not like they can do anything about it. They serve the senate, the democratic process, and the Republic. They can't do anything about it unless they want to leave the Republic, which is self-defeating.

    Hell, that could be a future episode (but almost certainly not): legislature is passed that curbs the power of the Jedi and more Jedi leave in protest and join the separatists, which would only reinforce distrust of the Jedi and further disillusion the clones as former Jedi generals leave and join the enemy. For instance, if they ever wanted to include a character like Sora Bulq, that could be an opportunity to do so.
  24. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5

    Hmmmmmnnnnn, when Karen Traviss did the same thing in her works she got screamed at by some(well, many) fans saying that she wasn't getting what Star Wars is or how the universe worked.

    Maybe Filoni can yet be caught before he makes the same tragic error.........Everybody knows that the Jedi are the good guys...............
  25. TaradosGon Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2003
    star 4
    The fans will yell at anyone that deviates from their own interpretation of the Star Wars universe, which includes when Lucas himself deviates from what fans had previously imagined the reality of Star Wars to be. Super beings on Mortis? Stupid. Anakin having an apprentice? Stupid. Seeing Mustafar prior to ROTS? Stupid. Even Piell dies at the Citadel? Stupid. Maul being resurrected? Stupid. The commerce guilds remaining neutral? stupid. The Quarren being a part of Mon Cala's governing body? Stupid. Etc. I'm not saying that I personally believe all of these are stupid, but they all had received criticism at some point because they contradicted how the fans envisioned things, when there is nothing to suggest that the fan is correct.

    The Jedi are the heroes?

    Yet the entire senate (or the vast majority of it) applaud the idea that they shall be "hunted down and defeated?" Nobody stood up for them or demanded evidence of Palpatine's claims.

    Obviously we - the viewer - know the Jedi are heroes. But Joe blow working at the factory on Coruscant (let alone peoples that don't live on Coruscant) might not care about the Jedi, and when they hear of an ex-Jedi leading the Separatist movement, that a Jedi was capable of such evil might be all that matters to them. Krell may have been a Dark Jedi, and Dooku might be a Sith, but they both became these when they - as Jedi - started to make evil/wrong decisions.
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