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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Post Proof Or Retract: Dispelling Myths Regarding EU

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Merkurian , Jan 3, 2002.

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  1. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    Greetings all.

    In my time here at TF.N I've noticed a lot of things about the EU and George Lucas' involvement with it that are taken for granted by the general populace, regardless of whether it's true or not.

    The intention of this thread is NOT to start any type of flame war, but rather to confirm or disprove many of the truisms held by much of the Star Wars Fandom; notions such as:
    *George Lucas does/doesn't read EU material.

    *GL likes/doesn't like EU.

    *GL liked the Dark Empire Comic so much that he gave out copies one year for Christmas.

    *GL has/doesn't have any involvement with the creative process in the EU.

    *The name "Coruscant" is Tim Zahn's creation.

    *The name "Coruscant" came from a list provided by GL, and Zahn picked it.

    *GL vetoed an Obi-Wan clone in the Thrawn Trilogy.

    *GL vetoed the Noghri looking like Darth Vader in the Thrawn Trilogy.

    *George Lucas said "Kill Chewie" in Vector Prime.

    *GL vetoed Tales of the Jedi-era Force powers like the ability to assume animal shape.

    Notice again that the magic phrase in the title of this thread is to POST PROOF. And by proof I don't mean somebody pulling a quote out of their arses. I want magazine issues, dates, who said it, when they said it, etc. Heck if you can, provide links to where you found the information. But the important thing is that I'm looking for hard evidence and not heresay. The easier it is to verify, the better it is for everyone.

    You'll notice that there are some things that completists will have to prove as well as purists. I want this thread to be a resource to confirm or disprove heresay, no matter what your personal feelings are about the Expanded Universe.

    You'll also notice that nowhere in the above list did I mention the word "canon." There's a reason for that. I don't want this thread to turn into yet another battleground in the "Canon Wars!"

    These are just a few notions & truisms I came up with off the top of my head. Anyone else who has notions that they'd like to see either proven or disproven, post them here.

    Regards,
    Kurt
     
  2. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    I'll start with an easy one: that the name "Coruscant" originated in the EU.

    "Author Timothy Zahn gave Coruscant its name in his 1991 novel, Heir to the Empire. When it came time to finally unveil the galactic capital on the big screen in the revamped ending of the Return of the Jedi Special Edition release, Lucas adopted the name Coruscant."

    -From The Official Site.

    Does anybody have anything about a list of names that Lucas gave to Zahn to choose from?
     
  3. tanjokabri

    tanjokabri Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 2, 2001
    i don't think zahn picked coruscant from a list...i heard somewhere (i know this is not proof) that lucas didn't much like the name and wanted to change it for ep1, but was convinced to keep it the same for continuity...
     
  4. wild_karrde

    wild_karrde Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 8, 1999
    As for GL's involvement in the EU, he gets the final say on all major events in novels/comics. This includes: Chewie dying, Force powers, OB1 Clone idea. For proof, just ask Kathy Tyers, RA Salvatore, or any of the other EU authors who post here.

    wk
     
  5. ReaperFett

    ReaperFett Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 9, 1999
    GL has/doesn't have any involvement with the creative process in the EU.

    George Lucas does/doesn't read EU material.


    Have no fear, SuperFett is here! ;) :)

    From god himself, KJA

    "George read the outlines for the new SW novels, but he actually read most of the comics and he gave us specific directions for the Sith in our TOTJ"

    Taken from his TF.N interview here
     
  6. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    Hey wilde_karrde, do you have any links or quotes from EU authors on that? I'm gonna dig up one from Kevin Rubio (of Dark Horse Comics), and I'll see if I can find a link as well.


    Thanks ReaperFett, that's exactly what I'm looking for!
     
  7. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    I don't remember the exact thread that this took place in, put his screen name is TroopsGuy. I did also note the date that the quote was made, so if anyone has him listed as a favorite, you can verify it that way:
    Good Evening Everyone:

    I wanted to lend, what I'm assuming is, a rather unique perspective on this topic. I have the good fortune to write for Darkhorse Comics, and I can tell you from my own experience that George dose in fact look over the comics from time to time. And although all the story points in the film are not completed, if I'm doing a story that may come into conflict with what he's planing, or if it goes against his ideals -- I will hear about it.

    I've even got his faxed sign-off to prove it.

    He dose not go over everything, but he is very much aware of what is going on. ALL DH SW COMICS are approved by Lucasfilm. If it goes against something they disagree with, two things will happen. It will be corrected, or you won't see it.

    I hope this is of interest. If there are any questions, I'll try to answer them to the best of my abilites.

    Kevin

    -Kevin Rubio, Dark Horse Comics, TF.N Lit Boards 12/03/01

     
  8. Kier_Nimmion

    Kier_Nimmion Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2000



    ?It wasn?t long after I began writing Star Wars that I realized the story was more than a single film could hold. As the saga of the Skywalkers and the Jedi Knights unfolded, I began to see it as a tale that could take at least nine films to tell? three trilogies? and I realized, in making my way through the back story and after story, that I was really setting out to write the middle story.

    ?After Star Wars was released, it became apparent that my story?however many films it took to tell?was only one of thousands that could be told about the characters who inhabit its galaxy. But these were not stories I was destined to tell. Instead they would spring from the imagination of other writers, inspired by a galaxy that Star Wars provided. Today, it is an amazing, if unexpected, legacy of Star Wars that so many gifted writers are contributing new stories to the Saga. This legacy began with Splinter of the Mind?s Eye, published less than a year after of Star Wars. Written by Alan Dean Foster, a well known and talented science-fiction author, Splinter was promoted as the ?further adventures? of Luke Skywalker. It the bookstores just as I was preparing to write my own ?further adventures? of Luke, in the form of a script entitled The Empire Strikes Back.

    ?It seems only fitting, after all these years, that Splinter would be republished as I prepare once again to write another further adventures set a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away...?

    -George Lucas,
    From the Introduction of ?Splinter of the Mind?s Eye? by Alan Dean Foster


     
  9. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    Great stuff Kier. That's one of my favorites.

    Well, so far we've got good stuff. Does anybody have a way of finding out about EU stuff that was nixed by GL, like the Obi-clone and the "Noghri-Sith?"
     
  10. Sturm Antilles

    Sturm Antilles Former Manager star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 22, 2000
    It may not have been Lucas. It could have just been the general Lucasfilm staff, but I don't think there's a clear answer. In Adventure Journal # 1 ( 1994 ) Timothy Zahn says it was "Lucasfilm" to both things.
     
  11. Kier_Nimmion

    Kier_Nimmion Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2000


    I bought Splinter yesterday, it'll go nicely with my other two copies I have at my parent's place. I wanted to read it again, then I checked the copy I had bought and it was the one with the Lucas quote.



     
  12. Jedi_Anakin_Solo

    Jedi_Anakin_Solo Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2001
    From the official websight's databank entry on the Noghri (the behind the scenes section of the entry):

    In the development of his Thrawn Trilogy of novels, author Timothy Zahn drafted out a number of ideas that were disapproved for treading too close to material that George Lucas was to address in the prequel trilogy.

    One idea that Zahn postulated was that the Sith were a species of killers in servitude to Darth Vader -- Dark Lord of the Sith. The idea was that Vader's gruesome mask was a stylized depiction of a Sith face. The idea was abandoned, and Zahn's Sith became the Noghri. Although not said in the text, it is hinted that the Noghri bear more than a passing resemblance to Vader's facemask


    I don't know whether or not that proves/disproves anything, but since I saw something about the Noghri, I figured I'd post that here in case any conclusions can be drawn from it.
     
  13. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    Excellent. Here is where that quote is from. That gives some proof that GL shot down at least one EU idea of Zahn's.

    Anything about the "Obi-Clone?"
     
  14. Jedi_Anakin_Solo

    Jedi_Anakin_Solo Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2001
    No... so far my research hasn't turned up anything about that one.
    Sorry, I'll keep looking.
     
  15. skawookiee

    skawookiee Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 12, 2000
    I have read the Obi-clone statement somewhere before, but I can't recall where. I'll look for it.
     
  16. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    It's in Adventure journal #1.

    Zahn goes into how he wasn't allowed to do several ideas. It's the first time he talks about how he didn't want to follow the continuity set forth by dark horse already(early copy of dark empire, that veitch had to rewrite, to include added scenes cause zahn caused some contradictions), as well as insulting Dark Horses products in the interview. Zahn says he was was more than willing to follow the continuity set forth by WEG, and praised the company.
     
  17. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    Thanks, Valiento.

    Do you have exact quotes?
     
  18. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    Have to go look for the issue later. But I can get the exact quotes when I do.
     
  19. Sturm Antilles

    Sturm Antilles Former Manager star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 22, 2000
    From AJ #1, Spring 1994 :

    "C'baoth was one of the characters who originally had to be changed. My original intent was that [he] was going to be an insane clone of Obi-Wan. Lucasfilm wouldn't let me do that, so I had to make him a clone of somebody else."

    "Originally, the Noghri were going to be the Sith. Vader is mentioned as a Lord of the Sith in various places. And I wanted them to be the Sith that were referred to. That was another of the ideas that was canceled by Lucasfilm.

    Another thing I wanted to do, that again they wouldn't let me do, was make Vader's mask a stylized version of the Noghri faces, that he adopted that armor in part as a gesture to them being so useful to him as the undercover death commandos. Lucasfilm would not let me do that officially, so what I did was simply take the same idea, describe their faces that way, but not make any references within the book that they reminded people of Vader's mask. But that's basically where they came from. Also, by having their gray skin darken as they get older, that would also reflect in Vader's black armor, would be an image of old and wise to them."

     
  20. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

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    May 25, 2000
    Thanks Sturm.

    So it wasn't Lucas directly, but the people at LFL that put the kibosh on those ideas....
     
  21. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    well, merkuian many of the authors have said that lucas looks only over a one page outlines of the story. I assume it's not any different for zahn, right?
     
  22. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    True enough Valiento. What I'm trying to get a handle on is just how much of a role GL plays in the affairs of the Expanded Universe. That, and confirming or disproving EU notions.
     
  23. Ebonn101

    Ebonn101 Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Coruscant is actually a small town in Israel. My dad went there and told me about it when I mentioned Coruscant in the context of Star Wars. I believe it was probably picked for some stupid little symbolic reference to the Bible or something.
     
  24. Matthew Trias

    Matthew Trias Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 1999
    Coruscant is never mentioned in the Bible....
     
  25. ILLUMINATUS_JEDI

    ILLUMINATUS_JEDI Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 29, 2001
    I think there was an Interview with Shelly Shapiao (sp) about NJO and she said that GL looked over the entire NJO and gave it thumbs up.

    I'll go look for it on the OS.
     
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