RANDOM yet semi-important/controversial matter

First of all, I just wanted to vent, because it's a screwed up world we live in. Either way, please don't judge me for what I'm about to say.

There's this homosexual guy in band. Everyone knows about his sexuality and he's open about it. I have befriended him to a degree (we're not that close) and he's a great guy. Unfortunately, some of my gang of friends totally judge him on the fact he likes guys.

Well, today, we all found out that this guy knows that one of our gang is gay as well. Sure, it struck all of us as a surprise and didn't believe him, until he showed us pictures.

All of a sudden everyone forgot their homophobia. All of us were shocked. Even though our friend had promoted the harrasing of the original homosexual guy, everyone felt bad. Why? Because he is our friend.

Now, I feel like venting, for two reasons. While I feel extremely bad for my friend, since he is pretty much being humiliated, I think he deserves everything for being so evil to the other guy.

At the same time, it is amazing how great friends support eachother no matter what. I thought his best friend was going to blow up, yet he calmy replied, "It's hard to believe." Yet he continued to joke around and accept the news.

We should all be like my gang. Sure, some may argue it is against religion, morality, whatever. Yet, if we keep the prejudice going, we'll never get anywhere...

This may be a hot button issue, but I will throw my POV in the mix.

People are people. There are good people, there are bad people, there people who just try to get by any way they can. It's my personal belief that people are free to act and think as they wish as long as it does not willfully harm another. If two guys want to love each other, so be it. No sweat off my back. Just don't expect me to join in.

Seriously, you can't solve the world's prejudices and you shouldn't try. Just be a friend to your friends and try to treat everyone you meet with respect. Be a leader in the solution, not a part of the problem. Everyone else will either fall in line or live a very unhappy life. The choice is theirs. We must strive to live in harmony with our fellow human beings, even the ones who subscribe to a different way of life.

L8r

Well said. -c

Or just hate everyone evenly. That way you cant be accused of anything.

Ive tried the peace and harmony thing with your fellow human beings, and it doesnt work all the time, sometimes you just gotta beat the hell out of someone. All these stuck up people in the world that think theyre better then everyone else. Thats another reason why Star Wars is so perfect. It surrounds us, it binds us well you know the rest.

Maybe your friend picked on the gay guy because he isnt happy with himself. Maybe he hates the fact that he likes guys as well and the only way for him to vent is to pick on others that are gay.

I agree with Dale, and I would type a gigantic essay on this, but I will refrain from doing so. Everyone being nice and kind to everyone is simply not possible; it is not the way the world works, and it never, ever will be. Mankind, except in terms of technology, really has not advanced in thousands upon thousands of years. The reasons people dislike and hate others changes, but not the hate itself. Trust me, if everyone, over time, accepts gay people, something else will just come up and some will be hated for that. Little circle that goes around and around.

Hm, why is it you always hear, "...blah blah gays and lesbians... blah blah." Aren't lesbians themselves "gay"? Gay applies to men and women, correct? So, why do female gays get another title and gay men don't? Yes, we know the derogatory terms for both of them, but, so far, "gay" and "lesbian" are not dregatory or mean terms (they might be one day, who knows). So, to be fair, should not gay men get a special title?

Also, did we not somewhat discuss this at our last meeting? If his best friend did not know and no one knew, for all we know (and we have really no detail on this) he might just be experimenting, he might be straight.

You said "pictures," though. What "pictures"? Naked pictures? If so, and if the other guy brought them and showed them, he could have a lawsuit on his hands if the other guy or his family wanted to sue.

And, on top of that, you said you think he deserves what happens to him, and then you go on to say that everyone should be like your "gang" and be understanding. Again, the detail in your post is minimal, but if he was, in fact, making fun of the other guy as much as it seems he was, laughing at him, pointing at him, etc., then I would not have been his friend in the first place. It's one thing to make fun of and laugh at a jerk who deserves it (and some do deserve it), but you make it sound like he was doing so for the simple fact he is gay. If that is the case, I would have found a reason to make fun of him long before this for the simple fact he's an a-hole (can't say the full word here, right?) I would never have considered him a friend. Now, if the gay guy is a complete jerk, then, yes, you can use anything against him, even the fact he is gay, to make fun of him. See? It's all so very complicated.

Anyway, that's it for now. I'll talk to you about this later; this just might be the wrong area to do so.

Still, pictures? If it is what I think it is, it is like that episode of "Without A Trace" from two weeks ago... anyone watch that series?

Brandon

Brandon, I will say that while living in harmony with our fellow humans may not ever be a likely scenario, it is something we should still shoot for or what's the point in being "civilized"? We may as well be back up in trees slinging crap at each other. Just because the majority of people in the world act badly does not mean that I need to.

L8r

Well, remember, "good," "bad," "evil," "right," "wrong," etc., are all subjective words. There is no objective force (no pun intended) deciding what is right and wrong. One of the funniest lines, and, at the same time, most true, would be Dark Helmet from Spaceballs, "Evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Civilized, too, is just a term that others use to describe certain situations. In no way did I say you should go out and be mean to others, but that *is* the way the world works, and that will never change, ever. It is against human nature itself, not just that, but nature. Biology, sociology, philosophy, and a ton of other things will show you this (you being not YOU but the universal you).

Personally, I probably do it all and touch all of those terms I used above. My friends will vouch for the fact that I am exceedingly nice, kind, understanding, and will go out of my way to help them (for those of you here, all one of you, that know this to be true, please do confirm it); however, I have also been mean to others, sometimes because they deserve it and sometimes just because. Now, I *admit* to doing that while others do not. We have all done it, and we will all do it in the future, be a jerk just because. To say otherwise is an outright lie and a person that says that is not to be trusted.

I have said this before, used it as an example, but remember in school how someone might make fun of someone else, and then others just say, "Oh, he's just doing it to feel better about himself." Well, okay, so what? If it makes you feel better to hurt others, why not do it? I am not saying you SHOULD do this or should NOT do this. I am saying, though, it happens on a daily basis and will always happen, and, on top of that, we have all done it and will do it again.

Those that lobby for absolute peace and understanding are scary and have no grasp on reality. They are only injuring themselves and fighting a not only losing but a pointless battle. A losing battle seems a waste to fight, a pointless battle seems a waste to fight, but combine the two and you end up with nowhere to go.

Should we go around hurting and insulting others just for fun? That is not for me to decide. All I will say is that it happens and will never cease.

Brandon

No, we should do like in Star Trek and be peaceful and harmonious amongst ourselves while being mean to and kicking alien ass! See, we have a bit of common ground afterall . . .

L8r

They have their own special name, its called Fag. You do have a point there with the special names Brandon. To me theyre just like crackheads, dont really hate them for what they are, just choose to not be around them, and thats my right being a citizen of this great country. People make fun of us for being Star Wars fans, I make fun of people for not being Star Wars fans. Hey when god created this world and eveything in it it all started with Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. Everyones different and everyone is going to make fun of everyone for being different. So I say pick something good that you want to be picked on about and made fun of, and then sit back and enjoy the ride cause you only live once.

As for Brandon's comment on teasing someone just to be mean, one word: Gollum.

Today we were reading Hamlet in class and came across an important line that may apply to the whole should-we-be-nice-or-not-subject: "There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so."

As for gay people, whatever. I don't care. Love who you will. Imagine if heterosexuality was a minority? Then you would have to be careful about who you love? Or better yet, imagine liking someone who doesn't like you back? That's how some gay people (notice I said PEOPLE, not guys or girls) feel when they like a straight person...

Like Brandon said, I foresee this topic getting locked.

So, after *all* that has been said, what have we learned here? What can all of us, with our different opinions and feelings about subjects, take away from this? Some of us dislike homosexuality, some don't care, some love it. Some of us believe in hurting people, some don't. Yes, that is obvious. But what have we LEARNED? From a topic as important, and timely, as this, we must all walk away with at least one thing. I think I have the answer.

We have learned that Shakespeare, according to Stefanie's "Hamlet" quotation, has completely ripped me off.

Brandon

What about the gay guy in the tutu dancing aroun with a wig on? Who said gay men dont have a sense of humor?

Perhaps he was just projecting feelings of hate to cover up or throw off the idea he was gay? A sort of Occam's Razor situation may fit this- sometimes the simplest explanation is the best explanation.