CT Prior to ESB's release, was there anybody who suspected that Vader was Luke's father?

Before the ESB novel was released (which was released about a month prior to the film), did anybody anywhere suspect that Vader was Luke's father? After all, Vader is the Dutch word for "father". With a lot of crazy movie theories that float around these days, was there anybody who theorized that Vader was actually Luke's father before the ESB novel was released?

 

Personally, I think anyone who says they did is lying.

 

The reason that people remember "I am your father" so well is that NOBODY saw it coming.

 

My reaction was similar to Luke's.

 

I think it's theoretically possible someone could have, but it would have been consciously crazy speculation more than a serious theory. And I doubt even that much, really, because it was ESB that impressed this general type of plot twist upon the public's consciousness anyway.

 

I remember a lot of hype around Return of the Jedi was confirmation of if what Vader said was true - at this point, there was no reason to believe. In general, the answer is no.

But... if you wanna get technical about it, the eagle-eyed fan did know as early as 1977:
http://starwarsblog.starwars.com/2010/11/15/major-empire-spoiler-actually-dropped-in-1977/
It seems Mr. Prowse underestimated the gravity of this revelation.

 

I never suspected it and I would say its one of those twists that go down in cinema folklore. Plus its hard to imagine an era when there was no internet and little way of getting spoilers out there as quickly as there is now.

The article quoted above where Prowse reveals he was Lukes father must have gone under the radar of virtually everyone, I've certainly never seen mention of that article before. I wonder why they let him say that and why it wasn't vetoed by Lucas? Was it a guess on his part too?

 

Some more of Prowse's comments came up again in a local paper in 1978 (July, IIRC) - there's been some debate now and then about his 'revelations', not to mention an April 1978 article in Future magazine which revealed that an alternative being considered for the new SW movie was that Darth Vader was the father of Luke Skywalker.

None of these articles mention any direct sources, but they all point towards two things, IMHO:
- GL came up with the 'Father Vader' concept in 1977, not in 1978 after he rejected Leigh Brackett's first draft of ESB (February 1978);
- this plotline leaked. No way David Prowse came up with that by himself.

 

I thought I recalled reading the Cosmic Correspondence letters page of the UK Star Wars Weekly comics where a fellow fan, wrote into C.Y.R.I.L. (the letters page robot/editor) and speculated that Darth Vader was Luke's father.

Of course this was when I was about 7,8,9 years old and it could have been a letter sent in after the UK theatrical release of ESB, merely speculating if the revelation was true.

Unfortunately I've sold all my original SWW comics now so can't check, but if any UK member wants to read through all the letters. I'm sure some kid somewhere must have at least thought about it. Star Wars 2 was all we talked about on the playground and in the neighbourhood for a while...

 

That story doesn't make sense. David Prowse didn't even know Vader was Luke's father when they were *filming* "Empire". They deliberately kept that info from him. Not only because it was a major spoiler, but because he had a bad habit of letting things slip out during fan events. So *if* he did say it, it was an oddly prophetic joke, nothing more. He had no idea.

 

I was completely caught off guard by the unveiling of the Skywalker lineage in Empire Strikes Back just like everybody else.

The one takeaway from that monumental moment, though, that I had never even considered before I read about it in one of these threads was that someone mentioned how children who grow up watching the movie saga in the order it currently is in will forever know before the events of Empire that Vader is Luke's father. That is a shame because the big reveal as it was... was unforgettable, to say the very least.

 

While it certainly is a great twist, I don't think it's a big loss. I can't even remember a time when I didn't know Darth Vader was Luke's father, and yet watching that scene sends chills down my spine every time. It's not the shock you feel that makes the scene so potent, it's the shock Luke feels. It's the horrible implications and emotions dredged up by Vader's revelation that make the scene so powerful, and those are things that last forever.

If a scene can only derive its power from having a surprise twist, then it's not a very good scene, IMO. If that's the case, it can only be enjoyed to its fullest extent once. Twists are overrated. It's the feelings behind the twist that matter. In that sense, I think ESB is only enhanced by the foreknowledge gained from watching the prequels.

 

Truthfully, even without the prequels, I think the "twist" is already ruined for future generations. "I am your father" is so iconic at this point, that most people know the Luke-Vader connection, regardless if they have ever even seen SW.

 

Well, as a kid I was Luke Skywalker, I will have you know... and Superman, Batman, Mario, Luigi, Chip & Dale... but that is besides the point. Ahem, anyway the shock I felt meant more because my imagination - putting myself in Luke's shoes, so to speak - lent even more weight to the segment. That is what I think may be irretrievable hence forth for children viewing the saga in order, that moment where it feels like you are being told "No... I am your father..." for the very first time.

Dunno. That's just my two cents, anyhow. As you and Yanksfan pointed out maybe the scene still holds that same impact no matter what, as it has become such a popular part of movie lore 'n all.

 

I think I knew that Vader was Luke's father before I watched ESB as a very young child, I think my brother spoiled it for me or I just knew from people talking about it. I have no memory of being shocked by the twist.

Honestly, I've never really cared for the scene. Like, at all. I think it's kinda lame, I don't feel anything for Luke because he's too busy crying ridiculously, and I think it's just too melodramatic for me to ever take seriously, even as a child. To me it's...a non-entity in the saga, it's not noteworthy, just when it comes to entertainment.

Just to clarify I wasn't even born when it came out, and didn't see it until 1991, so I don't have any knowledge relevant to the OP. Just putting forth my opinion.

 

That's basically what I was getting at, though maybe I didn't phrase it clearly enough. You feel the shock through Luke because you identify with him, and Luke is totally shocked every time, even if you aren't.

 

You phrased it clearly, I just likely misunderstood. Either way, though, I share your sentiments towards the specific scene, and was just putting forth my own experiences on the matter to lend credence to what I was trying to convey.

 

Of course I knew. After all, Episode III comes before Episode V.

 

David Prowse said some pretty goofy things during the lead-up to ESB, it seems.

 

Oh my god, I just read that link. I LOVE the rumors about Han being in a light saber duel with Vader. Ha ha ha! Or the one where he and Chewie meet 13th century Earthlings on some desert planet.

It makes me feel better about the absurd things I've been hearing in the Episode VII forum.

 

I think they talked about both the original Brackett draft and the Lucas one so without knowledge of which was first then both were options.

I agree but just last night I was talking to someone about your exact point. The surprise of Luke is what is important but he just couldn't get over that he wanted to keep his surprise alive in some way and just couldn't get past the idea that the PT tells you "first" he thought the whole underlying premise of the PT (which he doesn't like but oddly watches over and over again!!) was flawed and what at least should have happened is that they cut away and don't show Anakin becoming the armored Vader or I suppose don't use the term Darth so Maul and Sidious are just single names and Anakin keeps the name Anakin.

 

Nobody saw the revelation coming, simply because everyone expected the sequel to Star Wars to be another adventure of Han, Luke, and Leia that had a beginning, middle and ending. Nobody expected Empire to be a dark movie, a movie where the bad guys win, a movie without an ending that essentially is To Be Continued, so nobody thought of some big revelation that would make you look at the original in a whole different way.