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PT PT Era Lightsaber Blades

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by CT1138, Sep 17, 2013.

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Which lightsaber style do you prefer?

  1. Prequel era lightsabers

    28 vote(s)
    87.5%
  2. Original trilogy lightsabers

    4 vote(s)
    12.5%
  1. CT1138

    CT1138 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2013
    I rechecked, and I think it may have been the screencaps I was using that gave the cores that "washed" look. Here's caps I just took from my '04 DVD's. the blades look much cleaner with nicely pronounced colors.
    [​IMG]
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  2. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    I'll have to disagree. The lightsabers in TESB are the ones needing the most work. You can specially see that on your second picture. Not to mention Vader's pinkish blades.
     
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  3. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001

    It had to do with positioning the camera a particular way, which resulted in the prop blades being visible from time to time. Lucas then went to Korean animator Nelson Shin, who would become known for his work on "The Transformers" and "The Simpsons", to help them out. He demonstrated that a combination of rotoscoping, using one frame of film that was lighter than the others and using an X-Acto knife on the film, would help give the blades their characteristic look. The technique was done using an optical printer. that's why you see the black lines in the blades in ANH. Because Lucas was moving to digital cameras for the PT, the older methods were abandoned, in favor of crafting a solid blade with rotoscoping and done digitally.
     
  4. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    Neat stuff, man. I can't imagine all those epic stunts of ESB and ROTJ with bulky wires going into the actors' sleeves.
    Actually, the Blu Ray release cleaned up a lot of the shots nicely, but I think the 2004 release was the worst the sabers have looked. Not so much in ESB, but it's really present in ROTJ; the infamous blades crossing is probably the most notable example.
    [​IMG]
     
  5. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    Yeah, by the time ANH had come out, Lucas realized there was no point in using the reflector method and instead opted for the metal rods instead. The color coated ones for the PT had to do with the use of blue and green screen sets. That and you got a better fight sequence out of metal rods that weren't so fragile. "Spaceballs" was the first film to feature energy blades that transition between the OT and the PT style. The pulsating effect is still present, but you can see some of the coloring effects used a decade later.
     
  6. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Not quite, because they were used on actual sets and locations as well. But the logic is the same as green/blue screen. They had to use colours that stand out (red and green) in order for the rods to be recognized on the computer.
     
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  7. CT1138

    CT1138 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2013
    Then we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. IMO, the ANH effects suffered the worse from aging, though the restorative work that turned Vader's blade pinkish isn't really an age defect or a limitation of the special effects. It's just a screw up on the part of whoever did the restorations. I would say that ESB is the second best of the OT, whereas RotJ had the best original effects, save the crossing lightsabers that got screwed up by, again, whoever did the restorations (same with the color timings).
     
  8. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    Oh I agree, ROTJ looked the best when it first came out. They actually didn't need much work when it came to the Special Editions, but color timing wasn't working in its favor. Though colors aside, it was the overall form of the blades in Jedi that were executed so well, for once it felt uniform and pretty seamless. It set a good foundation for what was to come with the prequels.
     
  9. heels1785

    heels1785 Skywalker Saga + JCC Manager / Finally Won A Draft star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    PT blades look brilliant. However, given the changes made, the only OT where the lack of technology is really noticeable still (even on the BR) is ANH. ESB and ROTJ have been cleaned up.
     
  10. Mr. K

    Mr. K Moderator Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    Yes, that's correct. Good example. The blades in "Spaceballs" was a better rotoscope job than the OT, IMO.

    @darth-sinister, didn't the ANH blades also rotate in their hilt? I know they were covered in the reflective material, but didn't they spin in their handles? I seem to remember a clip of Guinness in the cantina scene with the blade pre-rotoscoped and the spinning motion made the pulsating effect. The reflective material is similar to the stuff they used on the Kryptonian costumes for Richard Donner's Superman. It took a lot of careful staging & blocking to make sure the camera was in just the right place to catch the best reflection.

    The enhancement and color correction on the blades is one of the few changes made to the OT that I think was a real benefit.
     
  11. Aegon Starcaster

    Aegon Starcaster Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Scotchlite! Lovely stuff.

    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Merkual

    Merkual Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013
    I prefer the PT blades myself,

    I did notice that the ROTS lightsabers seems thinner, able to reduce in size slightly (although this might have been a technical error) and had sword tips at the end,

    for a long time I didn't like it, but now I can't decide if I actually like it better.
     
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  13. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    Time and technological improvements show in that film. I had thought about it last month when I was watching the film and watched the Schwartz duel. Of course, that was also the only 'saber blade' duel that didn't involve metal rods at all, so all the effects were done by Apogee were the first to go completely solo for more than a few seconds. TESB had a very brief shot when Luke cuts open a hole in the AT-AT for the grenade and then in ROTJ, a longer shot when Luke has Vader as his mercy. The latter was confirmed when you watch the behind the scenes of ROTJ and you see the blade pop off right before Luke cuts Vader's hand off. The PT would be the first to feature more than one scene with the saber blades animated without a reference blade.

    Right on both counts.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Of course, it would have been more difficult in March of 77 when the Krypton scenes were filmed, with the actors moving around a lot. There wasn't as many scenes involving movement in ANH, until the duel. Here, you had a dozen actors standing about with only three or four moving at a time. Only one shot involved the whole Science Council walking away from Jor-El. Plus, you had the smaller S-Shield for Jor-El's black robes which would have been an interesting trick. But I digress.

    Interesting side note, wires and a battery pack were used in the 80's for many a sword fight to create sparks. Most notable of these films was "Highlander" and they would shock the actors during the fights. I wonder if the same had happened with Guinness when he filmed the duel. Probably not.
     
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  14. Mr. K

    Mr. K Moderator Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    Sir Alec would have certainly taken issue with that, I'm sure. Would have loved to have been a fly-on-the-wall hearing GL try to persuade him to consider it.
     
  15. Mr. K

    Mr. K Moderator Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    I noticed that immediately when I first saw ROTS, particularly the scene where Sidious has revealed himself to Anakin and has a blade near his head. It had a pointed tip! So far as I can recall, all of the other movies had a rounded tip on the blades. It's kind of sad that such a little technical thing distracted me from a really powerful moment. Ian is going full-on ROTJ "I can feeeel your anger..." and I'm zero'ed in on the lightsaber having a pointed tip!
     
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  16. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Lightsabers with pointed tips first appeared in AotC with Dooku's lightsaber.
     
  17. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    I'm not really seeing it. Got any caps for that one?
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    Also, re-watching the Darth Vader vs. Obi-Wan fight, most of the sparks from the clashes are done through special effects; there's only one noticeable instance where Vader's saber causes a small explosion on the wall behind Kenobi. Of all the things Guinness has expressed disdain about, this situation doesn't seem too bad at all.
     
  18. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    They also mention that it's the first time they made the blades like this on the DVD commentary.
     
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  19. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    Strange. It is indeed pointed in those pictures, but didn't seem to be in the previous scene. Possibly made during different points in production?
     
  20. Darth Dominikkus

    Darth Dominikkus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2013
    as technology increased, the way lightsabers were portrayed looked a lot more attractive as well.
     
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  21. Darth Dominikkus

    Darth Dominikkus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2013
    I share this same reaction.
     
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  22. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    Or, the difference between a moving blade and one being locked up with another, long enough for us to see it.:)
     
  23. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    Yes, but in the first picture I posted, Dooku's blade is locked with Obi-Wan's, and in the second, it's locked with Anakin's.
     
  24. Mr. K

    Mr. K Moderator Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    I don't know if it was my TV or what, but Qui-Gon's green lightsaber never colorized quite right on the original VHS/DVD release. It doesn't seem to be an issue for me in later releases. Weird. The blue & red ones looked fantastic but the green was terribly washed out. Just me?
     
  25. Darth Dominikkus

    Darth Dominikkus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2013
    I think that might just be the quality of the VHS. I shared that quality, there was never a solid and definite color of Qui-Gon's blade on the VHS TPM.