ST Prequel References in TLJ

Canto Bight felt very prequel-y in design and execution.

 

And score-wise. The Rose/Finn/Canto theme is the most PT sounding cue that Williams has done so far this trilogy.

 

It would probably be a split down the middle, with half saying that it's a disgrace to Luke's legacy, and the other half saying it brilliantly subverts expectations.

 

To me it's still the whole characters of Rey, Ren, Luke and Snoke.

 

If he could then speak to Kylo in that wierd sounding formal Naboo elocution that Amidala uses in TPM, it would be perfect.

 

Canto Bight looks a lot better on Blu-Ray / 4K digital than it did in theatres, too. I don't know if they just increased the gamma levels or what but there's more range in the darkness now than I remember in theatres. Theatres obviously have more dynamic contrast range due to projection between the brightest and darkest sections and sometimes that can lead to what's in-between missing more detail due to the brighest highlights on screen overwhelming. I felt that in the theatre for Canto Bight during the night scenes. Especially with the CBPD spotlight or the moon shot. Those parts would be so bright that some of the details in the darkness were hard to pick up on.

I don't know why but they seem to pop more on my home display and I can better appreciate the opening shot, the beach scene, the actual building details as the Falthiers are running, and most obviously on the beach with the moon as they the run with the CBPD closing in or in the grass blades.

EDIT:

Back to Padme and Luke parallels: This line about popular rule sort of connects with what Luke thinks he's doing staying away. He thinks he's giving them what they need. Even if he knows it's not what they want.

"It gives the people what they want,
not what they need."

 

You have too much class, my friend. The plebs would never understand it.

 

Ah, the TLJ narrative ‘subverts expectations’ thingy..
Well, no it doesn’t at all. Not for me anyway...
For example. The Luke we meet in TLJ is entirely keeping as to how TFA set the character up if you think about it. Everything he had devoted his time and effort, his entire life too for 20 years or so had been destroyed. Others he’d likely formed friendships and bonds with over those years were ruthlessly slaughtered...The catalyst of which being the very SON of his sister and best friend who, as a child, he’d been entrusted to train..
So with all that in mind, why would you then expect him to still be that ‘morning after Endor’ Jedi Luke?
Han said it himself to Rey and Finn in TFA. Luke blamed himself and decided to just walk away from it all and sought out the first Jedi Temple.

 

This is from TFA but I can't find that thread so I'll post it here.

Finn trying to grab Rey's hand to lead her to safety on her own home world of Jakku causing her to defiantly break free from him and assert herself reminds me of Padme defiantly reminding Anakin that Naboo is her home and she knows it very well so knows where to keep safe.

 

TLJ puts to rest the "Disney hates the PT" narrative.

There is not a single most important reference that could have been made to the PT other than Luke himself making a quick summary of the main PT lessons and why they are impacting his decisions now.

With Solo around the corner, it will be clear yet again that the PT is respected not only by the ST, but also by the Anthology as well.

 

I disagree, I think that Luke's "Darth Sidious" history lesson is the exception that proves the rule. It's the only direct reference to PT era material in the entire film. Why has LFL so diligently avoided the prequels? They probably still think they are controversial (which is true) and would prefer to rest their new material's reputation on the OT, which is still regarded as universally loved.

 

I agree. The idea that "Disney hates the prequels" is nonsense.

 

I find that distinction of "direct reference" very puzzling. The new movies especially TLJ have plenty of references. How these clear references that permeate the story of TLJ are not direct I don't know.

They are they, we see them and the origination point either from the specific prequel movies themselves or the ones from the OT that are now re-contextualized in reference to the prequels are throughout the story.

 

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but I only saw one, possibly two references throughout TFA and TLJ. The possible reference is Kylo’s mentioning of clones, although clones are also mentioned in ANH, so that one seems ambiguous to me. The second is Luke’s history lesson. All these other things people are coming up with are stylistic similarities, not direct references to events, places or people from the PT. Saying something like “the Resistance X-wings flying over the water looked like the droid ships flying over Kashyyk” does not qualify as a reference in my opinion. Am I missing something?

 

"Salt. I don't like salt. It's rough, irritating and gets everywhere."

Did anyone else think of that? That line saying "Salt" seemed such a random line on Crait.

 

Are you missing something?

Yes, this thread.

 

But seriously, I’ve read the entire thread, and I think it proves my point. If there were any more references to material that originates from the prequels then it would have been found by now. It’s pretty obvious at this point that both JJ and RJ made a conscious effort to avoid the PT at all costs. Forget about obscure stuff like midichlorians or Dugs, not even Coruscant is mentioned. I don’t think Anakin’s name is spoken either. The term “Sith” is mentioned once when Kylo does his “let it die” speech, which is strange because it’s never explained whether he and Snoke are Sith or not. For me, the question is not if but why, and I don’t remember interviewers ever asking the directors why they made those omissions. It matters because the ST is supposed to be the conclusion to a saga that chronologically starts with TPM, but actually, I don’t think JJ and RJ really cared much about that. They pretended the PT didn’t exist and hoped no one would notice.

 

You have a point, if you ignore the prequel references in The Last Jedi.

 

Lol, ok let’s try this. List five instances in TLJ that reference the people, places or events from the PT and only the PT. Not visual similarities but the fictional story of those films. I'm genuinely curious to see if I've missed something.

 

You don’t get to define what does and doesn’t count as a legitimate PT reference. The references to the PT in TLJ have been discussed in this thread for the past 11 pages.

 

I would say so. I see the prequels all over the new movies no problem. It's been discussed and gone over on threads about TFA, R1 and TLJ. If Rey, Ren, Luke and Snoke alone as characters with their stories are not direct references to the events, places or people from the "PT half" of the story I don't know what is.

Well that is the point I was asking. You want a very specific delineation between something from the Lucas films that are all about tying things together over 6 movies where each is both a single and part of an overall whole but then cordoning off half rather arbitrarily.

So as in TFA with Anakin's Lightsaber for example. How is that NOT a PT reference? How can you separate that from the meaning that it was given by ROTS in regards to Anakin.? The Lightsaber had one meaning in ANH in it's original context, then further in TESB but it's meaning shifted again due to ROTS in the overall story. This is the same Lightsaber that is featured in TFA where it's past as Luke's weapon and Anakin's before that (forged by him during the Clone Wars) is core to the story being told. Then you have Rey and Ren who are like two halves of Anakin split into Light side and Dark side then Snoke who is clearly modeled on Sidious. Again with Sidious I don't see how he can be split into two. Luke on the other hand is pretty much overwritten and just about entirely not the character from the OT but now embodies the PT Jedi in one figure but an extreme version who unlike Obi-Wan and Yoda gave up after his Jedi were destroyed. Again the connection of his story with Ben compared to Obi-Wan's and Anakin's from the PT is right there. Their confrontation in TLJ so clearly character and story beats up with Obi-Wan and Anakin as does Rey and Ren with Padme and Anakin in ROTS.

Well anyone can in their own mind of course but my point would be the delineation along those lines is very tricky. Vader in the hallway is so PT infused it's crazy but some would decide to not recognize it as such.

Lucas so skillfully crafts it all together that I find people tend to forget which parts are from what movie and then simply go to the origination point thinking that it was always covered there.

Yet from the OT alone we know next to nothing about the Jedi as an organization or how the entity of the Sith works in detail. Yet Lucas crafted things in the PT that flow into the OT and transform the original meaning or gives such a new or previously unseen view. It's fair to say the way the Jedi were shown to be with their philosophy or the Sith's Rule of Two, the prophecy of the Chosen One and Balance of the Force and the like which were not directly originated in the OT yet the story plays out like that was always the case.