Lit Pre Saga History

Since the legends announcement the canon version of pre saga history has drastically changed. In this thread we will look to discussing and finding what is and isn’t canon.

Initially I will post some write ups on each canon media piece- ie. First the PT, then the OT, TCW and Rebels.

I hope this thread will be worthwhile much like the “State of the Galaxy” thread in the new movies section.

@darklordoftech Tried Pm'ing you but it wouldn't let me.
The Phantom Menace

-The Sith

“He was trained in the Jedi arts… I believe he was a Sith” “The Sith have been extinct for a millennium”

This gives us a date for the Sith’s disappearance/destruction and likely a link telling us that the Sith had been in hiding for 1000 years but that the Rule of Two had still been followed. A different interpretation is that the Sith were completely destroyed and someone resurrected the order using the same rules.

-Rule of Two

At Qui-Gon’s funeral Yoda and Mace discuss the “death” (he came back as a crazy robot spider and then invaded Mandalore) of Maul. “Always two there are, no more, no less” “But which one did we kill- the master or the apprentice?”

This highlights that the Jedi knew of the Rule of Two. Why? How? This shows the past Sith (that we can tell canonly- in legends there were all sorts of Sith orders and no “Rules of Two”) followed the Rule of Two.
Attack of The Clones

-Full Scale War

“There hasn’t been a full scale war since the formation of the Republic.” Sio Bibble also says in TPM that “A communication breakdown can only been one thing-Invasion” How does he know this? Either there must have been battles in Sio Bibble’s lifetime or he has read up on ancient history.

-The Lost Twenty

“Only twenty Jedi have ever left the Order. The Lost Twenty. And Count Dooku was the most recent and the most painful. No one likes to talk about it. His leaving was a great loss to the Order."

This could give us some clue that not many Jedi have actually left the order but it might be an idea to think about what the Jedi class as a Jedi. Do they have to be a Master? Is Ahsoka a Jedi? Did the Lost Twenty (Nineteen in this case if Dooku was number 20) leave as one body? Could they or one of them have started a Sith order? Or any Force Order for that matter- Pablo has said (and I know his tweets aren’t canon) that there were/are “many, many Force Orders”


This is only the beginning and more will be posted, I've compiled a document that has most of the points written up. Feel free to add anything I miss or neglect to mention. If anyone wants the document just say and I will try and make it public.

 

From the TCW show, we know there's been many wars, but not a single galactic one. That went away with the ancient Sith, until the Clone Wars.

 

I was going to send you over the completed one once it was well, complete!

Is there a source for that? That is what I've gathered from AOTC but (coming up) in the Younglings arc of TCW Huyang mentions a few battles which is likely to involve the Jedi. But we are getting ahead here.

 

In one TCW episode from, I think, the Umbara arc, Saesee Tiin says "There haven't been battles like these since the days of the Old Republic" - and the Darksaber was stolen from the Jedi Temple during "the fall of the Old Republic",

 

From the ep "Trespass", the Chairman of Pantora says he's seen 100 planets rise and fall through warfare in his lifetime.
In "Cat & Mouse", Admiral Trench was known for a battle involving a Republic fleet and a Corporate fleet that was noted in history books at that point, indicated to have happened before the Clone Wars (this being the earliest chronological ep, a few months into the war).
In "Voyage of Temptation", we learn the Mandalorians had a recent Civil War which Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan got entangled with when they were sent to guard Duchess Satine. After the war, the pacifists under Satine gained power and Mandalore's warriors were exiled to Concordia.
Those are three examples I can recall.

 

In the Utapau Arc, Yoda says that in the wars between the Jedi and Sith, superweapons powered by giant Kyber Crystals, like the Death Stars, were much in use, with their power being grandiose enough to be considered fiction by the time of the Clone Wars.
In Episode III, after he orders Vader to wipe out the Jedi Temple, Sidious states that the Sith will once more rule the galaxy, implying they defeated the Jedi and Republic at some point during their respective histories.

 

Some notes I've taken on canon history, roughly in order:

(Unknown) Ancestral species unlocks secret of Hyperspace
(~1,000 generations ago) Old Republic established
(After invention of lightsaber) Battles of Rashfond were fought by the Jedi
(After Battles of Rashfond) Jedi were involved in the Peacekeeping of Parliock
(Unknown) Sith split from Jedi order during 100 Year Darkness
(~6,000 BBY) Sith build ancient shrine where Jedi Temple will eventually be erected
(~5,000 BBY) Sith build Yavin Temples with Massassi slave labor
-Sith Shrine on Coruscant abandoned
(Many events over different eras) Mandalorian commandos fought in many wars, often against the Jedi
(Unknown) Fall of the Old Republic; Jedi Temple raided; Vizsla clan steals darksaber
(Unknown) Mandalorian warriors banished to Concordia
(~1,000 BBY) Darth Bane creates the Rule of Two
-Yavin Code established
-Republic re-established
-Jedi Training Cruiser “Crucible” brought into commission
(~800 BBY) Yoda begins training Jedi

There isn't enough information to really place these anywhere:
(Unknown) First and second Coruscanti Migrations


(Unknown) Sith and Jedi use giant Kyber Crystals in warfare
(May be Sith or Mandalorian battle established above) Event depicted on Temple of Eedit walls in which the Jedi fought warriors with spiked armor and masks

 

The secrets of hyperspace were unlocked at least 4,000 years before The Force Awakens, because Maz Kanata owns a 4,000-year-old hyperspace sextant (per the Visual Dictionary).

 

Have you got a source for the Sith Split from the Jedi and the hundred year darkness?

Really great posts from all of you.

 

"Once we were brothers in the force, but from the Hundred-Year Darkness were born the Sith." -from a Jedi Holocron in Star Wars #009

 

The Mandalorian warriors were banished to Concordia only years or decades before the Clone Wars, not millennia ago.

In pre-Republic time, there was a civilization that invented the first ever superweapon, according to the novel Tarkin.

Coruscant is confirmed to have been the galactic capital for "millennia" in the TFA:VD.

 

This, and the attendant clip, is relevant to this thread's interests.
(Beware what could be considered REBELS finale spoilers)
http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...star-wars-rebels-season-finale-clip/82337804/

 

It's non-canonical, but the Art of TFA has a really great detailed picture of the first lightsaber, made out of wood with the crystal set in the top. It also had concept art of an ancient Jedi statue that was torn down and its face desecrated by dark side lightsabers.

 

Ah, I miss the protosabers!

 

Next part:


Revenge of The Sith

This conversation heavily implies that he was Palpatine’s master. We cannot assume that now. So instead then there was a tale of a Sith lord that “even prevent death”, he might not actually exist. George Lucas said that he was a Muun but again that hasn’t been stated as Canon. [TARKIN]

-Sith Rule


-Darth Plagueis the Wise

“Once more the Sith will rule the galaxy, and we shall have peace”

Did the Sith rule the galaxy? Did they? There must be some truth to it because there is a Sith Shrine beneath the Jedi Temple.

 

Not sure what you mean here. We are certain that Plagueis was Sidious's master in canon. Tarkin, Ultimate Star Wars and Darth Sidious's Biography Gallery on StarWars.com all confirm that.

 

I was not aware of that, so thanks.

LelalMekha
Also your thread from the other day, the history of the Republic one-there must have been something in the works for the Galaxy map to include Rakata Prime.

 

After the Rebels s2 finale, we have the following:

Spoiler

Several millennia before the movies, a female Sith Lord built a temple on Malachor and inside the temple, built a superweapon that used a Kyber crystal (given Filoni's comment).
The Jedi Order found out and attacked the planet before the weapon could be completed.
During the battle, it activates, killing all involved (at least on the outside).
The Sith Lord managed to record her personality into a resident holocron, which was hidden inside the temple to prevent easy access by other Sith.
The battle and the ensuing devastation became a cautionary tale passed down through the Jedi Order.

 

While it's not a direct contradiction, this line in regards to Darth Maul does seem odd now with The Clone Wars cartoon, as no one on the Jedi Council brings up Darth Maul's Nightbrother tattoos (which I would assume Qui-Gon described to them). And Mace Windu recognizes Talzin as a Nightsister on sight in 'The Disappeared' episode of the Clone Wars, so it seems the Jedi were at least aware of them.

Mace Windu: Qui-Gon, I think you're overreacting in calling your attacker a Sith Lord. He was obviously just a really well-trained Nightbrother.

 

Realize that TCW is over a decade after TPM. And I don't think Nightsisters were generally much at large, the Nightbrothers even less so (they were basically kept as chattel).

 

Also, Qui-Gon, being a Jedi master, would be able to tell the difference between being trained in the Nightsibling arts and being trained in the Jedi arts.

 

From Rebels s2 finale, I feel like the Great Scourge of Malachor is going to be the equivalent of the Battle of Ruusan from the EU. It seems like a logical transposition - massive Jedi-Sith battle, mysterious Sith weapon wipes most of both sides out, and even hints that whoever designed the temple could have had the Rule of Two in mind.