PLEASE, A decent Saber-Game, it's all I ask!

As someone who's worked with computer games before, I'm really appaled at the lack of effort put in to some of the saber-usage in games.

Fair-dos to Jedi Outcast - it made a good effort, what with the flips and spins and everything. Felt good for a bit - but still not quite right. Still, they had a shed-load to contend with in one game.

IMHO, and I might (obviously) be totally wrong, I think we need a game based entirely around Jedi-Duelling - and here's how I'd do it, sticking firmly just to gameplay mechanics, rather than getting bogged down in pointless story (it can be added later!):

1. The Game

I'm really tempted to say it should be a one-on-one fighter, but not only does that conjure up too many references, and make it hard not to think of a Street Fighter Star Wars clone, it also doesn't fit the universe.

While a Jedi, in most settings, isn't likely to have to actually saber-duel with very many opponents, it's more than likely to be a two-on-one or two-on-two.

The main element of the game HAS to be timing, though. I've been all for more emphasis on timing in fighting games, but in saber-duelling, it's all flowing combos, so some sort of timing system is needed.

(for reference, check out Legends Of Wrestling - it uses a somewhat slow and clunky, but effective, system for combos and reversals)

I'm very tempted to say that the system should be designed to avoid the bash-n-hope style of play prevalent in a lot of fighting games, I really don't think this should be a game that requires a massive amount of skill - after all, most of us just want to pick up the pad and be a jedi. We don't want to pick up a pad and begin our two years of intensive training.

I think that the idea of analogue, free swinging lightsaber sounds very cool, and is soooo tempting - after all, when you watch a saber-duel, the feeling of the swinging sabers is more like a mouse swing than a D-Pad press (the kind of feel you get from stiff punches). However, completely opening up the system, allowing you to swing it any way you want, would be a bit clumsy - after all, we're not all Jedi, and our Pads can't channel The Force.

(for reference here, check out Severance on the PC - £4.99 in Game in the UK - as it uses a free-swinging mouse-based sword system)

That's why I'd suggest a console, analogue stick-based saber system. It'd sit somewhere between the two, allowing sweeping moves (quarter-circle down to towards for an upward sweep, back to down for a hard downward slash, etc.), with a seperate stick for movement.

This ties up a lot of finger-work, though - your left hand controlling movement, and your right hand controlling saber-swinging.

Anyone who's played Rocky on X-Box will tell you how great the shoulder buttons work for uppercut modifications and stuff, and as a result, I think it would work here. For example, the analogue stick on its own would be light, fast strikes, but pull the right trigger, and it becomes twisted-wrist defensive moves, while the left analogue stick modifies them to become strong, powerful blows.

So that's the sabers dealt with. Which leaves two things - force powers, and health.

I don't know much about what to do with force powers - obvious choice is basically the remaining buttons on the controllers.

(by this point, it's fair to say this is a console game. Too much D-Pad based stuff for a PC)

As for health, this is where I have a problem. Someone struck with a lightsaber gets sliced up, end of story. So I don't think you could have a health meter per se.

Instead, you could maybe have some kind of force meter, or stamina meter, which dictates how fast you can move. Any time someone tried to hit you with a move that would kill you, you'd hop out the way - you die when you slow to the point that you can't get out the way fast enough.

So what do you guys think? Any questions? Opinions? Flames? ;o)

 

I agree. But I think you have been looking at the wrong games.

Check out "Kengo" for the PS2. This is a very thoughtful samurai one-on-one swordfighter, with plenty of extra goodies in it. Lots of emphasis on technique and stance. I think you'll like it.

Also look at "Bushido Blade" (the original, not the sequel.) Again, a thoughtful strategic fighter (the anti-Tekken) using samurai blades and technique over brute force or button-mashing.

Both of these games tap into some of the meditative qualities of the Force. The kinds of abilities you imagine allowed an older Ben Kenobi to defend himself against Darth in ANH.

 

There's always this alternative;

[image=http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml99/99129.jpg]



Anyway, nice to see a great, well thought out post!

 

Yes well, we all can't find willing saber sparring partners, much less duel out in the open without looking ridiculous (especially when one doesn't know how to fence). And those things would break after a few forceful clashes...

 

(by this point, it's fair to say this is a console game. Too much D-Pad based stuff for a PC)

Mouse offers good control. I'm only mentioning this cause I'm a PC GREEK1!1!1!!11 though,


Also, if you do want to duel w/ swords or something in RL, you could try Kendo. It's like karate, but w/ swords...much of the saber moves from the OT movies were based off of several kendo moves I believe. I'm starting this at the next session available from my local community college w/ some friends.

Or you could buy two cheap brooms, cut off the bottom part, so you're left w/ just the handle. They're sturdy, and light enough to do some fun stuff with.

Then if you're interested in broadswords....er....I should stop now I guess, getting kinda way from the whole Gaming aspect of it I guess

 

I 100% agree there is no game that truly captures the art of lightsaber dueling. I think that lightsaber dueling is one the best parts of Star Wars and we already have flight sims (that are great) to the wall. I have long wished for a good lightsaber game no puzzles, no key or door searching. Just some serious saber bashing and it can be a fighter. Will we ever get it? It doesn't look good but, I will still hope.

 

Jaepee, I was just gonna say that.


You guys, believe it or not, it's waaay cooler to hack it out in REAL LIFE (shut off the computer if you've forgoetten ) with real sticks.

My bro and I will many times pad up in old football and hockey helmets, shin guards, gloves, shoulder pads, and whack it out with dowel rods in the backyard. That way, we go full out, and we do it in the Star Wars style.


Try it. I fail to see how much cooler moving around a mouse that's acting as a lightsaber is to actually swinging a stick around in person. (I crafted my own lightsaber handle out of wood and drilled a hole in it so I can insert dowel rods to fight with )

 

My bro and I will many times pad up in old football and hockey helmets, shin guards, gloves, shoulder pads, and whack it out with dowel rods in the backyard. That way, we go full out, and we do it in the Star Wars style.


Much more fun w/o the pads

 

if you are really desperate there are always kendo sticks


but i love JO, but i admit there are times when the movements arnt fluid and coheasive. its better then JK, where you really where incouraged not to use the saber in many cases. but the animation is only as good as the technology, and the animation in JO was very good. but again there where thise spots that you could tell

 

They just gotta make a virtual reality lightsaber game, where you are swinging a lightsaber in real life and you are facing an opponent on the screen. I think that could work.

I do duel with plastic sabers with my 6 year old nephew, but he fights dirty so it isn't that much fun. I need to find someone my age who isn't afraid to show their geekiness.

 

What I hate about Saber games is that multiple hacks are required to take down a villian.

Have you ever seen someone get whacked with a saber in the movies, and not be incapacitated? Their full of raw energy, they'd brun right through you! The only exception was Darth Vader when Luke nabbed him in the shoulder, but it was a very glancing blow.

Look at Jedi outcast. It comes the closest, but come on! I whacked Desaan a good twelve times before he died. And no, lightsaber cut through bodies with one shot no matter if you swing hard or easy.

 

We need a USB saber that plugs into your computer and tracks all your movments and a game where multiple people can play over the net.

Imagine what a projector on the wall would be like full scale.

 

SirLancelot: and the animation in JO was very good

it still damn well is, it's not like it's old already!

DarthMak: They just gotta make a virtual reality lightsaber game

damnstraight. I think this is the only solution. The opening post by the author of this thread had some serious detail, but really, using a couple of joystick / mouse type things is still gonna have the same effect as what we have now, but only a slight step forward. Vertual reality with helmets and movement sensors is the only way to go I think, and it's a few years off yet.

YouAgain: Imagine what a projector on the wall would be like full scale

 

" Have you ever seen someone get whacked with a saber in the movies, and not be incapacitated? Their full of raw energy, they'd brun right through you!"

Watch the sail barge scene again in RotJ.

-Jomero

 

Try not to judge lightsaber battles after ROTJ. After all, in the movie the lightsabers have shadows. That is pretty unrealistic.

 

Mak: I find it interesting how people say the movies are wrong by quoting EU stuff.


"What I hate about Saber games is that multiple hacks are required to take down a villian."

But the fact that in many FPSs it takes more than one bullet to take down a baddie? I personally find it not exactly all that realistic when there's a good 15-20 machine gun bullets pumped into the baddie and he's still shooting back.

 

That's not necessarily true. If you play Soldier of Fortune, you can blow a guys leg or arm off with one bullet. Overall though, most FPS aren't simulations of gunfights.

 

Okay, broomstick crowd aside...

Seriously, guys, play Bushido Blade. Great sword-fighting on the console--- WITH ONE-HIT KILLS.

You can *sometimes* wound a guy, but generally you can kill with one swipe--- just like lightsabers.

Check it out.

 

well actually in rral life light sabres WOULD cast shadows... it was a proven fact from JohnKnoll..... after all, candle flames have shadows

 

Lightsabers are not made of light. If they were, blaster bolts could not bounce off of them.

 

"Stay on target, stay on target!"


NB: substitute "target" with "topic".


kthxbye.

 

Very good post Jedi J!




To Aragorn:
I'm a PC GREEK1!1!1!!11 though,

I am just a Greek!

 

"Lightsabers are not made of light. If they were, blaster bolts could not bounce off of them."

However, they are a light source.

 

"Overall though, most FPS aren't simulations of gunfights."


Yet we're whining that Jedi Outcast isn't an exact simulation of a lightsaber duel?

 

I prefer we wait till when lightsabers are invented...