Please read: A note on EU and the OT.

Agreed. I think speculation and discussion are some of the main reasons I come to TFN.

 

Like I said, like talking to a wall. Well it doesn't matter now because it's policy that I hope will be enforced. This passive agressive form of trolling will stop.

 

And the villagers rejoiced!

 

You may notice that on any of the hijacked threads, I never start a debate.

No, you're wrong. The minute you start saying THIS happened, you're all wrong, you're starting the EU debate. You've done this everytime.

 

Like I said, like talking to a wall. Well it doesn't matter now because it's policy that I hope will be enforced. This passive agressive form of trolling will stop.

As long as the bashers stop bashing, I will be more than happy to oblige.

No, you're wrong. The minute you start saying THIS happened, you're all wrong, you're starting the EU debate. You've done this everytime.

Incorrect. If I ever start saying "this is the one and only correct answer," it is because the debate has already been started by someone else. Want proof? Go take a look at any of the hijacked threads. My first posts there are always good and clean ones. Only when people dispute the answer as "EU crap" does the debate start.

So, in order to avoid the debate, don't bash the EU. It's that simple.

 

Like I said to you in PM BF,T in that latest fiasco, nobody even once bashed the EU even though it had been mentioned, until after you came in and declared it as word of law and that discussion was over.

 

Not true Bib. In one thread I mentioned that I came up with my own event on how much time Luke was with Yoda in ESB and that I accept my event until Lucas tells me otherwise because I don't buy into the EU.

Then you go ahead an ask me why I don't like the EU and yadda yadda yadda.

Now, maybe it could have been a simple question, BUT me and you had quite a lengthy discussion on a thread before and then a couple of weeks ago through PM about why I don't follow EU nor like it. You kept persisting that I was wrong in your PM's and trying to change my mind on the subject.

And then you go ahead and push my buttons by asking me why I don't like nor accept the EU when you already knew why and told you through PM why I felt the way I did. Yet you still pinched me and got me into the argument in the thread a couple of days ago.

You already knew the answer.

Now, you are not agressive about it not loud, but you provoke in very quiet manner.

 

Incorrect. If I ever start saying "this is the one and only correct answer," it is because the debate has already been started by someone else. Want proof? Go take a look at any of the hijacked threads. My first posts there are always good and clean ones. Only when people dispute the answer as "EU crap" does the debate start.

Wrong.. here's your first post: Why didn't Vader signal for the rest of the fleet to lightspeed to Yavin to finish off the Rebels in a more traditional way?

He did, actually. Within a few months after the battle, Vader brought in the newly-completed Executor and proceeded to smash the base before the Rebels could evacuate everyone and everything.

Now, compare that to everyone else's posts. They all say "Perhaps", "probably" and "if.. couldn't". However, you say "He did..." and "Vader brought". This means you're saying it indeed DID happen, ruining the fun of speculation for all others.

 

Bib was just looking for a fight. Plain and simple. Anything else is... (What are his words???)... Incorrect.

 

Like I said to you in PM BF,T in that latest fiasco, nobody even once bashed the EU even though it had been mentioned, until after you came in and declared it as word of law and that discussion was over.

Sure they did.

Not true Bib. In one thread I mentioned that I came up with my own event on how much time Luke was with Yoda in ESB and that I accept my event until Lucas tells me otherwise because I don't buy into the EU.

That's fine.

Then you go ahead an ask me why I don't like the EU and yadda yadda yadda.

It was an honest question, so I expect an honest answer.

Now, maybe it could have been a simple question, BUT me and you had quite a lengthy discussion on a thread before and then a couple of weeks ago through PM about why I don't follow EU nor like it. You kept persisting that I was wrong in your PM's and trying to change my mind on the subject.

I wasn't trying to change your mind, only correct some erroneous statements you made. I know that it is unlikely to sway anyone over to the EU side. All I ask is that we can co-exist peacefully.

And then you go ahead and push my buttons by asking me why I don't like nor accept the EU when you already knew why and told you through PM why I felt the way I did. Yet you still pinched me and got me into the argument in the thread a couple of days ago.

You already knew the answer.

You don't have to like or accept the EU as a whole, just accept the minor answer when I or anyone else brings it in. It won't hurt you to accept an EU answer when the situation demands it.

 

Now, compare that to everyone else's posts. They all say "Perhaps", "probably" and "if.. couldn't". However, you say "He did..." and "Vader brought". This means you're saying it indeed DID happen, ruining the fun of speculation for all others.

It did happen, though. But that's besides the point. Up until the posts immediately after mine, the thread was all fine and dandy. Once people started flaming and bashing, there was no more hope for the thread.

Bib was just looking for a fight. Plain and simple. Anything else is... (What are his words???)... Incorrect.

I never look for fights. To think otherwise would be an error.

 

Sure they did.

PPOR.

Nobody once bashed the EU before your post.

 

In fact. There was lots of EU discussion before your post.

 

[image=http://www.geocities.com/skywalkersmut/dramanino.jpg]

With that aside (Sorry, I just felt like posting that), I've seen Bib argue "EU is always correct" countless times in this very forum. He knows more about Star Wars than I do, and probably more than I'll ever do, but I think he expects everyone here to be "on par" with his vast knowledge of the Star Wars universe, especially the Expanded Universe.

I've read a good portion of EU. I agree and disagree with many aspects of it. I read it for fun, not for obtaining absolute information about SW. It's not meant that way, all it is is a continuation of the SW films and it is up to the choice of the reader to accept it or not.

EU is good, yes, but remember - when in doubt, the films will prevail. No ifs, ands, or buts.

 

But if you already knew how I felt on the manner through past PM's, why did you go ahead and ask me in the thread why I don't like EU? You knew why. We ended the conversation like 2 weeks ago. But you went ahead and asked me again. You persisted. And then you argued with me. I mean, you have your EU answeers and that is great. But if I already accepted my own personl answer until Lucas tells me otherwise, why should I ignore my own answer just for ME and take the EU answer? I don't feel like taking the EU answer. I like mine.

 

"why did you go ahead and ask me in the thread why I don't like EU?"

Because whether he wants to admit it or not, he was looking for a fight.

 

Sure they did.

PPOR.

Nobody once bashed the EU before your post.

That's right. They only bashed after my post.

In fact. There was lots of EU discussion before your post.

So why did you suddenly bash it when I joined in? Doesn't make any sense to me.

With that aside (Sorry, I just felt like posting that), I've seen Bib argue "EU is always correct" countless times in this very forum.

I only do that when people dispute or otherwise bash the EU. You don't bash, I don't say it's the definitive answer.

He knows more about Star Wars than I do, and probably more than I'll ever do, but I think he expects everyone here to be "on par" with his vast knowledge of the Star Wars universe, especially the Expanded Universe.

Yeah, I guess that's true. I have a hard time believing that some people don't know some of the same things I do, or don't have the same skills as me. It's one of my character flaws.

I've read a good portion of EU. I agree and disagree with many aspects of it. I read it for fun, not for obtaining information about SW. It's not meant that way, all it is is a continuation of the SW films and it is up to the choice of the reader to accept it or not.

It is your own choice whether to accept it or not, but it is still a valid source of Star Wars information.

EU is good, yes, but remember - when in doubt, the films will prevail. No ifs, ands, or buts.

I have always believed in that as well.

But if I already accepted my own personl answer until Lucas tells me otherwise, why should I ignore my own answer just for ME and take the EU answer? I don't feel like taking the EU answer. I like mine.

Go ahead and live in that limited little world of yours, then. I'm not stopping you.

Because whether he wants to admit it or not, he was looking for a fight.

No I was not. I never look for fights, and I always try to avoid them when possible.

 

It did happen, though. But that's besides the point.

No, that IS the point.

Up until the posts immediately after mine, the thread was all fine and dandy. Once people started flaming and bashing, there was no more hope for the thread.

Correct. Now, why were they flaming and bashing? Would they have done so if you had not been so assertive in your assumption that your answer is the definitive one?

 

How is that limited? Because I like my oen answers until Lucas explains it? I have read EU before you know.

"Yeah, I guess that's true. I have a hard time believing that some people don't know some of the same things I do, or don't have the same skills as me. It's one of my character flaws."

Yeah... from that right there I can think of another character flaw.

Man, when the OT comes out on DVD, I hope Lucas does a commentary track, and by himself, without others cutting in. And I hope he contradicts a whole bunch of EU when he goes into deep details of the story and of things that were never answered.

 

Correct. Now, why were they flaming and bashing? Would they have done so if you had not been so assertive in your assumption that your answer is the definitive one?

That's debatable, but it is still your choice whether to bash the EU or not. One choice leads to pages and pages of flaming; the other allows the thread to continue as is.

 

Quote:
"I have a hard time believing that some people don't know some of the same things I do, or don't have the same skills as me. It's one of my character flaws. "

Skills? LOL, I swear sometimes I think you're just putting everyone on.

Bottom line. If you bring up EU in the movie forums again, you qualify it by saying it's the EU answer, not the definitive one. If someone disagrees with it, you will treat that like any other opinion and accept it. Otherwise you're in violation of policy and you'll be dealt with. You're the reason these problems exist and you know it. Plenty of other EUers come and go and they don't troll. It's going to stop.

 

That's debatable, but it is still your choice whether to bash the EU or not. One choice leads to pages and pages of flaming; the other allows the thread to continue as is.

All right, so if I then responded with "Ehh.. I don't buy that, I think X's idea was better", would you then say, "Too bad, it's the official answer", or would you just not reply to the thread anymore?

 

Skills? LOL, I swear sometimes I think you're just putting everyone on.

I was referring to physical or mental skills. Like how I can't understand why my sister is so terrible at basketball, while I walk all over her in the game.

Bottom line. If you bring up EU in the movie forums again, you qualify it by saying it's the EU answer, not the definitive one.

I never say my answer is the definitive one unless it is disputed.

If someone disagrees with it, you will treat that like any other opinion and accept it.

I can tolerate people disagreeing with the answer, but I cannot tolerate the blatant bashing that is so often attributed to ignorance.

Otherwise you're in violation of policy and you'll be dealt with. You're the reason these problems exist and you know it. Plenty of other EUers come and go and they don't troll. It's going to stop.

Despite what you may think, I do not start any of these problems. The problem exists with the purists and their inability to accept an answer that didn't come from Lucas' mouth.

Here is a sample hijacked thread:

A: Why did so-and-so happen in the movies?
B: It's because of X.
A: I don't like that answer.
B: Why not? It's the correct answer.
A: EU sucks. It's not Lucas, and it's not canon.
B: That is not true.
A: Yes it is! EU sucks!
C: EU sucks!
D: EU sucks!

Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

Now here is another sample thread:

A: Why did so-and-so happen in the movies?
B: It's because of X.
A: Oh, I see. Anyone else have an opinion?
C: I think it's because....

Can't you see which version is better?

All right, so if I then responded with "Ehh.. I don't buy that, I think X's idea was better", would you then say, "Too bad, it's the official answer", or would you just not reply to the thread anymore?

That is exactly the type of non-bashing response I am looking for when I bring up the EU in a movie forum. That, or accepting the EU answer.

 

"So why did you suddenly bash it when I joined in? Doesn't make any sense to me."

My reply to your answer was:

"I'll move on, but I won't accept that answer as fact."

How is that bashing the EU? It is not. I mearly stated that I will not accept anything from the EU as a final "end of story" fact. That is my opinion and I am fully entitled to it and it is not "Incorrect." It may differ from your opinion, but it is no more incorrect than yours is.

It should be noted that throughout the hijacking I maintained repeatadly that although I will not accept, nor will I ever accept, an EU explination as gospel fact (unless GL confirms it OUT OF HIS MOUTH or by his hand) I still thought that your explination was plausible, although not the only explination. You on the other hand demanded that your EU answer was the ONLY answer.

 

I think one question of signifigance is being missed here.

If you believe that the EU is completely canon and star wars "fact," why do you come to debate in forums where it isn't considered such? The EU forums have been provided for people who feel as you do. These forums are here for those who want to think of and discuss other possibilities.

I have never had a problem with you, myself. I am not looking for one now. I am just confused about why you seem to be the one person that people are having a problem with when, as others have said, other EUers come here and there aren't any problems. If you don't enjoy the fighting, why do you continue arguing here? I get the feeling that the purpose of this forum is for those who don't feel as you do, but you come here anyway, most likely because they will disagree. I'm not the biggest EU fan, so I mostly avoid posting there. That is how I avoid flaming arguments.