ST Plot Holes In The ST

I could forgive the fact that it changes the past and future of all space battles IF Leia would have been the one to do it instead of one (in the long line) of meaningless throw-away characters from TLJ.

 

Well don't I have to assume that even a small ship moving at lightspeed would pierce a hole through a Star Destroyer??

 

I thought Holdo was good. But I presume the real reason this didn’t happen was that before her death the plan was for Leia to have a major role in 9. So while yes it would have a wonderful moment Leia, it also wasn’t serving the story. Holdo’s story role was to test and bring the best out of Poe. She’s not throwaway to me.


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Also, how do we know Kylo didn't think the lightsaber looked quite like Anakin's saber? Maybe that was one of a hundred thoughts that went through his mind. What's he going to do about it? He can't assume that just bcs of that Luke isn't really there. Better to err on the side of caution, complete the fight & worry about lightsabers later. Not even close to a plot hole.

 

Low mass, low energy

High mass, high energy

 

The only one that kind of sticks me with is why the other resistance ships didn't jump to lightspeed to different places and get away that way. I guess they didn't necessarily know how the FO were tracking them and the FO probably would just break up their fleet and hunt them down individually anyway. So not really a plot hole after all I guess!

(plus we wouldn't get the great visual of the dying ships falling behind and then being blown to bits, the ticking clock in this movie was really quite inventively done.)

 

But Rey had already left Snoke's ship well before this. Even if Kylo were paying attention to the lightsaber, it would be perfectly reasonable to him to assume that, at some point, Rey had met up with Luke in the hangar and passed off the lightsaber.

 

Also I think only the captains of each ship die. Which sucks for them but the rest ferry to the Raddus. It is a bit plot logic I accept but I think the film does explain the thinking about that chase, so personally I’m fine to roll with that. The plan would have worked had it not been for Poe, Finn and Rose’s recklessness.


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I'm not sure if it's a plot hole or just inconsistent writing, but I'm confused as how the FO now dominates the galaxy after just appearing on the scene just prior to TFA-ish, and more so, how the Rebel/Resistance army (who took down the Empire a couple of decades prior) are down to literally escape pods in a handful of broken unfueled ships. I'm not sure how that works logically, given the scale of the galaxy.

Maybe I'm just over thinking or not seeing something. I'm sure it's explained in some book somewhere, or the back of a trading card, or maybe I need to play a videogame to understand it.

 

The New Republic is destroyed since TFA. Their army was parked on orbit and was also destroyed (we can see this in TFA and they also say this when mentioning the extent of the attack).



So, there is no big army to fight the First Order. Leia has a very limited number of fighters, all of them quite old.

So no, no need to play a videogame or read the back of a trading card. Just rewatch TFA and pay attention to the dialogue during and after SKB attacks the New Republic.

 

TFA says the First Order rose from the ashes of the Empire, so they've been around for awhile. Starkiller Base, however, was secret and brand-new...and with the Republic planets wiped out, there is fear and disorder, which is why no one else wanted to help the Resistance.

 

These are not complaints but real questions/concerns.

TFA built up the significance of Anakin/Lukes lightsaber calling to Rey.... This lead to 2 years of speculation and TLJ completely ignored it. Look, I'm not fan of Harry Potter Lightsabers but they made such a big deal about in TFA that to ignore it IS a plot hole.

How many hours did The First Order chase the rebels at sublight speed? In that time no other First Order capital ship from another system couldnt have jumped in from Hyperspace and cut them off? Really?

Rey's three Jedi lessons and suddenly she can fight off Praetorian guards and lift a landslide of rocks like a master? This is kind of the same questions people had after TFA. Being strong in the force doesnt make you swordmaster, that still takes practice. In AotC Obi-wan even makes mention that Anakin should practice his swordsmanship more than his wit. What was the point of a lifetime of training in the Jedi academy, then as a padawan then the Jedi Trials when all you needed were 3 simple lessons? Yes, Lukes training with Yoda was short but not three lessons over a couple of days short.

Maybe more of a plot problem than a plot hole is Hyperspacing Ships into each other. This should have never been done because it invalidates Lukes shot on the thermal exhaust port in ANH. Why not sent a droid ship to hyperspace into it causing the chain reaction or into the Deathstars weapon to disable it? Why not hyperspace any droid ship into the bridge of any capital ship to disable it? No shields "likely" wouldn't defend it because we know from TFA that shields dont have a fractional refresh rate against Hyperspacing ships.

Not a plot hole but an observation. When Rey and Kylo rip Luke/Anakins lightsaber in half. I immediately felt that was symbolic of what Disney and the ST are doing. Destroy all the "old Lucas rules" so they dont have to be bound to any of them and can move forward with a new vision of the Force and Star Wars

 

Yeah that would pretty much be the end of the Resistance. All of those other ships were basically unarmed, as Poe says.

 

Ones that come to the top of my head right now are

1. Hux says Rey has stolen Snoke's personal ship. Moments later she appears on the Millennium Falcon with Chewbacca
2. Force Ghosts now have unimaginable power including the ability to control the weather so why they didn't use their power in ROTJ is beyond me
3. Lightspeed travel could easily have been used as a weapon in the first six films. Destroying the Trade Federation ship in TPM comes to mind
4. Rey had less training than Luke had with Yoda but appears to be much stronger

 

But it was broke'ded.

 

Oh crap.....you're right. My bad.

 

Again, none of those are actual plot holes.

1. Chewie obviously picked up Rey. We didn't see it, but did we need to? Nope. IUt was enough to know she got off the Supremacy.
2. Presumably because it's not like a light switch. Yoda has clearly learned more over the years. By the end of the scene with Luke, he is basically solid with a light blue halo... not really transparent at all. He learned.
3. Possibly. And we don't know it never happened. Poe seems to know what she is going to do. But it is a suicide mission, and presumably, it would have taken a fairly large ship to be effective in TPM.
4. She is strong for sure. But again... NOT a plot hole. She simply appears stronger. Maybe she IS stronger. Maybe being on Ach-to made it easier for her to connect with the Force and learn. Certainly the initial meditation scene seems to imply that.

 

Yeah, I understand that's what the movie is saying, in very limited form. I get you. I guess what I'm saying is it's still confusing and I'm not sure how it works logically, and still think it's a plot hole or at least weak writing/planning/explanation.

• Rebels defeat the Empire - cool.
• Rebels then win more battles taking out Imperial remnants all over the galaxy - ok, cool.
• Other Imperial Remnants exist and flee to Unknown Regions. - still cool.
• Rebels make fledging New Republic. - very cool.
• Mostly Galaxy-wide New Republic stands down Rebel militia and signs treaty w Imperial Remnant (FO?) - umm. okay. weird. but okay.
• FO rises from the ashes of the Empire under Snoke, who is still seen as not a threat. - really? okayyyyy sure....
• At some point Luke's new academy is destroyed - Sure..okay.
• FO starts invading territory while NR sits back and does nothing, even though they still have large unused army and plenty of vessels. (probably Imperial ones still laying around as well) - I guess...not sure why.
• Kylo is hunting fo Luke - cool yup.
• Resistance led by Leia takes on FO who are invading more territory, but is largely seen as a burden to the NR who don't want to get involved because of peaceful -treaty reasons. - huh? reallllllly?
• FO destroyes the NR, who even though control the vast majority of the GFFA, more so than the FO, remarkably decided to put all their government eggs in one solar system basket are destroyed by StarKiller base. - okay that makes no sense
• NR no longer exists - ???apparently?? I guess...ummm..they really should have put embassies and city halls on other planets, or bases that they took over from the Empire days. Spread out a bit more
• Resistance destroys Starkiller base. - cool way to go
• Entire Resistance is down to a dozen ships, who almost all get destroyed in opening of TLJ. - huh?
• FO slowly chases remaining handful of Resistance ships until all but a handful of Rebels are in escape pods where they then hide in a cave. ...huh?
• Resistance puts out distress call to other rebels who don't have hope or care to come rescue. they don't - ok.
• FO destroys the cave and remaining Rebels. - that was easy.
• Legendary Luke shows up - okay that's awesome!
• Entire Resistance now board the Falcon and escape. - sure...okay.
• More Rebels may exist in outer rim, maybe. - hope so...

Maybe you're right. It's all explained. It's not really a plot hole. It's just kind of insane. Look...i liked TLJ for the most part. But I think the rose colored glasses fell off.

 

Rey is clearly highly skilled with a staff. We see her training with it in TLJ. It's meant to show that this is a long established training routine of hers. We also see her fight with the staff in TFA. So, aided by her Force sensitivity (like Anakin & podracing) she's become incredibly good with a melee weapon over many years. Skills which translate well to lightsaber fighting.
I don't think you need to be a Master to move rocks. If you're of the right mindset, 1 rock or 100 rocks shouldn't matter. As per Yoda's lessons about size.

I sense a very simple explanation coming. Perhaps it was always seen as too dangerous. It could cause rifts in hyperspace or something. Or it wouldn't get through the Death Star's shields. Probably another 10 reasons they could invent.

There's always been inconsistent use of the Force & Lucas would often ignore his own rules. Why didn't Anakin & Obi-Wan simply Force push those buzz droids of their ships? We see Jedi treat droids with disdain. Throwing them around like rag-dolls. So why is Obi-Wan engaging in a lightsaber fight with Grievous? Who is a non-Force using droid? Why not pick him up & smash him against a wall? I could go on but you probably get the point.

Before Rey launches in the escape pod she tells Chewie to wait for her rendezvous signal. So after leaving in Snoke's ship clearly they met up.

At the moment of the lightspeed attack. Kylo was knocked out in the chaos. It's quite possible that he wouldn't know what happened to the lightsaber. Only that Rey took it, & she could've given it to Luke.

 

I know how you feel. I think the awkward part of TLJ is that there are explanations for what happens onscreen.....they just aren't always the greatest explanations.

 

Before Rey launches in the escape pod she tells Chewie to wait for her rendezvous signal. So after leaving in Snoke's ship clearly they met up. [/quote]

Ah, ok. Must not have noticed that part.

On a side note, why is there no thumbs up emoji? I just spent three minutes looking for one.

 

The whole light-speed weapon thing isn't necessarily a plot hole, but I think it definitely begs the question, which is kind of like plot-hole-ish. My first thought to explain it away was that small ships wouldn't be able to get through the shields, but in TFA the Falcon is able to get through SKB's shields precisely because it was going light-speed, so that explanation doesn't really work. So the next best explanation is your's. We just have to assume that the cost to create such a weapon vs the damage inflicted would not be worth it except for in very specific cases like the one seen in TLJ. Though, that still doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.

ETA- ACTUALLY, we have already seen what happens to a small ship when it jumps to light-speed and it hits a Star Destroyer in Rogue One. Can't believe I didn't remember that. Those little ships just crashed and burned. Basically no damage to the Star Destroyer. Perfect. All is right with the world again.

 

We actually see some kamikaze attacks in the Clone Wars and Rebels to break blockades. Even if those were at sublight. The big difference was that the Republic had a huge fleet so they could afford it, and the Rebels, like the Resistance were desperate to get away and had to clear out an Interdictor which stranded them.

 

Looks better over the eye (like Anakin)

Because it's suicide?

It was never implied they couldn't, heck Obi-Wan sat down on a log with Luke on Dagobah

I'm thinking his attention was focused on Luke, I know that's a stretch haha

 

Just a couple, you can get a message through to Maz - but can't contact anyone else? Second, you follow a ship because you can't match the speed, yet you also have FTL drives as well? Ok, how about the lead ship jumps past the resistance and turns back and pincer movement? Also, what is it with gravity and physics in general in this episode, you can release bombs but you don't get sucked out into space? Also, why to bombs fall in a vacuum? And when Leia gets back to the ship, why isn't anything sucked out into space when she opens the door to get back onboard?