PT Order 66 Questions

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by CloneTrooperFox, Jan 29, 2013.

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  1. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    We've already begun encoding information in DNA and there are many examples in the animal kingdom of animals born able to walk and use vocal communication; The Kaminoans are already accelerating clones growth and compressing their learning time, it's not a massive leap to imagine encoding a clone to be able to walk, talk and reason.

    In AOTC the I think the youngest clones we saw out of their tanks were played by Daniel Logan:
    [IMG]
    I think he was about 12..? Doesn't the Kaminoan say it takes 10 years to grow a clone to full size, too? I'm working from memory here, so I could easily have that wrong. What I'm inferring is that they come out of their bubbling tunes looking prepubescent, then rapidly mature to adulthood within ten years.
    Last edited by V-2, Feb 1, 2013
  2. 16AndPregnant Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2013
    star 1
    But before that you said he should have sent it out to every Clone Commander at once.
  3. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    The novelization specified that the order was given once, then relayed.

    Which means that the ones who appear 10 would really be 5, etc. It doesn't mean they are born looking 10.

    We were told that they were started 5 years ago.

    But not the kind of "information" that would be known to the organism represented by the genetic code.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Feb 1, 2013
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  4. Sitara Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2001
    star 3
    That's not how it happened in the movie. We saw Sidious say, "Commander Cody the time has come, execute order 66'

    Even if it was relayed, the message would be for Commander Cody, not any other clone commander, so why would they execute the order?
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  5. CloneTrooperFox Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2013
    star 1
    So cody was the only one that was givin the order for the other clones to execute order 66? Is this correct? Because if the other clone commanders would have givin the orders it would have taken hours to execute order 66?
  6. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    I'm under the impression that he called Cody first and then conference hologrammed the rest except for Gree(maybe).
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  7. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    If they only started 5 years ago, yet Jango's unaltered clone is 12, something is amiss.

    Just because we've not got as far as a scifi film in terms of genetic engineering does not limit the possibilities of scifi. As I said, many animals are born able to walk (or swim or crawl or whatever) and able to 'speak' and understand their mother's call, etc. Programming those features into modified humans is hardly unimaginable (to be honest I took it for granted that that was what was going on).

    I'll take your word for the info in the AOTC novelization, I couldn't finish it.
  8. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Boba is 10, not 12, in AoTC.
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  9. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    The point still stands, if they started 5 years ago yet Boba is 10, something is amiss.
  10. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Suggesting the first order (of 3 million odd) wasn't the only one.

    During the TCW series- there's a big debate over "buying more clones"- maybe the Kaminoan's grew them as a precaution before the war, knowing that the 3 million would be much less than the Republic needed, and expecting that when they started asking for more, it would be handy to actually have them immediately available.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Feb 2, 2013
  11. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    If you're saying animals are born with various traits, why would similar traits need to be "programmed" into humans? Also, the link you posted before had nothing to do with the programming of knowledge of the sort that would be available to the subject. It would only be readable by someone looking at the DNA.

    You assumed that the clones originate at a prepubescent age, but as far as I know that is not supposed to be the case. But the main point here is that Order 66 was not genetically programmed ( in fact, according to certain EU, it was not preprogrammed at all ). That's not how genetics works. You can't put an order into DNA.

    I was referring to the ROTS novelization. Order 66 covered in the AOTC novelization would have been... premature.

    No, nothing is amiss. Boba was born 5 years before they were started.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Feb 2, 2013
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  12. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    The issue is- why are the clones staggered, if all the clones of Sifo-Dyas's original order were delivered fairly early in the war?

    The clones "started 5 years ago" must be in addition to those.
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  13. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    I can't put an order into DNA, but I'm not a Kaminoan geneticist from a galaxy far far away.

    The 'traits' I describe are not naturally present in humans. It is feasible that humans could be modified to gestate for longer, or at an accelerated pace (as seen and described in AOTC) and programmed (I use the term in a gene science sense) with the ability to walk, feed themselves, communicate, etc. Insect language seems to be innate, one can start new colonies with zero social interaction with the progenitor and observe the same chemical and kinetic signals. To me, that demonstrates that a lexicon is something that could be programmed into genes.

    It would be economic for the Kaminoans to bypass the early stages of human development to save resources on, well, childcare. Given that it's a crucial time for brain development under normal circumstances, and given the uniformity of personality and behaviour exhibited by the clones themselves, I think it's safe to assume that there's some programming mechanism or procedure at work; I'd assume that would have to be biological.
  14. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    They're consistently described as "aging at twice the normal rate"- which may mean that they don't bypass the early stages- but those early stages last half the time.

    "Creche" is also used in relation to Cody, in the RoTS novel:

    Cody responded as he had been trained since before he had even awakened in his creche-school. "It will be done, my lord."

    Implying that the Kaminoans do in fact have to deal with infant clones.
  15. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    I didn't mean you specifically. I meant the colloquial "you". Meaning they can't do it either.

    Similar traits required by the clones, if not naturally present, are learned by humans. Thus they can be just as easily learned by young clones during the maturation process, so there would be no need for implantation of such things. There is really no economic impediment if the role of technology is taken into account.

    But does AOTC actually say that clones gestate longer or at an accelerated pace? It may seem like it's describing a process which involves the latter, but we certainly don't see any such thing taking place.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Feb 2, 2013
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  16. V-2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 4
    "..as he had been trained since before he had even awakened" implies he literally awoke in his school having already been 'trained'. Subconsciously or genetically, take your pick.
  17. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Subconsciously. Tends to fit in with the way other SW authors have handled cloning- the concept that it is possible to "imprint" all of a person's training, memories, etc on their clone.

    Given that we see "normal" training in TCW- would suggest that not everything, or even most things, are imprinted in the case of the Kamino clones though.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Feb 2, 2013
  18. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

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    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
  19. rumsmuggler Chosen One

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    Aug 31, 2000
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    That particular batch was five years old. Boba has no growth acceleration.
  20. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
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    If they'd showed a batch of clones that looked Boba's age, which had been "decanted five minutes ago"- then I'd understand the hypothesis- but they didn't.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Feb 2, 2013
  21. AmazingAhsokaT Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2013
    I was wondering that too! i think it was programmed in to them when they were being cloned or something? a special order that they HAD to follow...but i'm not sure and i bet most of them did...but maybe not some, because they had to be given the order and maybe not all of them got the order.
  22. Darth Vader's Chest Plate Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2013
    star 1
    As the Jedi utilised this clone army, why at no point did they not think to look into their training in depth? If they did they would have seen the orders which were imprinted/programmed.
  23. Seagoat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2013
    star 4
    It's not like Order 66 was just "KILL TEH JEDIZ". To be precise, it was worded as "In the event of Jedi officers acting against the interests of the Republic, and after receiving specific orders verified as coming directly from the Supreme Commander (Chancellor), GAR commanders will remove those officers by lethal force, and command of the GAR will revert to the Supreme Commander (Chancellor) until a new command structure is established."
  24. Darth Vader's Chest Plate Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2013
    star 1
    Officers, implying that more than 1 are acting against the intersts of the republic. Which would be a bit odd wouldn't it?
    Also why be specific of Jedi officers, not just commanding officers?
    Just find it a bit strange that this wouldn't have been contemplated by one of the Jedi, especially given the cloak and dagger way in which they found themselves with an army at their disposal.
  25. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    I think there should have been some clones that argued back a little.
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