Clone Wars Order 66 on TCW

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by EHT, Jan 21, 2012.

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  1. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    The idea of isolation comes from the deliberate refusal to allow them to remain with their families and be raised among ordinary people. They must be raised with the Jedi, live solely among the Jedi, never have a family outside the Jedi. They do mingle among non-Jedi occasionally it seems, but that's as far as it goes.

    I need to re-read that conversation again, it must be in Stealth or Siege. I haven't read the JA books, I'm not a Jude Watson fan at all; but Anakin and Padme hitched a ride on the refugee transport; I would guess that isn't too uncommon.

    But their temple was a literal "ivory tower" and seemed set up almost like a monastery, only in order to join a monastery in RL, monks must be old enough to know what they're doing. The Jedi had the exact opposite policy.

    Also on the inflexibility, yes, the Jedi allowed Anakin to be trained (grudgingly) but they had a "one size fits all" method of training. I've worked in the public schools for almost 13 years now and there is a lot of focus on differentiation--IOW, teaching all students in exactly the same manner would not go over well, nor should it, when we're dealing with individuals with unique personalities and learning styles. The Jedi seemed to have no respect for that, as Obi-Wan was the only one who made even remote adjustments in his methodology to take into account Anakin's background and personality. Or should I say he tried to do so; he was overruled by the Council in most of his efforts.
  2. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    If an identity thief asks me for my college diploma, and I tell him my parents threw it out, is that a moral failure on my part?

    In case anyone thinks that is purely hypothetical, it actually happened to me.
  3. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    ah, thanks for clarifying...

    The book reference was when Anakin was so worried about Obi-Wan overdoing the healing thing, and thinks Obi-Wan was feeling guilty. Obi-Wan mentions that Bail had mentioned the Order's isolation (in Wild Space) and Anakin disputes that largely by saying at the time Bail didn't know Obi-Wan and certainly didn't know the Jedi.

    I defer largely to your years of teaching experience since I have no such experience, so please don't take this wrong: after all we are talking a fictional universe that is largely space opera/fantasy than real world (at least, that's how I see it, and thus grant it more leeway).

    But what you call isolation is separation from parents/family/friends, not the galaxy at large. Is it not SOMEthing like, oh basic recruits in the military, trained to duty, to mission? I agree with what I suspect you would counter with - these are children, not adults, and that is certainly a valid point, but these are also children with special abilities that they need to be trained to understand and use responsibly and in books, at least, it's implied if not said they are better off for being with other Force users in their formative years.

    I would concur if you wished to "argue" this that other Force-users does not have to mean the Jedi Order with little choice other than to pursue the selfless path of service to others (knights), or Jedi healers...

    As for JA, there is a LOT I do not like about that series but this is not the thread to go into that.
  4. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    Vader used it as a weapon against Luke, and Luke used that truth to sway Vader and defeat the Emperor. You know, the truth Obi and Yoda didn't want him to know..............

    Absolutly there are morally acceptable reasons to lie. This was not one.

    Thats all alright though because I understand that Obi-Wan has a fan club full of apologists that makes the "fess up" crowd look rather small in comparrison. After all he must be a good guy, he has an energy sword and a sharp tongue :p
  5. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    :rolleyes:

    Whether or not it worked out does not change the intent...rather than calling me an apologist and me calling you a basher, let's agree we see this differently and call it quits/no winner (unless you want to move this to the Obi-Wan thread).

    For the record, though, Obi-Wan is not perfect, nor is any Jedi or non-Jedi in my humble opinion. But I give him props for trying to do what he thinks best, even if he's mistaken on that.
  6. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I don't know that the Jedi (Obi-Wan and Yoda) ever intended on telling Luke the truth themselves, but they surely counted on the fact that Vader himself would tell Luke. If Vader telling Luke was anticipated all along, then Luke learning the truth was intended all along, regardless of whether or not the Jedi were to reveal the truth directly. I'm going to paraphrase this by memory (I don't have the movie in front of me), but there is a discussion in ROTJ between Luke and Yoda that goes something like:

    Luke: "Is Darth Vader my father?"

    Yoda: "Your father he is. Tell you did he? Unexpected this is and unfortunate."

    **The fact that it's unexpected could mean that they didn't expect Vader to tell Luke, or maybe it was just unexpected that Luke would find out so soon**

    Luke: "Unfortunate that I know the truth?"

    Yoda: "No. Unfortunate that you rushed to face him. Incomplete is your training. Not ready for the burden were you."

    Which would suggest that Yoda had every intention of Luke learning the truth, but they wanted to make sure that he had the emotional control and right frame of mind to properly deal with that information.

    As to whether the Jedi wanted Luke in the right frame of mind so that he could resist Vader using that information against him and complete the mission to kill Vader, or whether they intended Luke to redeem Vader but needed him to figure that out on his own is questionable (they curiously insist that Luke must confront Vader but don't specify that he must kill Vader, nor do they really address the Emperor at all).
  7. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    There is no indication that Yoda or Obi-wan see the Jedi as inflexable, or wrong, or out of touch etc... in the OT.

    All Jedi aren't taught the same way though. Who's to say that what one Jedi does with his Padawan is the same as what another does? The Jedi believe that training has to start at the sametime for each Jedi (which real life schools do) and they have very important reasons for that, and given the Jedi who brought down the order is the one Jedi they let in late and who had attachments, they probably had it right. They have rules for how Jedi have to conduct themselves, but again real life schools, and institutions have the same rules and guidlines on (a teacher can't moon light as a stripper, Catholic priest's can't get married etc....) on behavior.

    Thats kind of the points isn't it? Palpatine says - I was attacked, I was scarred, the Jedi attempted a coup, and a lot of the Senators support him when they shouldn't. As for that wouldn't fly irl...... good old W had less evidence that Iraq had WMD's and still went to war.

    I'm saying the Jedi wouldn't be ok with a kill order against them only as an argument against the Jedi being the ones who created order
  8. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
  9. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    Roll your eyes all you want.

    This isn't about winning and losing.

    As for me (apparently) calling you an apologist, and you taking offense to it, how come it was alright for someone to lump me into the "fess up" gang? If someone is going to categorize me then I'm going to categorize them back, its that simple.

    Why you seem to feel that it was alright for someone to do that to me, but then paint me as a villain, is quite beyond my capacity.:-B


    Oh, I think I remember the situation as clearly as you do, I'm just not willing to forgive them for being mass killers and child murders. There is no justification for their actions that includes the words honorable and selfless.
  10. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    So, after the fact, Luke was apparently ready for the burden of potentially living with the knowledge that he killed his father, he just wasn't ready to know the truth beforehand? Why? That seems extremely unfair to me.

    "Know the truth you will after killed Vader you have. Only then, ready for the knowledge of who he is you will be":p

    I think its not much of a stretch to imagine that they didn't tell Luke because it would have changed his desire to confront and kill Vader.

    In the end Luke found the way himself, using the truth and love to accomplish his mission. Two things that I believe Obi-Wan and Yoda knew very little about.
  11. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    So wouldn't that make any and every solider a mass murder?

    Compare it to the attack on Pearl Harbour. The USA (I don't say we cause I'm Canadian, though we did have interm camps too) try to capture the Japanese, put them on trail etc... The USA went to war with the Japanese, started killing, invading Japanese territory, dropped a nuclear bomb on them etc... When your country/Republic is attacked and you're one of the people who is charged with protecting it, you do your job.

    The other thing to remember is, the Clones are created to be more docile and easly commanded.

    As I said, being outside observers we KNOW they were wrong and the Jedi weren't trying to take over the Republic, they were trying to perseve it. But the Clones thought they were being attacked, they were given the Order to the defend the Republic from an attacking force.

    Oh, I think I remember the situation as clearly as you do, I'm just not willing to forgive them for being mass killers and child murders. There is no justification for their actions that includes the words honorable and selfless.
    [/quote]
  12. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    The command structure is more responsible than the rank and file, as I already mentioned.

    This is not the same situation though. What happened, in real world terms, is that the Soldiers were given the order to kill their commanding officers enmass(and presumably fellow citizens - though thats likely open to debate).

    While I can certainly sympathize with the Clones situation as a whole that doesn't forgive their guilt. And yes, if a Clone didn't pull the trigger or participate then he's not at fault, no argument there.

    Bringing real world politics and history into this doesn't do a lot for me lest we suddenly devolve into dicussing Nazi's and the like. The real world moral implications of the atomic attack on Japan, and the tens of thousands of deaths of completely innocent people don't have anything to do with Star Wars.

    I just don't see how that forgives their actions.

  13. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    How is it not the same as Pearl Harbour? Sure the Japanese were an outside force attack were the Jedi were thought to be an attack from within, but the responce is the same. If your country is being attacked, and you're in the military, its on you to defend it. Thats what the Clones were doing, putting down a resistance/rebellion. They are loyal soliders, but they are loyal to Palpatine and the Republic not the Jedi.

  14. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    Needless to say I completely disagree with everything you have to say on this issue.

    Being loyal to the Republic and being loyal to Palpatine are two completely seperate things. If they were loyal to the Republic why did they stand by as Palaptine declared himself Emperor?

    They were loyal to Palpatine, no one else. If they were loyal to the Republic then the Republic never would have fallen.

  15. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    Because the Republic cheered him on and wanted him to be the Emperor. Thats the whole point.

    Palpatine was in office longer then he should have been because he knew how to play the game and get what he wanted from the Senate. Once hte Clone Wars started he was viewed as a strong leader who the other Senators wanted in charge (not unlike how Bush's approval went up after 9/11). Then when see the birth of the Empire:

    176 INT. CORUSCANT-SENATE CHAMBER-SUNSET

    The Chancellor is in the podium in the center of the vast arena giving a speech. MAS AMEDDA stands to the right of SIDIOUS. BAIL ORGANA walks through the hallway of the Main Senate Chamber. He enters the Senate Pod of Naboo and sits next to PADME. JAR JAR, CAPTAIN TYPHO and TWO HANDMAIDENS are in the pod also.

    PALPATINE: . . . and the Jedi Rebellion has been foiled.

    BAIL ORGANA: I was held up. What's happening?

    PADME: The Chancellor has been elaborating on a plot by the Jedi, to overthrow the Senate.

    BAIL ORGANA: That's not true!

    PADME: He's been presenting evidence all afternoon.

    BAIL ORGANA: And the Senate will go along with it, just like they always do.

    PALPATINE: The remaining Jedi will be hunted down and defeated. (applause) Any collaborators will suffer the same fate.

    (applause)

    These have been trying times, but we have passed the test.

    PALPATINE: The attempt on my life has left me scarred and deformed, but I assure you my resolve has never been stronger.

    Applause.

    PALPATINE continues his speech at the podium.

    PALPATINE: The war is over. (applause) The Separatists have been defeated, (applause) and the Jedi rebellion has been foiled. We stand on the threshold of a new beginning.

    There is a long period of APPLAUSE.

    PADME: Well, this is the moment we discover if he intends to return the Republic to a democracy.

    PALPATINE: In order to ensure our security and continuing stability, the Republic will be reorganized into the first Galactic Empire, for a safe and secure society which I assure you will last for ten thousand years.

    There is a loud, sustained CHEER from the Senate. BAIL ORGANA and PADME sit, dumbfounded.

    PALPATINE: (continuing) An empire that will continue to be ruled by this august body, and a sovereign ruler chosen for life . . .

    The Senate CHEERS again. BAIL and PADME are devastated. PADME begins to cry.

    PALPATINE: (continuing) An empire ruled by the majority . . . Ruled by a new constitution . . .

    The Senate APPLAUDS.

    PADME: So this is how liberty dies, with thunderous applause . . .

    BAIL ORGANA: We cannot let this happen.

    He starts to stand up. PADME stops him.

    PADME: Not now! There will be a time.


    Why would the Clones turn on Palpatine when he forms the Empire? First they aren't too. Second the Senate is CHEERING what hes doing, they agree with it, they want it. Its not a coup or Rebellion, as what the Jedi tried was painted as/believed to be. The Clones aren't mass murders, they are soliders who followed what they deemed to be reasonable orders in responce to a Jedi Rebellion.

    And, and in regards to an earlier comments - it appears Palpatine being scared is only part of his evidence.


  16. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    I personally don't believe "because I was told too" is a defense on a moral or ethical level.

    People are resonsible for their own actions.

    You can continue your claims that what the Clones(and Palpatine for that matter) did was moral, ethical, honorable and selfless all you like. I'm just not going to buy into that propaganda.

    I have serious issues with the Jedi Order, but even my issues don't forgive the people that exucuted the genocide against them.

  17. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    I don't think you really understand the position the Clones were in and can't remove yourself from "3rd person observer".

    I also never said the Clones weren't responsible for their actions, just that they aren't immoral, mass murders because they followed an order based on a lie that a majority of people believed.

    The Clones "weren't just following orders" in the way I think you're using it. They weren't ordered to execute the Jedi. They were ordered to counter attack the Jedi AFTER the Jedi attacked the Supereme Chancellor and tried to take over the Republic.
  18. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Well a "man called Tyrannus" (i.e. Dooku) WAS responsible for recruiting the clone template (Jango). Tyranus might still hold influence with the Kaminoans, and as Filoni suggested, even if Order 66 is the Sith's secret, would the Kaminoans care? They are similar to the Trade Federation and are just out there for profit. If Order 66 was requested by the Sith, it's not like the Kaminoans are going to go, "Woah! We have to tell the Jedi about this."

    Dogma could face his trial and be condemned to death, that could alienate the clones from the Jedi if they thought that Republic justice was messed up. The whole reason the clones are so fiercely loyal to the Republic is because they were "brainwashed" to be that way. They were grown artificially on a planet outside of Republic space, and have never enjoyed the freedoms of the Republic, and yet they are fiercely loyal to the Republic because that it what the person that ordered the army wanted, and the Kaminoans complied and indoctrinated the clones with such loyalty because they Kaminoans were getting getting paid to do so.

    The clones have served the Republic for an unsepecified amount of time (since we don't know how far into the far TCW is), but the war itself is only 3 years, so it can be no longer than that, and the clones have to learn about this Republic that they serve along the way. The incident of Krell is something of an eye opener for the clones in the sense that there were never confronted with an incident like that. The Republic is supposed to be good, the Jedi are supposed to be good, and the clones take that for granted, but when faced with Krell, they were split on what to do with an evil Jedi, and what would happen if Dogma - in arguably doing what was right - is sentenced to death for that?

    I don't know what the source for the claim that the Jedi didn't know about Order 66 is. Wookieepedia doesn't claim as such and really suggests the contrary, since it is one of several contingency orders that also deal with other aspects of governnment. Unless a source is provided, I'm going to go with the assumption that the idea that the Jedi didn't know about it is speculation ("Lucas" isn't a source unless where he said it can be cited).

    If the senate is behind it, and the Jedi do know about it, then it can lend some illusion of truth to Palpatine's lie that the Jedi might kill Palpatine and Anakin and then move against the senate (in the interest of self preservation).



    I'm not suggesting that they were going to wait and tell him after Vader was dead, I mean they would have told him after his training was complete (or at least when his training was further along) but before he confronted Vader. Luke's training didn't go as planned at all, he abandoned it as soon as he had visions about his friends dying, and returned later just in time for Yoda to die.
  19. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    Absolutly I can.

    I'm saying that if I was a soldier and I was given an order to shoot my superior officer in the back of the head that I would not do so because it is morally and ethically wrong.

    The Clone Troopers in TCW's have not been presented as the blindly loyal soldiers needed to commit such an Order without question, and I'm suggesting thats not an accurate characterization.

    But thats what I think they are.

    Again though your using the legal position of Palpatine to justify the Clones actions. Laws, particularly those inverted by Palpatine, don't have anything to do with morals and ethics. People can think for themselves to decide if a course of action is right or wrong, the Clone Commanders recieving Order 66 choose not to do so. They blindly follow an order to shoot their former commanding officers(and even friends) in the back.

    Its not alright just because Palpatine says it is.
  20. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2


    First wookiepedia does say the Jedi didn't know about ORder 66, right here - http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Order_66 - in the "behind the scene" section

    And you're right, the Krell stuff really just makes the Clones actions more.....understandable. I don't think that story is needed for it all to make sense, but it certainly helps.

    We dunno if Yoda and/or Obi-wan had any intention of telling Luke the truth about Vader. Both seem pretty sure Vader is beyond saving and neededs to be destorye
  21. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    W. at least had some support, he didn't take unilateral action and then come back and inform the government of the invasion. We don't really know much about anything involving Order 66 outside of EU. We know it was a contingency order. The Jedi could feasibly agree to the creation of a contingency order. The senate would have to be the ones to develop that, but the Jedi could consent to it, otherwise it boils down to clones breaking the law and facing court martial even if another Jedi like Krell pops up. I'd think that such a development (if it occurred this way) would be a little premature after Krell, but if TCW ever explored the idea of Dooku's acolytes and other Jedi that turn to the Dark Side, it could be more believable. To my knowledge, Lucas has never confirmed that Order 66 meant kill all Jedi. If Order 66 had been sent to Cody but no other clone commanders it might simply have meant "Kill Kenobi" not kill all Jedi everywhere. But since all the clone commanders received the same order, that's how it worked out in practice. But in Cody's head, he might have no knowledge that other clone commanders are receiving the same order.

    If there was a precendent in which Palpatine (as Chancellor) had been referred to as "Lord" it wouldn't bug me, but Order 66 in how it is carried out makes it sound like it itself is a coup. As though everyone already knew what was going to happen and that it was pretty much Sidious saying "OK, lets do it!" Sidious also begins talking to Cody by telling him "the time has come" as though Cody was pretty much on standby anticipating the order, but just waiting for it.

    The problem with the Roman comparison though is that Caesar was a general who had won over the personal loyalty of his troops (not the Entire Roman army, just his own personal army). Palpatine in contrast would have to win over the personal loyalty of ALL the clones (or the vast majority of them, not just a single battalion) and since he is not a general on the front lines bonding with the troops, I would not know how he could feasibly earn that loyalty, and then approach all of the clones and bring them up to speed on his plot to create an Empire without the Jedi knowing.

    1. Clones call Sidious "lord" (a title only used in reference of the Sith)
    2. Sidious tells Cody "the time has come."
    3. Utapaun and Wookiee resistance fighters are rounded up (why? they were the clones' allies)
    4. Trooper threatens to shoot Bail when Bail demanded what was going on and didn't buy their claim of a Jedi Rebellion
    5. The clones are smart, so if there was actually a Jedi Rebellion going on, why would a "the war is over, return to Coruscant" message work as a trap for the Jedi?

    Instead it all just comes across like Palpatine might as well be saying "proceed with Operation Empire" and the clones know what to do about killing the Jedi and eliminating all witnesses. But the problem with that is how did Palpatie orchestrate all this, unless Order 66 was put into them from the beginning, which would fall more into the "brainwashed" idea of things that some fans have an issue with.

  22. sluggo Jedi Knight

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    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    Sure W didn't act first like Palpatine did, but the comparison is still there. The leader lies to everyone, and people agree and go along.

    Again, I doubt the Jedi would agree to a kill order against them. Sorry, but a group of individuals isn't going to give their lives over the Senate, Chancellor and Clones, its not going to happen. Espically considering the council doesn't really trust Palpatine to begin with. As for the order to just be - kill your commander - then Padawans wouldn't have been killed and the attack ont he temple itself wouldn't have happened. Never mind the Clones setting up a destress call to try to lure more Jedi into a trap.

    Order 66 was a coup, just a coup hidden behind a made up Jedi coup.

    As for Roman, first its a comparison, not an excate re-telling. Also, this is what is said about the clones
  23. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I was not saying that a Jedi would say "hey, how about we create an order that would allow the clones to kill us." But I'm saying if the senate wanted to pass something like that in response to Krell (or more likely following several such incidents) that the Jedi might consent. Obviously not if it said "kill all Jedi" but if it was just an Order to kill the commanders, possibly.

    As to why they kill the younglings, I don't know. I'm just throwing out possibilities of what they could do, not what I think they will do (since I have no idea).

    The Wookiees are never rounded up. We just see a clone walk over to a crashed vehicle and comment "all of these wookiees are dead" which made it sound like they were hunting for survivors. The case of the wookiees is more vague, but on Utapau we see the Utapaun freedom fighters being put on transports (it's going on when Obi-Wan Kenobi is sneaking around and makes his way to Grievous' ship. To my knowledge, Palpatine has been referred to as "sir" just like everyone else in TCW. Nobody calls Anakin lord, but he becomes a "lord" to his subordinates when he becomes a Sith. Palpatine is usually referred to simply as "chancelor" or "your excellency." Order 66 marks the first time to my knowledge that he is referred to as lord by anyone that doesn't know he is a Sith (if the clones don't know).

    Krell made orders of the clones too and they killed him because it wasn't right. TCW has established that what Lama Su claims in AOTC isn't true. They're less independent when they first are deployed, but they've developed personalities and do have a sense of moralty. When the issue of Order 66 comes down, it's hard to believe that they would kill their generals - the ones that actually treat them as human beings - unless something happened that turns the Jedi into villains in the clones' eyes, or unless they were brainwashed.
  24. sluggo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2001
    star 2
    No one, not even the Jedi, would consent to having a kill order issued against them. Its not going to happen that way. The Jedi don't trust Palpatine to begin with and you think they are going to give him that level of control and power over them? If Mace knew there was an order like that out there, don't you think he'd do something about it before he went to expose Palpatine as a Sith and try to arrest him? Nevermind kill him, which is probably somethinghe'd be arrested for? No, there is no evidence and it makes no sense for the Jedi to know about Order 66. The ONLY way the Jedi know about it is if Palpatine draws it up with them as one thing (ie - remove your Jedi commander from duty) in responce to Krell and then changes it without their knowledge. But if he can change it without their knowledge, why go through all that int he first place? And again the Jedi wouldn'tknow what they were really facing.

    Clones coul dbe hunting for their surviving allies. I never read anything evil into that line.

    TCW wasn't around when GL wrote RotS, so reading into Cody calling him Lord......it could be thats just how GL, then, thought the Clones would speak to him.

    Were they loyal to Krell or to the Republic? If their ultimate loyality is to the Republic, not to Krell...... Plus with Krell they were acting out of self presevation, with Palpatine they were following an order from the leader of their government. And Order 66 turned the Jedi into villians in the clones eyes. They turned on Palpatine and on the Republic.
  25. QuangoFett Force Ghost

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    Jun 11, 2011
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    I'm interested. What evidence do you have to back this up?

    The deviant Cut deserting? The mentally broken Dogma killing someone he shouldn't? An ARC Trooper going on a rogue mission to bolster the Republic war effort? The 501st and 212th troopers - including Appo, a known executor of Order 66 - deciding to apprehend their Jedi general once it becomes crystal clear to them that he is going against the interests of the Republic?

    How do any of these situations compare to Order 66?

    ROTS shows Order 66 to be beyond a simple order for the clones to treat like the ones they're given by the Jedi. It comes from the very top of the command structure and for genetic reasons explained in AOTC, they are bound from the depths of their brain chemistry to obey it. If there is some leeway for orders coming from Jedi Generals, there is practically none for this contingency order.

    Remember what happens when Rex has Krell at gunpoint after resolving to kill him? He physically cannot pull the trigger. Some could interpret that as Rex being written as indecisive, but that to me seems like as big a sign as any that killing a Jedi is not something a clone can decide to do on their own initiative. An insane clone is the only one who can do this.

    To pull that trigger, Rex needs to hear four key words from a certain person...
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