Saga Ranking the Cinematography of the Saga

"My personal favorite? Darth Maul clashing against Qui Gon and Obi Wan as he backs up into the massive power-beam chamber. The synchronization of the dolly camera movement, the choreography, and the music just gives me chills every time."

I know the exact shot that you're talking about here. It's the one with the really wide angle lens. It pushes into the doorway of the reactor while Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon attack Maul at the same time. It's really sublime. Not only one of my favorite shots in all of the Star Wars, but one of my favorite shots in all of movies.

The Zooms

Man, I've never really had a conversation with anyone about the slow zooms Lucas uses in this movie, but I've always wondered 'what was he was thinking with those?' It's as bad as pan-and-scan and it makes the movie look cheap. WHAT WAS HE THINKING? Don't understand it, and never will.

I agree that cinematographically TPM is fantastic looking. I think one of the reasons the general audience opinion of the rest of the PT decline so sharply and suddenly had a lot to do with the new digital cameras Lucas was working with. I really wish that he'd waited, much like he did with CGI, for the format to really iron itself out first... then again, if he hadn't begun using those cameras not sure anyone else would have, so a bit of a catch-22 there.

Either way, the much less rich and robust look of AOTC, and to a lesser extent ROTS, are for me balanced somewhat by a lot of Lucas' shot choices and framing, which is still a breath of fresh air in the world of more manic, modern directors.

One of the scenes that really suffers to me in Clones is the final confrontation with Dooku. I hadn't realized until I watched the DVD extras that whole thing was shot on an actual set. I wasn't shocked, but I was surprised because the scene just looks so cheap and flat. When Anakin gets force-lighteninged into the rock wall I can barely tell what's going on. There's no sense of weight or texture to anything that's happening. I do like the lightsabers in the dark though. Dammit, George, so many great ideas and some other, not-so-great ideas.

 

I certainly agree the new tint takes away some of the richness of the colors. It's quite noticable in daytime scenes in Padmé's appartment which had a really strong blue before and has now become some boring greyish blue. Tatooine suffers least, imo.
I also prefer the old color tone.

Darth Bradius / Han Burgundy
Could one of you perhaps elaborate a bit on the zoom thing, if possible with examples?

To be honest as a layman, I've never really noticed a big difference compared to the other films. The only scenes where slow zooms kind of crossed my mind where the Obi/Jango confrontation and the last scene with Yoda and I actually found it .... useful. I one case the "cut - zoom (dialogue character 1) - cut - zoom (dialogue character two) etc." succession nicely accentuated the back and forth between the characters, their verbal exchange without getting "too realistic". With Yoda, I get the feeling the rapidly building up music would have felt out of place otherwise.

What's your take here? Maybe you're talking about something entirely else?
I'm just interested!

 

I'd have to go through the whole film to be comprehensive, but there are quite a few, mostly in AOTC but also a couple in ROTS. The scenes you mentioned have them, in addition to some other dialogue scenes on Coruscant (I believe the first scene in Palpatine's office) and some of the conversation shots on Geonosis. They pop up every now and then.

The fault I have with them isn't so much that the director wanted to close in on the subject, it's the technique itself. Traditionally (and I realize the inherent futility with applying "tradition" to an artist like George Lucas) the director will use a dolly or some other tool to physically push the camera closer to the subject. Generally speaking, the result is a much richer type of camera movement than simply using a lense zoom. This type of camera movement is actually one of the few aspects of JJ Abrams cinematography that I truly admire, which makes me cautiously interested to see what Episode 7 actually looks like.
But that's another topic entirely.

Samnz , your post earlier in the thread inspired me, so I wanted to post my favorite shot from each film. Just to restrict myself, I only chose shots that relied primarily on the work of the cinematographer (AKA shots that were more than 50% achieved in-camera.)



For me, this is the quintessential "Jedi" image. Pure serenity and focus, swirled into a beautifully rich, storybook-like image. Good work, Tattersall.



Romeo and Juliet. Love the use of the blue lake against the red flowers. Despite being my least favorite cinematography in the saga, I think AOTC has an excellent variety of color to it, more so than the others.



Not much needs to be said about this. Just great.



I just love this. Two walking myths, engaged in a battle of massive cosmic importance, meanwhile insignificant Stormtroopers can only look on in awe. Genius.



I've been really transfixed by this shot lately. It's really kind of a profound statement on the part of the director/cinematographer. You see, the shot contains Lando and Chewie rushing to pilot the falcon to safety in the foreground, which is important in its own right, but the camera decides to linger on what the audience should really be caring about: a moment of genuine human affection, where the sister has rescued her brother in his darkest hour. When I see this shot, I hear a very direct message from the filmmakers: "These stories are about people, not things, not events. People."



It's not captured in this one still frame, but the movement and composition in this shot is great. Luke starts center frame, a blurred flurry of swings and slashes in the foreground, but the camera is focused on Vader, tracking him and pivoting with him as he transitions from defensive to helpless in the blink of an eye. Very powerful imagery.

I'd love to see what other people come up with, if they feel like sharing!

 

I like ANH, RotJ and TPM best, those are closest to my taste.

 

I can't decide about which one is my favorite. It's also just a hard question to answer. Much of what makes cinematography is the proper use of lighting and with the PT a lot of the "lighting" of the stuff in the background is digitally produced, so does that count as part of the cinematography or not? The capital ships in the beginning space battle of ROTS and the clones in the ground battle in ATOC are both "lit" with a very strong "golden hour" effect, but of course they're not really lit at all. Framing and camera movement are also important parts of cinematography, and I really like the shots of the Wookiees jumping onto the amphibious vehicles and the wide shot above Utupau, but these were entirely digitally created, or nearly so.

I think the strongest images are probably in TESB and ROTS. TESB: the back-lighting on Dagobah (really makes puppet Yoda look more realistic); Yoda sitting there playing with the stick when Luke goes into the cave; the framing in the carbonite chamber; I really like how the soft colored lighting hits Leia there; the smoke and the back-lighting of the carbonite chamber for Luke vs. Vader might be considered excessive for today but I still like it. ROTS: The dead Padme as "Ophelia," Vader's first breath is classic, all the stuff on Mustafar, Anakin consulting with Yoda in his meditation chamber, Anakin's and Padme's "ruminations" as they look out at each other's buildings, rhat high-angle shot of Utapau, plus the great city-scapes.

I think I actually prefer the crisper quality of the digital film in ROTS to the grainy quality of 35-mm film, but I agree that the digital photography was not ready for prime time in ATOC. The digital photography makes some things that were shot on set look as if it were bad CGI -- Dooku's hanger and the balcony in the Geonosian arena. They both look kind of flat. Then, there are some shots where the overhead lighting in the factory, especially on the rising gas when they enter the factory, and in the arena appears sort of overexposed, though I'm not sure that's the right word because it's not really blown out. Still, it doesn't look "right." I do love the shots of Anakin travelling on Tatooine and the overall look of the interiors on Kamino.

 

Thanks for your response! I would certainly agree a dolly shot creates a better 3D effect and illusion of movement because the camera actually moves. However, I do think there are cases in which a zoom triumphs over a dolly shot, with Jango/Obi-Wan shoot-out being one of them. A zoom is just provides a more artificial, more surreal experience and makes you feel uneasy a bit. I felt that was very appropriate for their appartment confrontation whereas a direct movement wouldn't really fit because the character are standing still and yet they are somehow confrontational.

Cool selection on your part, btw!
Your ANH shot is also one of my absolute favorites! This is another great one from ANH:

I love the dust and the red light that doesn't feel very natural, actually. Makes Leia seem quite mysterious, doesn't it?

And that shot of Padmé...it always gives me some sadness when the camera subsequently reaches the japor snippet that Anakin gave her so many years ago


Also definitely agree with darth ladnar that Yoda's chamber is a highlight from ROTS! Love the light stripes and the general narrowness, there-is-no-espace vibe of the scene.


Exuse me for delving into ROTS again, I'm just a fan

Very cool how Anakin sticks out here. He's like a shadow of himself, despite being with his wife in their bedroom (which should be a good thing lol ). The imagery of that scene really sold the idea of Anakin being "lost" for me, visually.

Have you ever noticed how shadow falls over half of Anakin's face whenever he turns to Palpatine in the Opera Scene and the general blue/red mixture of the scene?


I also think Dagobah absolutely shows TESB's quality, especially compared to the somehow bland ROTJ Dagobah scenes.

Orange/blue contrasts are one of my favourites color works. Makes up a warm feeling in an actually very lonely and rather dark place.


Speaks for itself.

Does anyone else like low angle lightsaber symmetry/asymmetry?

That's digital cinematography, isn't it?
One of my highlights in that regard is Yoda's gunship in AOTC when it leaves the arena, heading towards a whole new dimension of a battle field:

ditto

 

You're NOT excused, you rat *******. That was one of the shots I was going to use.

(But seriously, another good post, Samnz. Every time I see your name, I know it'll be worth reading.)

I had, and hopefully still have, a fuller response coming for this thread. It's just taking a while.

Hard to get the right... angle.

But man, what a great shot, there. Absolutely love that entire scene. Much I could say about it.

The shot is wonderfully composed, and so disturbing, I think, to see the bedroom from AOTC framed in that way, with a sublimated sense of darkness and foreboding.

The creepy thing about Anakin's stance is the way he's looking down -- bearing down -- on Padme's behind. Classic male gaze. Though, in his case, with him being all super-powered Jedi and all, he's more like a sort of evil Superman, menacingly X-raying his wife's innards, and their baby, without her consent or awareness. Almost like he's saying, "I can do anything I want with this wench, can't I?" The fact that Anakin seems to think he's being cuckolded in this scene adds to his calm, icy pose. For a brief moment, he appears to be toying with the idea of being a tyrannical overlord, before a great close-up of him looking vulnerable ("I feel lost") effaces his smoldering malignancy. Of course, this is what he becomes, so it's a chilling preview of what lies just ahead. But while Padme is around, he can still admit to weakness, and remain whole. He's cracking, though...

There's something so ill-shaped, so crooked, so misbegotten about Anakin in this scene, and John Williams' unsettling music for this chapter really brings a subtle sense of evil to it. Choosing to light the scene in regular, matter-of-fact daylight further unsettles, by counterposing Anakin's grim malevolence -- the remoteness of it ("Something's happening...") -- with a familiar, even banal, tonal feature (it's daytime; so what?). It's all the more striking because, throughout the movie, Coruscant is opportune to keep dramatically changing weather and lighting conditions. There are certainly "blander" patterns, like when Anakin and Obi-Wan return to the surface with Palpatine after their rescue mission, and when Anakin seeks Palpatine's counsel in his office, but those are almost "upbeat", if you will, while this scene is marked by a moody, almost nihilistic, existential angst. And with Padme wandering about rather obliviously, the two characters may occupy the same apartment, but they seem worlds apart, further making Anakin's solemn attitude stand out in comparison.

It's one of those shots that has a very disturbed quality about it, beyond psychology, beyond tone. Look at the geometry. Padme is shrunken in frame, compared to Anakin, whose head and torso extend the full vertical width of the frame, while Padme is contained, boxed-in, miniaturized. She is roughly at the same height as the light fitting to Anakin's left, which the barred window frame helps draw a viewer's mind to, by guiding the eye. Shadows are well-used in the shot, allowing the bed to appear slightly luminous, compared to the floor area Padme stands on. There is an interrupted sunset pattern cast on the wall flush to the bed. The darkness that cuts into it seems to be emanating from Anakin. I love the curvaceous, two-tone carpet pattern. Despite the relative brightness of the light spilling in through the window, the colours of the frame appear somewhat muted and sullen, matching the interior state of the main protagonist, even suggesting that he is in some way draining his environment of colour through his Force-rooted morbid solipsism. If you wanted a metaphysical explanation for Anakin's descent, this scene provides some meat.

Another aspect that comes out in shots like this is that powerful sense of apposition and transition -- twinned modes of meaning -- in just about every scene in the Star Wars saga; and one that seems profoundly heightened in the lyrical, super-dense prequel trilogy. The cut to the bedroom, all of a sudden, kinda uses the bedroom like a portal to open out the rest of the film (there are tons of these in each movie). It's a bit like a chapter-marker in a book, only more complicated. Not sure I can fully articulate it myself, but basically, it's something like a shorthand to describe an illusory passage in, if not physical, then certainly tonal, emotional, thematic, and structural time. The film is transitioning, moving forward, in a way that is marked by sharp intervals, musical beats, fresh passages. In this sense, the prequel trilogy is less like a conventional film, and more .... absurd, almost. These films are more like installation art. You get these narrow corridors of meaning, then the next is announced and brought forward at the same instant. Of course, we HAVE seen the bedroom before, in both AOTC and even earlier in ROTS, only, AOTC is a different movie with younger incarnations of the characters and their relationships, while in ROTS the bedroom first returns only to be shown at night. This sort of completes a circle, if you like, and we're back to a day-time setting, with Anakin and Padme clothed and upright, and Padme even bent over, recalling her packing clothes in the bedroom scene in AOTC. We can note where they overlap or conform, and where they differ and rebel. In this way, shots like these, especially when their "portal" functions are considered, are fiendishly fascinating.

A final set of observations I wish to make concerns the dialogue. A bit of a cheat (non-visual), but it works, because it is precisely the line that merges with this shot. "He says you've been under a lot of stress". Just my personal thoughts, of course, but it's kinda (knowingly) ridiculous. First off, it's Lucas incorporating a bit of contemporary psych-speak into his broad, Golden Age space opera. In terms of basic vernacular, it doesn't fit. Second, machines, or machine components, suffer stress, and are even stress-tested in the development phase. The line, in this sense, not only anticipates Anakin's transformation into Vader, but even suggests his being treated like a machine is precisely what turns him into one.

While Padme is, in theory, attempting to render comfort to Anakin, it's comfort of a rather putative, even dismissive, kind. Anakin's own wife doesn't really understand him. The fact that she has her back turned when she says this is also revealing: her body language indicates that she isn't seeking to really engage Anakin, but merely placate him, and put him in a box. Anakin's suffering is parodied and objectified through this one line. What is stress? Where does it come from? What damage is it capable of doing? And is Anakin really stressed, never mind "under a lot of stress", or might his anxieties have other causes? Perhaps the guy just wants to talk, but Padme really denies him the opportunity to substantively voice his frustrations, uses confounding platitudes, expresses confusion, and shuts him down (after earlier accusing Anakin of shutting her out) at every turn. Later, when attempting to reason with Anakin with increasing desperation, she barks, "I love you". Barks it, mind.

Lucas is even witty enough to bring the "stress" line back up in the mouth of Threepio later on, completing the fine sense of irony conveyed by such a cruel, throwaway remark of Padme's ("Well, he is under a lot of stress, Artoo"). One can conclude that the idea, in-narrative, was passed around like a hot potato, first being verbalized by Obi-Wan (if Padme's declaration can be believed), then Padme herself, and finally, Padme's minder, Threepio. Even if the message or idea remains intact, how much faith should we have in the message or the idea; how much is the message or idea worth? I believe the dehumanizing effects of language and arrested communication are exposed and explored quite vividly in the prequel trilogy, so there's my bias. The line is just so laughably inept at explaining what's happening to Anakin. I mean, look at it this way. Lucas lavished three entire movies on Anakin's decline. His perspective, the one he grants the viewer, is the "God" perspective. How much shallower does Padme's line ring out against a tapestry of explosive happenings and subtle perturbations in the mind of the trilogy's main character -- as painted on this epic canvas?

It's in scenes, shots, and moments like this, in my opinion, that Lucas' art really takes flight. Because for all the colour, vigour, and awe-inspiring spectacle and melodrama, it's the little stitches that count. He creates moments of sublime dissonance and wordless off-kilter-ness that resonate through and down the work, and between works, painting a vivid portrait of human dislocation set against innumerable backdrops and within innumerable spaces (Star Wars is also very much a second "space odyssey" -- pun intended). You really need new language to describe the subtleties at work (that's one of the basic meanings of the series: spoken language is terribly inadequate and "mired" by "baseless accusations"), and the subtle effects that emerge from these endless moments of frisson and disaffected, koanistic ambiguation. If you are prepared to examine his art more closely, then Lucas' films disclose any number of paradoxes. Optical illusions and Buddhist mantras are married together in Star Wars, seasoned with the fine personal wit of Lucas himself. I mean, under a lot of stress -- really? Why do so few people not see that there is an eccentric comedic mind at work in these films and that even the briefest of scenes pulsate with sublime irony? Is this not poetry? Is this not art?

The end of my post here turned into a bit of a rant. I just drafted it, right now, on the fly. So my apologies for that. Like I say, I have a different post in the works. This one just came out of me this second after seeing that frame (though I'd been meaning to pontificate on the scene anew for a while). Thank you.

 

This shot always reminded me of the opening shot from Of Mice and Men (the underrated Gary Sinise/Johm Malcovich film from the 90's). The film opens with George sitting in the back of a dark train car, and as the train moves, small gasps of light hit his face, barely piercing the darkness.

The symbolism here is quite similar. The darkness is closing in on Anakin. The "light" in his life is seeing its last gasps.

I have to say, even though it comes off in my OP as though I was kind of beating up on ROTS's cinematography, I have to say there is a boldness to George Lucas's shot selection in that film, almost as though he wanted to ensure that his last Star Wars film would also be his photographically bombastic. I think of all the shots where people or things are pushed tight into the "face" of the audience (Mace Windu's holding his lightsaber at Palpatine, General Grevious pushing his face forward as he taunts Obi Wan), or the deep focus shot of Anakin close up on Mustafar as Obi Wan pleads behind him. And then there's the "Scorcesse shot", as I like to call it, which is the procedural dolly shot that follows Padme through the hall of her apartment as Anakin gets up from the couch and follows her (it's the shot that precedes the one that Cryogenic just eloquently analyzed. It's a shot that's especially unusual compared to the still, wide establishing shots used elsewhere in the series, and it definitely sets up the uneasy vibe found in that scene.

 

I already not too long ago dished my thoughts on the cinematography for the OT, at least concerning some of the highlights, and @Samnz already made the bulk of the case in defense of Attack of the Clones, leaving me with a lot less to cover. Still, I’m here to champion the (digi-)film, proudly, wholeheartedly, guns blazing. First, though, a technical point regarding the adjusted color timing for the Blu-ray release. I have no problem with it. I suspect that the reasoning behind the change perhaps had something to do with the original digital imaging native to the cameras used exclusively for that installment exposed their still-evolving limitations when later transferred onto the higher HD Blu-ray format; the original color vibrancy exposing too much digital noise during some of the darker scenes (i.e. Padme sleeping in her bed) or, during brighter scenes on Kamino and in the Geonosis arena, a degree of pixelation (including that of added CGI elements) that was ultimately deemed unbecoming.

The aforesaid green tint probably helped in diffusing such artifacts, but to argue that it robs these individual scenes whatever the moods and dynamism intended via their palettes seems, to me at least, entirely relative. In other words, I only notice the difference when comparing the shots to their DVD counterparts, and even then, to be perfectly honest, all the fuss made about it amounts to little more than a tempest in a teapot. Having long since ditched the DVD and watching the Blu-ray on its own, I still get the full tonal and atmospheric potency of the otherworldly pearled chamber where Obi-Wan first meets with Lama Su, the uber-antiseptic cleanliness of Jango’s private quarters or, in contrast, the sunny florals and creamy morning skies of Padme’s lakeside retreat and the striking copper pot landscapes of Geonosis.

Very well, Han Burgundy...



This particular visual conceit just so happens to be one that I precisely enjoy. I think it’s fairly permeate throughout the prequel trilogy as a whole (and even shows up at least once in A New Hope), though I do agree Lucas was most liberal with it in Episode II. Claims of corniness are anyone’s call. But that it’s lazy and cheap, or has no place in professional cinema? Disagree completely.

The basic film theory behind it is this: physically moving the camera closer towards the subject evokes a more natural feeling that the audiences is likewise stepping or leaning in more intimately to the scene -- the moment -- whereas the slow zoom alternately plays on a more abstract level by drawing or pushing the in-camera world closer towards the audience. As a result, one is real movement while the other is surreal movement. One is bringing the image closer while the other is, in essence, making it bigger—a distinction without a technical difference, granted, but a distinction nonetheless in that which is being conveyed.

I think the various artifacts inherent in the early HD cameras used for Attack of the Clones and Lucas’ choice for these slow zooms went hand-in-hand. Yes, the movie indeed bears a certain videographic quality, even separate from Episode III, which was recognized as a cinematic equivalent of televised video productions ranging from the 1960s on throughout the 1980s. Instead of hiding this, or hiding from it, Lucas seemed to embrace it lovingly with open arms, in part, by opting for the kind of slow zoom articulation so prevalent throughout vintage daytime TV and BBC programming of the same era, including Masterpiece Theater, Doctor Who and Dark Shadows. Yes, the "soap opera" effect. And why not? I can’t think of a more perfect fit. These kind of shows were shamelessly melodramatic and Episode II, on its own storied terms, is undoubtedly the soapiest and most purple prose installment of the of the Star Wars saga.

In the general sense of the film (and the trilogy) the slow zooms are an aspect of that heightened reality in the movement of establishing shots and, particularly, with dramatic close-ups. Furthermore with this Star Wars prequel world there’s a kind of emphasis on the surreal elements of Anakin’s tragic arc. One of the more notable examples of this camera technique is during the scene where he confesses to Padme the slaughtering of the Sand People; specifically, her reaction shot. A dolly push-in would have been too direct, too immediate and too visceral whereas the slow zoom lensing (coupled with Portman’s oddly muted expression) better accentuates not only this bizarre new reality Padme is facing but, in turn, her own near-hypnotic detachment from it.

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I don’t mean this an argument against your personal taste. Whatever gut feelings you have about the discussed aspects are as genuine as anything else (no amount of film-school analysis can change that) and, by conventional standards, I get where you’re coming from. But I will contend there likewise being not only a genuine filmmaking purpose to these slow zooms, but some degree of inspiration behind them as well, even if only intuitively employed by Lucas. This is also why I’m casting my vote for Attack of the Clones. Frankly, I don’t think it’s cinematography is any better, per se, than the other five installments, but I’m giving it the shout-out for an upped level of eccentricity Lucas brought to the saga at this point, born from exploring new technologies with an open mind and treating the results not like black sheep defects, but curiosities to be seized using quaint aesthetics of an unexpected, bygone era; once again, Lucas expressing new technologies through pop-art, or vice versa. Plainly speaking, I just like the way it looks and feels.​

 

Gotta go for Clones as well. I think here the universe comes alive as a character itself more so than in any of the other films as we move through maze-like cityscape, beautiful open spaces worthy of a fairy tale, chaotic fields of war, etc. But it also captures the intimate and the individual so well--for me Anakin bidding goodbye to Padme before departing for the Tusken camp is probably the most beautiful stretch of cinema to come out of the series. Thematically Clones strikes me as the most personal entry while still being this big grand opera, and the visual framing and movement pretty much reflects this.

 

something that i just remembered... there's a part in rots where padme is talking to anakin at night on coruscant about having the baby. i noticed the first time i watched it that she looked HIDEOUS and skull-like. it's pretty hard to make natalie portman look bad. i have no doubt this was on purpose. a foreshadowing of padme's demise by having her appear as a deaths-head. can anyone get some captures of that scene? it's from this scene...

 

I don't know... she still looks pretty good to me:​

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I think maybe the idea was to present her as being less forbiddingly seductive from the previous film and more wholesome, given the fact that she's now prego. However, in the following scene she is particularly quite stunning:​

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