PT Palpatine's "Scars"

I always took it to be that the "scars and deformity" were his true appearance, hidden previously for political image.

After his duel with Windu, I would argue that he loses the ability to hide it any longer (or sees the advantages of giving it up) and thus spins it into being because of the "attempt" on his life. My main problem with his own account being true is that, despite all the inconsistencies with what happens to Luke and the others, it could give you a sense of sympathy for him. That should never be an emotion associated with the character. And y'know, if he has mastered that art of keeping himself alive beyond the natural course of his life, one could assume he's a very old man indeed - something which would explain where the look originates from, if you're not happy with the whole changeling or additional sith power theory.

But it remains ambiguous enough for you to make of it what you will.

 

why don't we see "his true face" under his sidious hood when he is sidious? all through the pt and tcw, palps and sidious are played as two different people. it would've made more sense to separate the two people even more by having palps look normal and sidious look horrible.

sidious never looks horrible when he's by himself or with other sith lords, which he should because he wouldn't have to be hiding his "true face".

 

yeah I agree with theJeditraitor.

As I've said I much prefer the scarred by lightning theory,

he was prepared to be deformed to suit his own goals, that's very much in his character.

I think some (including the cast and crew) took the "it's his true face" a tad too literally.

 

Yoda: " Blind we are, if creation of this clone army we could not see."

Mace: " I think it is time we inform the Senate that our ability to use the Force has diminished."

Yoda : " Only the Dark Lord of the Sith knows of our weakness. If informed the Senate is, multiply our adversaries will."

At the end of the film...

Yoda: " The shroud of the Dark Side has fallen."

... so by the beginning of AOTC, the Jedi's powers and abilities had already diminished significantly, due to the resurgence of the Dark Side and the Sith. It's not so much they were 'dumb' , but they couldn't see through the "Shroud of the Darkside" ...they could sense the Dark Side was around or near the Chancellor, but could not see through the darkness to get clear facts . So I could definitely see him using the Force to hide in plain sight right in front of them, and the Jedi feeling something wasn't right, but could not see or clarify what or who.

 

yeah I prefer the "he didn't use the force around them so there was nothing to detect" approach myself,

but hey, the glory of fiction right? take what you want from it.

As for the "dark-side of the force surrounds the chancellor" Mace says in ROTS, I just chalk that up to another WTF moment like "prophecy misread could have been" I know ROTS is nearly everyone's fave prequel, but I personally think Lucas had run out of steam at that point.

 

it's not a wtf moment at all.

in aotc we see mace and yoda talking about the dark side clouding them out. by rots they have their suspicions that the sith lord is somewhere close by and they put anakin close to the chancellor because they suspect this. in the scene you're talking about they have figured out it's the chancellor. great writing.

 

and have figured out it's the chancellor in that scene.
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I don't think they have until Anakin actually tells them, sure they have their suspicions but I don't think they know by that scene.

In any event, to keep on topic I don't like the idea of Palpatine using the force to mask anything in front of the Jedi, seems a tad overdone to me....WHICH is why I prefer the lightning deformed him theory better.

 

There's some interesting discussion on the matter of Sith disfigurement in the Plagueis book. Plag and Palp ponder if disfigurement is avoidable or if it is an inherent and inevitable side effect of being steeped in dark force powers. Altho they are unable to make any definitive conclusions, I think the point of the discussion was to infer that what eventually happens to Palp (and what happens for a time with Plag, until he figures out how to get his midiclorians to rejuvenate his body) is a result of the dark side and not the lighting. the Plag book isnt canon any more but i still think the information is interesting nonetheless.

my fav lines of the discussion:
Palp:“Will I eventually be physically transformed?”
Plag: “Into some aged, pale-skinned, raspy-voiced, yellow-eyed monster, you mean? Such as the one you see before you?”

 

I also prefer the disfigurement being due to a Dark Side effect rather than lightning. We see Anakin, Obi-Wan & Luke all zapped by lightning with no physical scarring at all. I'd argue that Luke received the most intense lightning barrage of all & not a wrinkle.

 

like i've said, none of them were a conduit for it where it was coming out and going back into them repeatedly being reflected back by a saber.

 

Yeah maybe. In-universe it could go either way. I prefer other factors at play than just the lightning.

 

I like to think of it as both:

- As has been stated in various EU books ( and now no longer canon, but it WAS at the time, so I'm counting it), long-term Dark-Side use would transform a person. I believe we saw some of this transformation in earnest in AOTC, as Palpatine is noticeably more aged and haggard looking. And considering sidious was one of the most powerful users at that point, it was taking a toll on him. He could no longer keep up the "mask" of Palpatine as well, as he was dealing with so many things over such a long period of time....think of a person under a lot of stress for an extended period of time. They look and seem tired.

- By ROTS, his appearance has changed again, looking younger actually. Not that he's not still under stress, but he's under considerably less. His long, 13-year plan is about to bear fruit. Instead of directly leading and controlling everything from both sides, he now has all his proxy players in place, pitted against each other. And other than talking to anakin, he is able to just kind of sit back and let them all do the work for him. Only time he has to really expel the Dark Side for the first time in the film is when the Jedi come to arrest him. Speaking of which...

- The lightning does cause the disfigurement, in a sense. Having that much Dark Side energy pouring back into him, and magnified as well via the conduit theory, causes his features to change. But rather than melting him, it makes him not only drop the guise of the "Palpatine Look" he had been using for awhile, the sheer amount of concentrated energy speeds up his transformation unnaturally. What would have taken years, if not decades, happens in mere moments. What we see is the end result of what would've naturally occurred over the course of time to Sidious, but done super quick.

- Why not use the Dark Side to turn back? I think this is 2 fold. #1 - he didn't care anymore. He won, the Sith were in control. No need to hide who he REALLY is anymore. And the fact that most of the Galaxy would still think of him as Palpatine rather than Sidious, even with the scars, was another factor. #2 - he physically may not have been able to. His deformities were too far gone, too far along. This is what he was going to look like in the end, no matter what. There was a line in the novelization bout this, as he looked in a mirror at his transformed features. I don't have it anymore, but it went something along the lines of " The face of Palpatine had served me well. I will miss it. But the face of Sidious will have to suffice from now on."

so,to condense this : Sidious was starting to transform from decades of Dark Side use, but was able to keep it at bay - masked,if you will - with the Force. the only time he dropped it a little was during the leadup to the Clone Wars, when he was using so much of the Force in so many directions that he couldn't completely keep up the facade. by ROTS, things are going perfectly, and he's able to maintain his appearance again. But the Force Lightning conducted back into him is so intense and powerful, it not only shatters the mask he had been using to cover his subtle deformities, it actually accelerates them to where he ends up looking like he would in the end anyway. And either through choice or being too far gone, he doesn't try and put up the facade of the Palpatine face again.

 

I think this is one of those issues that is in that sweet spot of ambiguity where there can be multiple interpretations and you get to choose your fav

 

The only problem with this is that you're assuming the ability or power he might be utilising would operate like a tap that can be turned on and off easily. Palpatine is a politician, constantly in the public-eye. If the change of appearance doesn't take immediate effect, one could plausibly reason that Palpatine's appearance remaining consistent up until the Windu confrontation was sensible.

 

I can see that. If one discards the novel Darth Plagueis and the other EU stories about Palpatine's background, then one could not truly know how old Sidious Palpatine really is. He could be a lot older, but the basic premise reminds that decades of dark side immersion turned him into the monster that he is. His external hideousness is no different than his inner decay.

It certainly is true that Sidious needed the "face" of Palpatine for his political ambitions, machinations, etc. But having the face of Sidious was very useful, since he could portray himself as a pathetic victim of Jedi violence. He didn't just do that for the Senate and the galaxy at large when he declared himself Emperor. He did it for his entire reign, hence his use of the cane in ROTJ and elsewhere to prop up this image of weakness so as to deceive both his servants and his enemies. Sidious is a manipulative, ferocious, ingenious bastard and an evil sorcerer. I think he took a bit of pride in unsettling people with his appearance, being the sadist that he was, but it was also useful in many respects, since in a twisted way it maintained this humble, ordinary old man image he needed. Of course, I take it Plagueis and all the EU stories are true, for myself. I also believe that despite his advanced age he could have overwhelmed Galen Marek, but instead he opted to make it an even fight to test him, and when he would not join him, he used his full might to kill the bastard.

 

As a kid, I thought his face just got burnt by the lightning, but that in no way accounts for the crooked, rotting teeth, the gnarled fingernails, and glowing eyes. Palpatine didn't really look like a middle aged senator. He was an old man disfigured by the dark side over time. Of course, with that much age and knowledge on his side, I'm sure some kind of sorcery was used to alter his appearance.

While people complain that too little was shown, I think this is one instance where we didn't need to see EVERYTHING that went on behind the scenes. Also, the Emperor was intended to be an "ancient" being for his debut appearance in Empire Strikes Back. Age and the dark side were the only intended reasoning behind his appearance. While such ideas are subject to change, I think the original rationale still fits well with the story presented in the prequels.

EDIT: Forgot that there is indeed an official ruling:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/The_Evil_Within
In short, Palpatine is disguised, and his true form is revealed at that moment. If anyone has any doubts, there were even talks of switching Palpatine back to his "normal" face in scenes where he presents himself publicly, but those plans were scrapped.

 

According to Absolutely Everything You Need To Know, he was indeed disfigured by his Force lightning.

 

I just think the Force Lightning being shot back AT him would've melted his face or something. I don't really think that's how he really looked.

 

It's written in a way that suggests that Palpatine's "true evil" is being revealed, though.

 

Not really, no.

 

yes it does.

the sith eyes anyone can have. the melted face and blackened teeth and nails are from the lightning. the article you linked is about the creative process not the final result.

with out any official statement i think this is a debate that will rage forever.

 

Yes. Then there are Anakin/Vader's thoughts in the ROTS novelization about him having never seen the man's "true face." And Sidious says, "I shall miss the face of Palpatine, but for now the face of Sidious shall suffice." Damn.

 

1. Palpatine was letting himself get roasted to get Anakin to turn to the Dark Side and against Mace.
2. Lucas needed a way to alter Palpatine's face for continuity.

 

poetic license.