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TOR PVP: Is it unbalanced?

Discussion in 'Games' started by Yodaminch, Feb 27, 2012.

  1. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Force Ghost star 6

    Mar 6, 2002
    Those of you who have played both Republic and Imperial characters, I would love to get your opinion. Having not yet made my Imperial character, I can only offer the perspective of a Republic player.

    After several weeks now, I have a good idea of how the Rebel Alliance felt when facing the Empire. The ratio of Republic to Imperial wins on our server seems to be very poor. But apparently, this is a common trend in many servers. And while it is undeniable that there are more Imperial players than Republic players, there is definitely this feeling of being outclassed and outgunned.

    And while it's challenging but bearable much of the time, there are days where it kills morale and motivation for others to continue playing.

    Part of the problem is that these wins contribute to dailies and weeklies. So if the imps win 10 of the 12 matches, they are gearing up at an extremely fast rate compared to the Republic who may have to spend 6-8 hours of PVPing just to get 3 wins for the daily. The only consolation being that they count towards the weekly as well so 3 dailies in a row = 1 weekly win.

    But couple that with more medals and mvp votes and wins = more commendations, and the armor domination just gets worse and worse. Right now, I believe the current highest armor rank in PVP is Battlemaster. This is what many sith are now running with while many Republic players are just now completing the Centurian armor and moving on to Champion sets and only a handful that I've seen have a full Battlemaster set (if that).

    This also seems compounded by the knowledge that imperial pvpers had bugs they could exploit to their advantage. Apparently Alderaan Civil War had a turret that fired two shots instead of one if it was captured by Imperials. Not to mention they could bring in up to 12 players somehow while republic forces were stuck with 8. And, the original randomness of champion armor seems to have greatly benefited the imperials.

    Finally, there are the classes themselves. The imperials seem to have abilities that (perhaps at first glance) are more effective than those of their Republic counterpart. As good as healers on the Republic can be, we can be run through far faster than the Imperial healers. It is also more likely to find healers ganged up on by the lightning powers of the sorcerer which I believe are comparable (though perhaps more formidable) to the telekinetic throw sages have.

    Which leads me to this lingering question. It seemed evident from the interviews and promotion that Bioware was rather excited for their Bounty Hunter and Sith class characters. I didn't necessarily always see that same enthusiasm for Republic characters. And given that imperials do seem to have the edge in several noticeable ways, one has to wonder: Is there are bias? Is it unbalanced? Or do all Republic players just fail at playing PVP?
  2. Dark Lady Mara

    Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Jun 19, 1999
    I think you're right about some Imperial classes being overpowered compared to the Republic classes - Sorc has advantages over Sage, and if I recall correctly, the Imperial agent is able to do certain things while moving that Smugglers can only do from cover.

    If you think about it, though, isn't that consistent with how the GFFA should be? The dark side is supposed to be more powerful than the light side. That's why Jedi can be tempted by it. And for a general view that applies to all characters, not just the Force-users, consider how much easier it is to **** stuff up than it is to build.

    I'm not saying that makes for great play... but it is realistic. :p
  3. Likewater

    Likewater Jedi Master star 4

    Dec 31, 2009
    No, the darkside is not more powerful than the light.

    They dont even call the "light" light, its just the force, and its darkside.[nerdirritation]

    Quicker, easier, more seductive.

    not more powerful.
  4. Dark Lady Mara

    Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Jun 19, 1999
    Lucas himself says it on the AotC DVD commentary, actually.

    Evidence from the films also supports that view. Sidious barely breaks a sweat throwing half the Senate chamber around, but Yoda seems winded after lifting a starfighter. He may tell Luke that the dark side is no stronger, but he and Obi-Wan aren't honest with Luke about a lot of things - and even when they are being honest, they're not always correct (eg. their belief that Luke needed to kill Vader because there was no way he could redeem himself).
  5. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Force Ghost star 6

    Mar 6, 2002
    See, this is my thinking as well. I think the developers were trying to make it a struggle for Republic players. Good does not always triumph over evil and in this era, the Republic is much like the Rebel Alliance, fighting against a stronger opponent.

    But I think they failed to take into account that these struggles would lead to unfair advantages that would eventually widen the gap of wins and losses. Because as more Sith won, they were able to get better gear. Which led to their better gear keeping them alive longer. Which led to more wins. Which led to better gear. Which as you can gather, continued onward. Meanwhile, the Republic players were lucky to grind out wins from playing each other in Huttball long enough to be at least 1 gear tier below their imperial opponents. While some Republic players have hit the top gear tier, many are just now into their second tier.
  6. SithLordDarthRichie

    SithLordDarthRichie CR Emeritus: London star 8

    Oct 3, 2003
    Never mind the fact that it was only when embracing anger that any of the Jedi managed to defeat any of the Sith Lords (Obi Wan killed Darth Maul in anger after he killed Qui Gon, Anakin was taunted by Dooku and then stuck him down, Luke only beat Vader after giving int to his anger). The Dark Side is stronger in terms of raw force power, but it is the strength of unity and courage that is stronger in the light.
  7. Dark Lady Mara

    Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Jun 19, 1999
    That's exactly how I see it. The dark side conveys more power, but there are certain things dark siders can never do.

    Now, as for what we can do with our Republic characters other than playing 50 Huttball games per day.... :p
  8. Ehpik

    Ehpik Jedi Knight

    Jan 7, 2013
    I understand this is an old topic, but I feel like I should update it, since a lot has changed since the 1.2 update (such-as class nerfs, etc.)

    I've recently been keeping a tally of my Wins and Losses on both Factions at 50 PVP. This is currently with the 1.6 update and now with cross-server queues and server merges, PVP in my experience and statistics, is sided with the Republic Faction. I started logging Wins/Losses Friday, December 28, 2012. This is the outcome of what I have so far (Note that I've done this experiment with my War Hero (gear) Sith Assassin, Elite War Hero (gear) Pyrotech, and War Hero (gear) Jedi Guardian):

    Republic Faction:

    Total Matches: 26
    Losses: 8
    Wins: 17

    Imperial Faction:

    Total Matches: 41
    Losses: 26
    Wins: 15

    Remember, this is off my own personal experience, I'm sure it will vary in Pre-50 PVP, along with the experience of everyone else.
  9. Jedi_Matt

    Jedi_Matt Jedi Master star 4

    Jul 11, 2002
    Nice one. I wish it was like that on my Server, though to be honest, I haven't done the stats like you have :)
  10. Bazinga'd

    Bazinga'd The Man / Also Known as Bazinga'd star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Nov 1, 2012
    IMHO, I think its highly unbalanced for two primary reasons. Imp PvPers on the whole are more experienced their their republic counterparts. There seems to be a lot more coordination and teamwork done on the Imp side, and that usually occurs with more experienced.

    Second, I do think several Imp classes are severely OP. Sorcerers in particular.
  11. Ehpik

    Ehpik Jedi Knight

    Jan 7, 2013
    Through my experience, I think the total opposite. I believe the Republic classes (not all of them) are far more OP than the Imp side. Commando healers are far better healers than Mercenary healers. Jedi Shadows are far more powerful (and get one more stun) than Sith Assassins. Scoundrels get more stuns earlier in levels than Operatives do. Jedi Sage Force Quakes have a larger radius than Sith Sorcerer Lightning Storm.

    Again, this is from experiences I've had and so far, I've had more wins on the Republic side than on the Imperial side (I do not favor a faction).
  12. Bazinga'd

    Bazinga'd The Man / Also Known as Bazinga'd star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Nov 1, 2012

    You may be a fantastic PvP player or have been very lucky with your groups. But its too small and limited a sample to judge from those numbers.

    I think a better sample to judge would be looking at Premades with similar valor levels (Post lvl 50).
  13. Blue_10

    Blue_10 Jedi Padawan star 4

    Oct 13, 2001
    I've seen this same phenomenon a lot in Star Trek Online. My Federation character was constantly ganged up on by an overwhelming Klingon force, just as my Jedi often finds himself completely surrounded by Sith and what-not. The problem hasn't been so much a balancing issue as I found that my Sith played exactly the same as my Jedi. The problem is that the more experienced players group together and the less experienced ones run off on their own. In World of Tanks, this isn't a problem because teams are completely random, but in the other aforementioned games people want to play the bad guys. By sheer volume of baddies, you're bound to get those more experienced players.
    Bazinga'd likes this.
  14. Plebeian

    Plebeian Jedi Padawan star 1

    Oct 31, 2012
    Varies from server to server.
  15. randomface48

    randomface48 Jedi Youngling

    May 30, 2013
    A lot of the time I feel it's due to poor teamwork