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Palpatine used the Force in the elevator shaft

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by Darth_Ogawa, Feb 1, 2006.

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  1. Darth_Ogawa

    Darth_Ogawa Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Jun 16, 2005
    As Palpatine was falling down the elevator shaft with Anakin and Obi-Wan when the runaway elevator was about to hit them, he loses his grip on Anakin's leg.

    Then as they approach the next elevator shaft opening while falling, Palpatine suddenly grips onto Obi-Wan's leg like it's easy slinging himself into the opening.

    It seems like they would at least notice Palpatine's quick reactions at that moment and maybe should have suspected that he was more than just a politician!
     
  2. theBluePhoenix

    theBluePhoenix Jedi Master star 3

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    Jan 4, 2001
    You said "shaft".
     
  3. Darth_Ogawa

    Darth_Ogawa Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Jun 16, 2005
    hu huh. Yeah! Yeah!!

    Well, I guess it's good Palpatine didn't use his Force grip on Obi-Wan's shaft and grabbed his leg instead!
     
  4. Darth_Sidious-

    Darth_Sidious- Jedi Youngling star 2

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    Nov 14, 2005
    Who's dat cat that won't walk out, when there's trouble all about...SHAFT! Dats what I'm talkin' bout baby.
     
  5. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    It's called CGI. Palpatine didn't use the Force, otherwise Anakin and Obi-wan would both sense it.
     
  6. Rossignol

    Rossignol Jedi Youngling

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    May 28, 2005
    If that fall down the elevator had gone slightly wrong, do you think Palpatine would have been forced to use the force in order to prevent his death? Do you think he had so much faith in Anakin that he never considered this?

    Also, if Palpatine had used the force, would Obi-Wan and Anakin actually have been able to sense it, considering he had been able to conceal his abilities with the force from the entire Jedi Order whilst on Coruscant?
     
  7. TomPiltoff

    TomPiltoff Jedi Youngling star 2

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    Apr 7, 2005
    It's CGI? You mean that isn't Ian McDiarmid plummeting down an elevator shaft? Thanks for that.

    The original poster is asking about the way Palpatine seems to effortlessly slide out of the elevator shaft. Which would lead us to believe

    A.) Palpatine used the Force, which the Jedi should sense.

    or

    B.) Palpatine did not use the Force, in which case I hope there's a good in-universe answer, because it's just sloppy to show an 80 year old man doing stuff like that.
     
    ObiWanKnowsMe likes this.
  8. mandragora

    mandragora Jedi Master star 4

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    May 28, 2005
    or C.) he did use the Force, but with all the action going on the Jedi were a little bit too busy and focussed on the rescue to concentrate on whether Palpatine might use the Force for a fraction of a second then.

    Actually, I found the scene quite funny. Without all the chaos surrounding them I think they would no doubt have noticed that "you must have Jedi reflexes" to pull off what Palpatine did.
     
  9. LLL

    LLL Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jul 16, 2000
    Yeah, I saw that! I was like, "OMG -- they dropped Palpy!"

    Who's to say that somebody didn't realize they dropped Palpy and use the Force on him to pull him back up so he could get a grip?

    It's the only thing that makes sense. He's not going to use the Force in front of Anakin and Obi-Wan.

    Pssst, Palpy is 60 there, not 80.
     
  10. lighteninggun

    lighteninggun Jedi Youngling star 3

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    Sep 17, 2003
    And it is NOT a foregone conclusion they would have sensed it. Isn't he using the force to hide his identity?
     
  11. TomPiltoff

    TomPiltoff Jedi Youngling star 2

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    Apr 7, 2005
    Yeah, but I'd imagine actively moving an object with the Force would send out a tremor, whereas simply using it to hide wouldn't.
     
  12. TheCRZA

    TheCRZA Jedi Padawan star 4

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    May 29, 2005
    It's also CGI when Anakin uses the force to feed the fruit to Padme in AOTC.
    Bad CGI.
    Bad Force usage.

    I don't want to be the guy that breaks the Santa rule to anyone here,
    but depicting the Force in SW films requires special effects.
    Because... the force isn't real.
     
  13. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    My point about the CGI is that it makes it easier to have Palpatine make a smooth catch. Realistically, it wouldn't be that smooth. However, you don't have to be a Jedi or a Sith to catch someone's leg. It's common in films for people to do the impossible without being superpowered. Palpatine doesn't need the Force to simply reach out and grab ahold. The reflexes aren't dependent on the Force. Only when it's something like blasters or fighting. Simply reaching out isn't that difficult.

    Who is to say that Palpatine wasn't an athlete when he was younger, before going into politics?
     
  14. Darth_Ogawa

    Darth_Ogawa Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Jun 16, 2005
    Maybe he didn't use the Force very overtly, but I think he may have sneakily tapped into it for just a split second while utilizing only minimal Force usage therefore still being able to maintain that cloud of stealth around him so they wouldn't notice anything.
     
  15. mandragora

    mandragora Jedi Master star 4

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    May 28, 2005
    Obi and Anakin were struggling for their own lives in that fall, everything happened within fractions of seconds - why is it so hard to believe that they simply were too focussed on other things to notice that for a fraction of a sec Palp used the Force?
     
  16. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    Because the second Palpatine uses it, they'll feel it and identify it in him right away. Palpatine has remained hidden by not using the Force in the presence of the Jedi. To do so would endanger things.
     
  17. mandragora

    mandragora Jedi Master star 4

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    May 28, 2005
    I think it depends to what degree this usage causes a tremor in the Force. I think of Force sensitivity as kind of a sixth sense, which works similar to the usual five senses. The "louder" the Force tremor, the more likely they are to hear hear it. If it isn't that loud and is lasting only for a fraction of a second, and if they are busy struggling for their lives at that moment - plus don't forget Obi had just regained consciousness - I think there's a very good chance for them to miss it. I mean, how often do we miss something we normally are able to hear if we are in the midst of a situation of chaos. Even though they are Jedi, they are still human, they aren't some kind of recording machine. It is to be expected that they don't catch every detail that happens in such a situation, even if they are Jedi, I think.
     
  18. yoshifett

    yoshifett Jedi Knight star 5

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    Apr 17, 2004
    C.) It's Star Wars and thus inherently unrealistic. Shortcuts are made to service the plot. That's it. The same can be said about the Indiana Jones movies. Everyone shots at Indy, he never dies. The storm troopers shoot at our heroes and they never get shot.
     
  19. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    It's not hard to believe that Palpatine just managed to grab on at the right time. It's happened in all kinds of action films.
     
  20. yoshifett

    yoshifett Jedi Knight star 5

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    Apr 17, 2004
    Exactly, that's what I was trying to say. Action movies are inherently unrealistic and suspension of disbelief is necessary.
     
  21. Droid

    Droid Jedi Master star 1

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    Feb 28, 2000
    If Palpatine has the ability to use the force to save himself from falling down a shaft then maybe he didn't really die at the end of ROTJ.
     
  22. Obi-Chron

    Obi-Chron Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 11, 2003
    QGJ explains to Shmi that being strong in the force allows one to anticipate things before they occur. So Palps does not have to manipulate events in the elevator. He is able to anticipate what is about to occur with lightning quick reflexes and still remain undetected by the two Jedi.
     
  23. Darth_Joshy

    Darth_Joshy Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Aug 29, 2005
    LMAO
     
  24. Obi-Chron

    Obi-Chron Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 11, 2003
    Consider also that the shaft holds mythic symbolism on several fronts:

    It is in one way symbolic of the plight facing the republic -- how Anakin and Obi-Wan do their respective parts to win the war, while Palpatine rides their coat tails and comes out smelling like a Utapauian rose.

    Mythic falling into shadow indicatesan unleashing of one's destructive powers.

    Falling in Jungian and Freudian dream symbolism represents an unfulfilled need, often for one who feels misunderstood or misrepresented or pertaining to a matter of personal failure -- all three of the falling individuals have failed in some way already at this early point in the movie: Obi-Wan has failed in his second attempt against Dooku, rescued by his former Padawan and carried to safety like luggage; Palpatine has not been able to divorce Anakin from his attachment to his mentor, Obi-Wan; and Anakin completely failed the Jedi code, killeing Dooku in revenge, letting his emotions get the better of him.

    Dream falling also indicates an impending adversity facing the dreamer, a major conflict looming that demands resolution. So the elevator shaft could have much more meaning than merely an Fx backdrop to a plot transition.
     
  25. Dezdmona

    Dezdmona Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 9, 2005
    A Utapauian rose?@};- A rare rose indeed Obi-Chron.

    A well written and interesting analogy on dream interpretation.
     
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