Proof of Palpatine orchestrating Shmi's kidnapping?

Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by Lord Mauly Mall, Jun 24, 2002.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. FOTR-AOTC-TTT_2002 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2002
    star 3
    Although I stated that he controls everything, I'm not sure he is responsible for Shmi's kidnapping.

    I don't think he has to kill Anakin's mother to seduce Anakin. It's just a bonus.

    The point of Anakin's mother death is to show why jedi knights train very young babies, and keep them away from their families.
    Anakin keeps thinking about his mother, and he's afraid of losing her. When that happens, he is unable to control his emotions, and gets mad at his jedi master ("it's all OB1's fault").

    The jedi fail in their training of Anakin.
    Anakin is frustrated with his master long before his mother dies. Palpatine senses it, and he exploits it. He is in a position oif power, and he has very little to do to get what he wants.
  2. Twink_Kee Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2001
    star 5
    I fail to see the logic in people using Aurra Sing's presence in TPM to justify her involvement.

    Aurra Sing = ANH Outrider = AOTC Aayla Secura = AOTC Ansion

    She's an EU easter egg.
  3. Ret Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 1999
    star 6
    Excellent. I can't wait for Palpy to reveal it all including Sing's part in it. :)
  4. Twink_Kee Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2001
    star 5
    Yeah.

    If ANH were made today, the people would accuse Palpatine of allowing the Death Star plans to fall into the hands of Princess Leia, so they would fall into the hands of the droids, so the droids would be bought by the Lars, so the Stormtroopers could kill the Lars (and - coincidentally - blame an attack on the Jawas by the sandpeople), and thus get Luke Skywalker involved in the galactic civil war, and thus place him to the point where he could get tempted by the darkside.

    www.2contrived.com
  5. Lord Mauly Mall TFN/JC Banner Artist Team

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 1999
    star 7
    There's a lot of good discussion here and I'm glad it hasn't boiled down to flaming and such. With that in mind and also the fact that I don't want to turn this into a big Aurra Sing fest, Aurra was created for TPM despite the fact that she first appeared in comic books a few months before TPM came out. Initially Lucas and Chiang created her for TPM, whereas the Outrider and Aayla Secura were already pre-existing EU elements that eventually made it into the movies.

    What does that say about her character? Well if you do want to go by EU(and I'm sure most of you don't) where the bulk of her story is told, she has relations with the Tuskens. In the early comics she hunts down a former Jedi who actually became a Tusken. Just something to think about.

    Now about the Tuskens as seen in the movies; they do communicate with each other through a series of grunts and such. Remember how Leia sounded in ROTJ as Boussch the bounty hunter? It's possible the Tusken's masks have the same effect creating a distorted dialect only they can decipher. I'm pointing this out for the reason of indicating that no matter how savage and brutal this race is, they can communicate. They have families, they're nomadic, and they have their own primitive society. So it's not beyond a doubt that someone could actually communicate and bargain with them to either abduct Shmi or just hold her captive. Keep in mind there were 2 Tuskens guarding the entrance to the hut Shmi was in. That to me is a strong indication that they were holding her for a reason. And if you want to go by the Topps cards, they plainly indicate that she was kidnapped. Why kidnap Shmi Skywalker? To lure farmers out to try and rescue her so the Tuskens could try and kill them? Seems a little far fetched when the Tuskens could just conduct raids. It's also this particular line from Cliegg that to me at least, seems to indicate that the Tusken attack was planned for the particular reason of taking Shmi:

    It was just before dawn. They came out of nowhere.

    Nowhere? He lives on Tatooine and he thinks the Tuskens just came from nowhere? The way that's worded makes me think that the farmers had little dealings with the Tuskens, as if the sand people stayed to themselves and all of a sudden they just came at the farmers and took Shmi.

    I wouldn't underestimate the intelligence of the Tuskens.
  6. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Tuskens are nomads. Hence they change locations alot. No one goes bothering brutal killer, savages.
  7. Ret Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 1999
    star 6
    "What does that say about her character? Well if you do want to go by EU(and I'm sure most of you don't) where the bulk of her story is told, she has relations with the Tuskens. In the early comics she hunts down a former Jedi who actually became a Tusken. Just something to think about. "

    That's a very good point. It could just be a coincidence but still it is a connection.
  8. Vonn Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2000
    star 4
    Lord Mauly Maul,

    I think you are mislabeling that music as Emperor Palpatine's theme. Just because it appears in most of the scenes with the Emperor, it doesn't necessarily make it HIS theme. It is essentially the "Dark Side" theme of the Star Wars movies, and the Emperor is the epitome of the Dark Side (hence why it is played when he is around).

    Therefore, it is appropriate that it plays while Anakin is leading toward the "Dark Side," since it is the "Dark Side" theme.
  9. Lord Mauly Mall TFN/JC Banner Artist Team

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 1999
    star 7
    Well that music is predominantly used in ROTJ during all the scenes with the Emperor as well as in TPM with Sidious. The only other place it's heard is in AOTC during Anakin's confession and when Dooku is heading to rendezvous with Sidious on Coruscant. Maul has the sanskrit chants derived from Duel of the Fates, Vader has the Imperial March and the Emperor/Sidious has the low choral voices.
  10. tedpikul Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 2002
    i'm sorry if someone mentioned this already, but there is some similarity to the events in empire...when han is tortured by vader solely for the purpose of allowing luke to sense his pain (and probably leia's as a result of what she sees happen to han), and to bring luke to the scene.

    obviously there's not much reason to bring anakin to that location, but to his dying mother, who appeared to be in a situation that was preventable.

    now, i don't necessarily believe that lucas has decided to involve palpatine in all of this, but i really hope so. it would seem a wasted opportunity if not. aura sing certainly could be the middle person between palpatine and the tuskens. they might have been given compensation to keep her alive and in pain...of course having no idea that the chosen one would be coming to slaughter their entire tribe.
  11. Maul5 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2001
    star 3
    They took her while she was picking Mushrooms and she did every morning. Thats the perfect way to capture someone study that persons habits and then take them. If they were mad at the farmers or on a mindless killing spree why not kill everyone in the Homested."They came out of nowhere" like Cligg said the Sand People could of killed all of them.

    They wanted Shmi They knew where she was and how to get Her. Now we are just trying to figure out the why??? I just cant believe they just happen to be walking by at the right time when she was out getting Mushrooms pick her up, leave everyone else alone,Tie her up beat her up for 30 days guard her with 2 guards even though she tied up and so week she cant move for no reason. Also as someone said before the Sand People are Nomadic and move around alot why would the want or need a third wheel too drag around with them just for laughs or they had nothing better to do.

    I wouldn't count on the info in the Novel to be all completely accurate GL wouldn't want to give any of this away if he Chose to have Palp's involed in this and that the best part of this discussion it could go ethier way and we still have three years to kill. :D
  12. Lord-Gretzky Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 3
    It seems to come down to this...Either you wanna believe that Shmi's death is coincidence, and he had nothing to do with it. That Palpatine just got lucky. Or you believe that her kidnapping and death is too perfect and too much of a coincidence. I believe the latter because everything about Palpatine in every movie seems to show that he controls what's important in his attaining and maintaining his position. That's how Palpatine has come across to me. Anybody who believes it is too contrived or convoluted of a plan to help push Anakin over the edge doesn't seem to understand the plan he devised to take over the Republic. If Shmi didn't die, do you think that Anakin would still turn? What if Shmi didn't die for like 20 years? She is a huge reason why Anakin eventually turns isn't she? Maybe she isn't as a big a reason as I believe she is. Maybe that's my problem. I just feel that if she hadn't died that Anakin may not eventually turn, and that doesn't work for Palpatine. That seems like a major event in which Palpatine would need to have *some kind* of hand. I don't know how exactly though. Tell me this, did anyone question how Luke was Vader's son after Empire? There's a whole series of events that led to that, yet everyone seems to have been fine with him just being his father, without any explanation of those events. I don't know why this is so much different personally.
  13. Lord Mauly Mall TFN/JC Banner Artist Team

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 1999
    star 7
    Too bad there isn't a poll feature in this forum because this would have made a good one.
  14. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    RA Salvatore went over the details of the novelizations with Lucas himself. Anything that he didn't want, wasn't put in. The three prolouge chapters were authorized by Lucas and the point of view about torturing Shmi was also authorized. Meaning that it is valid. If there was more to it, there would be hints. In TPM, the dream/vision Anakin had was returning to Tatooine as a Jedi to free slaves and then seeing Shmi. Then she vanishes and the last thing he sees are Tuskens. Now, we all assumed that it was his vision of waking to find himself surrounded by them. But they didn't kill him. That is also canon in the series.

    The AOTC novelization said that the Tuskens began to move closer towards the Mostiure Farms and attacking people at random intervals. Shmi went to get mushrooms as always, only at dawn. The Tuskens saw her and grabbed her. Celigg went with 30 others and they were all beaten badly.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.