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PT Padmé Amidala MEGAthread - Don't look at her that way. It makes her uncomfortable

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Ganesh Ujwal, Dec 31, 2014.

  1. Ganesh Ujwal

    Ganesh Ujwal Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Dec 7, 2014
    According to Episode III:


    Medically healthy humans don't die for no good reason.
    So what did Padmé die of, and how did they even know she was dying?
     
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  2. CommanderDrenn

    CommanderDrenn Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 19, 2013
    Sadness because she lost a love we were supposed to believe she had.
     
  3. Cushing's Admirer

    Cushing's Admirer Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jun 8, 2006
    She died of a broken heart and contrary to how many act, dying of grief can happen though usually it does combine with physical decline. Grief is a perfectly valid reason.
     
  4. Darth_Nub

    Darth_Nub Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2009
    Moving to PT from Saga
     
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  5. redlightning

    redlightning Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 1, 2014
    It would have been better for them to have said she died of complications from giving birth or she had internal bleeding from when Anakin choked her.
     
  6. Oissan

    Oissan Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2001
    No, it wouldn't have. That would have removed the entire point of the scene. Padme was completely devastated by what Anakin did, her whole world came crashing down, the person she loves the most turned into a mockery of himself and tried to hurt/kill her. As Cushing's Admirer said, dying of grief is a perfectly valid reason, though obviously more common with old people. It's not that rare to see the surviving person of a very old couple detoriating and dying rather quickly after the partner has died, even when health was hardly an issue before. Young people would probably need an earth-shattering event for it to happen, but this is very much the case here.
     
  7. Rachel_In_Red

    Rachel_In_Red Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    May 12, 2013
    C'mon.

    She had just given birth to twins, and she "lost the will to live" just because the dad turned out to be a jerk? Please. How many women in this world are doing well raising children under circumstances like that? No mother with even with a trace of resiliency (and Padme shows quite a bit up until that point) is going to quit on her children just because things didn't work out with the father.

    Love Star Wars, but Padme's death was poorly done.
     
  8. Mindless Monster

    Mindless Monster Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 4, 2014
    The movies are fantasy. Of course she died of a broken heart. I think some people watch Star Wars as though it's a documentary and the events happened in real-time.
     
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  9. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Exactly.

    If the "entire point of the scene" was that Padme could not possibly live without her man and/or allowed his behavior to affect her that much, the "entire point of the scene" is pretty damn terrible.

    The "mockery" here is how Padme's ROTS (lack of) character made a mockery of the strong, independent woman she was in TPM and AOTC.
     
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  10. Prequel_Rubbish

    Prequel_Rubbish Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2014
    The plot killed her.
     
  11. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 24, 2005
    With all due respect, those women don't have to live with the fact that their jerkface husband had basically sold his soul to the devil, slaughtered children and helped transform the country into a totalitarian dictatorship.

    Though I do agree, it was poorly done. From the first two movies, we got the idea that Padme was a fighter in both the political field and out in battle. She wasn't one to crumple under immense pressure, she was going to get things done one way or another. Knowing this, Padme should have died from the injuries, not a broken heart. The Padme of the first two movies would keep fighting until her body literally couldn't move anymore.

    Cushy- I do agree, dying of a broken heart is valid, but look at Padme's character. Does she seem like the kind of person who would crack when she's got children, two Jedi, and Bail Organa to basically give her a reason to keep fighting? Or would she hang on to the bitter end? Obi-Wan basically saw his entire family dead in the Temple, people he's known since he was an infant. He basically found out that the very government he once fought for is now no more, in its place is an Empire. He basically had to fight the boy he once trained to the death on Mustafar, mutilate him, and watch him burn.

    Anyone who went through that might, understandably, decide to commit suicide because they've lost the will to keep going, but Obi-Wan didn't turn his lightsaber onto himself. Why? Because if he did, or attempted to do so, it would've been an insult to his character, an insult to everything we've known about Obi-Wan. If we had such a scene where Obi-Wan is contemplating impaling himself on his own lightsaber and Yoda has to talk him out of it, what would you think?

    In short, while yes losing the will to live/committing suicide after such a horrific turn of events such as what we witnessed in ROTS is understandable, story-telling wise and from what we know of their characters, Padme's dying of a broken heart and Obi-Wan's hypothetical suicide attempt do not, at all, make sense.
     
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  12. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    I don't know that a "Who has bigger problems" argument is worthwhile or relevant to the overall point. But I agree with the rest of your post.
     
  13. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 24, 2005
    My point was that it's an insult to the character, not who's got the bigger problems.
     
  14. Rachel_In_Red

    Rachel_In_Red Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    May 12, 2013
    There are plenty of women who have suffered through far more difficult relationship situations (chronic abuse far beyond one single choke hold) than Padme experienced with Anakin in ROTS and managed to keep on for the sake of their children. And even right before Anakin did choke her, she seemed willing to look past all his sins and run off to the Naboo countyside with him and raise their children together. And even still, at the very end, she tells Obi-Wan that she thinks there's still good in him. And then two seconds later she dies of a "broken heart," which I don't even know how someone in their 20s dies due to their emotional state. Pills, a knife or gun shot in response to an emotional state certainly happens a lot, but not just dying of the emotional state itself.

    There's no way to defend this scene. It's ridiculous any way you slice it.
     
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  15. HevyDevy

    HevyDevy Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2011
    I understand why it would be a cop-out for many, but it the implied symbiosis between the two characters could be seen as kind of romantic.

    The good in Anakin fades as Padme's strength does, and Padme can't go on if Anakin symbolically no longer exists. They can't exist without each other.

    But to each their own.
     
  16. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    Anakin's turn to the Darkside wasn't just him being a "jerk" to her. It was him making the choice to abandon all that is good, (regardless of his intentions) and between him and the emperor (who was also Padme's supposed friend for many years), the two of them did more than just be jerks-they were ultimately responsible for the eradication of the Jedi, the fall of the republic, conspiracy, murder, and the turning point in the saga that brought about the death of democracy/liberty within the galaxy. That's A lot to swallow from someone you have pledged your life and dedicated your heart to – definitely majorly life-changing. And it is FAR more than just being a jerk, And would be overwhelming to anybody who is as directly and centrally involved as Padme was....

    I will agree that Padme's death could've done better-I would have preferred that she died because Darth Vader killed her. That would've been much more convincing if that was how it played out. But I think they were just going for something a bit more… Romantic/tragic. Dying of a broken heart seems like one of those classic thematic elements for tragedy, such as we have seen in older stories like ancient myths and what not-things that George Lucas commonly drew inspiration from.
     
  17. enigmaticjedi

    enigmaticjedi Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Nov 2, 2011
    It would have been better if this were said:

    Medical Droid: "There were minor complications from the pregnancy. Although the chance for surviving these minor complications is usually over 90%, it's apparent that her recent grief is signficantly lowering her chances of surviving."
     
  18. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    This. I've always felt that at the very least, it would be more convincing if they said that any complications with childbirth, put together with her being choked by Anakin as well as all of the things and mental anguish that she has witnessed and gone through regarding Anakin was just too much for her to handle physically, when combined...
     
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  19. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Or because life is worth hanging onto, or because nobody should allow another person to have that much power over his or her well-being and happiness.

    I'd find Padme's death horrible even if she did not have children.

    I get that Lucas was going for the romantic/symbiosis/whatever but I didn't find it romantic at all; it's about as romantic as Romeo and Juliet committing suicide over each other, but their excuse for stupidity was that they were 13.
     
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  20. Prequel_Rubbish

    Prequel_Rubbish Jedi Knight star 3

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    Dec 5, 2014
    To be fair, Anakin acted like he was 13 throughout the movies.
     
  21. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Padme didn't though.
     
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  22. Prequel_Rubbish

    Prequel_Rubbish Jedi Knight star 3

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    Dec 5, 2014
    Which makes their "love" even more unbelievable and unwatchable.
     
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  23. Master_Lok

    Master_Lok Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2012
    I see it as a combination of grief and Anakin's choke hold.
     
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  24. Cushing's Admirer

    Cushing's Admirer Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jun 8, 2006
    Link: I think many people are tainting this with confused ideas of strength or weakness of character. I believe that's an error. That has nothing to do with it. Whether or not anyone else around her 'cracked' is irreverent. Did she have reason to live? Not according to what unfolded. When one is grief-stricken or suicidal that person isn't operating rationally. Variations of what happen here in such threads happens in RL, people assume to jeer and judge and dismiss. Never seeing or realising what's needed is compassion and patience in the majority of cases. She couldn't cope with what happened and what it meant. It's sad but it doesn't mean she's pathetic as many claim.

    Likewise, contrary to how many here act, there's nothing wrong with applying a RL lens to fantasy works. I don't have two sets of standards and I'm not changing now. :p
     
  25. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    She absolutely had reason to live. Why should her existence depend upon Anakin's behavior?