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Discussion Plot Holes In The Last Jedi

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Sequel Trilogy (Released Films)' started by zackm, Dec 18, 2017.

  1. zackm

    zackm Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    When The Force Awakens came out there was a really great thread about plot holes, which I found immensely useful in clarifying the nuance of the plot. As people noted perceived plot holes, others would offer up moments from the movie which clarified those issues and I think that would be a nice thing to do here too.

    To be clear, I'm not looking for complaints about dialog, or writing, or character portrayal. I'm not actually looking for complaints at all. I just want to have a discussion about any plot points that are contradictory or problematic in some way.

    I've seen the movie twice and nothing stands out, but I'd love to hear from other people.

    So with that said, let 'em fly.
     
  2. Darth_Accipiter

    Darth_Accipiter Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2015
    the only big plot hole which I think merits a question mark is why the First Order didn't send TIE fighters to attack the Resistance Ships during the chase. Surely the TIEs could catch up to their ships when the Star Destroyers couldn't. Maybe they didn't want collateral damage while the First Order Star Destroyers kept up their barrage, but that's all I can think of.
     
  3. MS1

    MS1 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2015
    I think the resistance escape is a plot hole. How will the Falcon get away when it will just be tracked through Hyperspace again?
     
  4. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 5, 2001
    They don't have any tracking on the Falcon. They were only tracking the Raddus.
    Why would they? They didn't know about the base on Crait or that plan. They could sit back & wait for the Resistance ships to run out of fuel & pick them off one by one. Naturally if they had a crystal ball & could see the Rebel's secret plan they would've done things differently.
     
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  5. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    How did they track the Raddus through hyperspace ?
     
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  6. Strongbow

    Strongbow Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2014
    They did explain that. They said that the Ewsistance ships were out of range of the Star destroyers, who could not cover them, making them too vulnerable. I guess the First Order doesn't have TIE bombers or something..... yeah the explaination was thin, but it was there, so not really a plot hole.
     
  7. The Raddinator

    The Raddinator Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2017
    So there is something I thought was a plot hole on my first viewing which was resolved by my second; I thought I'd flag it here as other people might have questioned it too. When I first saw the movie, I thought that it was weird that DJ knew about the Resistance plan to betray it to Hux - how could he know when even Finn and Rose didn't know about the Crait plan?

    On a rewatch though, I realised that they go out of their way to have Poe tell Finn and Rose that Holdo is planning to abandon ship and fuelling up the small transports when they're aboard DJ's ship. It then cuts to DJ's face for a split second, making it clear that he has overheard. So he doesn't know that the plan is to go to Crait specifically, but he does know that they are planning to evacuate the Raddus in transports, and that's why he can tell Hux to scan for small transports.

    I was really happy to see that, as it felt tighter than Star Wars movies often are with this kind of thing!


    I think the movie addresses that by having Hux tell Kylo to pull back when the Raddus gets too far away; he says they can't support them at that range. So I guess the concern is that the TIEs couldn't do much against the Raddus' shields anyway and would just get picked off without larger ship support. It's clearly a bit of a movie contrivance, but I'm glad it's addressed.
     
  8. Strongbow

    Strongbow Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2014
    I thought that one was easy. In the aftermath of the Supremacy getting severely damaged, no one was really thinking about tracking the Falcon. Also, the Raddus is big... the Falcon isn't.
     
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  9. MatthewZ

    MatthewZ Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2003
    How did Kylo's scar move from TFA to TLJ?

    Why was lightspeed never used as a weapon before?

    Since when can Force Ghosts influence the physical world?

    Kylo was obsessed with Anakin's lightsaber, why didn't he notice Luke using it after he had just seen it destroyed?
     
  10. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 5, 2001
    New tech.
     
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  11. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 5, 2001
    DP o_O

    Due to his various surgeries & treatments.
    How do you know it hasn't? If it hasn't they can easily come up with an explanation. Good old "first time for everything" works ok. Or that it was feared that doing it could create a singularity that could destroy the universe.
    Since ghost Ben Kenobi pushed aside tree branches & then sat on a log in RotJ.
    He didn't get a chance to examine it up close. Luke could have a similar looking one.
     
  12. MeBeJedi

    MeBeJedi Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    May 30, 2002

    There was a tracking device on the Raddus. The Falcon wasn't around long enough to put a tracking device on it.


    Apparently, Rogue One teased this:

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/rogue-one-contains-awesome-last-124112707.html
     
  13. Strongbow

    Strongbow Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2014
    Folks seem to be confusing plot holes with stuff that wasn't explained.... not the same thing.
     
  14. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 5, 2001
    Exactly. A plothole is not something that wasn't explained or resolved. It's something that can't be explained or resolved.
     
  15. Ricardo Funes

    Ricardo Funes Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2015
    To fix an error, since the scar from TFA made him look like an idiot. The placement of the scar on TLJ is way more cool.

    Because the size of the explosion would kill everything nearby, including Rebel ships, is only feasible if there is a large ship with no one inside, and requires that the enemy ignores the danger until the last minute, otherwise they could just shoot the ship before it maneuvres.
    The only reason Holdo suceeded was because the First Order thought that they had abandoned that ship.

    Force Ghosts are able to intereact with the physical world since Obi-Wan met with Luke on Return of the Jedi.

    [​IMG]

    The fact you didn't see it before does not mean it cannot be done.
    Also, Yoda is one of the most powerful Force users of all time, so he has found a way to do it.

    Because he was with such anger that his vision was clouded. I can relate to that in real life, when you are angry many times you ignore many details you should be paying attention to.
    Also, could be another blue lightsaber, it is not that Luke does not know how to make them.
     
  16. Cedius

    Cedius Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2015

    Really? In ESB Force Ghost Obi Wan literally sat on a log.
     
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  17. Cedius

    Cedius Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Edit: site crashed and double posted.
     
  18. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2005
    Using lightspeed as a weapon is literally suicide. I don’t see why it would be a plot hole that most pilots prefer survival.
     
  19. ewoksimon

    ewoksimon Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Kylo not recognizing the lightsaber in Luke's hands is the only plot hole I can think of, but I forgive it because how jammed up Kylo is in that moment. Also, there's a deeper thematic import, in that by igniting the Skywalker saber, Luke is once again taking responsibility for his family.
     
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  20. MatthewZ

    MatthewZ Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2003
    So you're basically saying the scar is a plot hole. Thanks I appreciate that.

    Kylo instantly recognized Anakin's saber in TFA and he seemed pretty mad then.

    A ghost can appear to sit or walk anywhere. Summoning a bolt of lightning and causing a fire is totally different kid.
     
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  21. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2005
    Oooh, I like that!! Good thinking!
     
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  22. The Raddinator

    The Raddinator Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2017
    I'm not sure that Kylo Ren on Crait is in the sort of mental place where he's paying attention to things like which specific lightsaber Luke is using. He's clearly been more unstable than ever since Snoke died and Rey rejected him, and that's only made worse by Luke's appearance, which drives him completely over the edge. ("MORE! MOOOOORE!")

    The scar is a continuity error. It's not a plot hole, because it has no impact on the plot.
     
  23. Satipo

    Satipo Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 29, 2014
    I wish people could understand that strong something for the first time does make something a plot hole. Regardless of whether or not it’s established In the previous films (and I’d say ESB holds all the foreshadowing you need for Force telepathy and the idea you can have a saber fight with someone who is not actually there) the film itself takes the effort to set it all up. If you cannot see this, that’s you not paying attention and imaging non existent rules, not a plot hole.

    And yes, Kylo not realising Luke is not real is to underline how blinded by hate he is. Both Leia and Threepio I think know he is not really there. Kylo also doesn’t notice that Luke looks like he did when they last met, or that he leaves no footprints on the salt, that their blades never actually touch.

    Luke is also not just taking responsibility for his family again it also completes his arc. He goes from rejecting the saber and his legend and using both to reignite the spark.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  24. MatthewZ

    MatthewZ Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2003

    Droid pilot.
     
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  25. Satipo

    Satipo Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 29, 2014
    So you’d rather remove one of the visual and exhilarating highlights of the saga because you haven’t seen that manoeuvre used before? Anyway if you need a technical reason it’s something to do with the Raddus’ shields, but really who cares.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  26. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2005
    Contrary to what Obi-Wan says, flying is not for droids ;)
     
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  27. Ricardo Funes

    Ricardo Funes Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2015
    Given the small amount of Rebellion resources, and the cost for such huge ships, not counting the time it takes to build one (think of real world maritime building times, years), then going kamikaze is not a real strategy until you are really desperate.