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RE: Legalization and Decriminalization of Marijuana(A major solution to social and economic problems

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Darth_Destructo, Oct 30, 2001.

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  1. Darth_Destructo

    Darth_Destructo Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 2, 2001
    No! I will not challenge you.
    I will support you.
    LOL, this is so like you Pizza.

    Let's wait for someone to argue. :D
    5,
    4,
    3,
    2,
     
  2. Pedro

    Pedro Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 30, 1999

    I don't see how anyone could reasonably argue that the current "War on Drugs" was/is/ever will be successful.

    (Incidentally, is the irony of "anti-drug" ads paid for by the corporate pushers of legal drugs supposed to be lost on us?)
     
  3. Ender

    Ender Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 1998
    Won't get an argument from me. I agree.

    Waste of time and money. People are going to get it no matter what.
     
  4. Poodu

    Poodu Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 3, 1999
    There has always been speculation that pot is the "Gateway Drug" and can lead to more powerful and harmful drugs. This theory is invalid, and can never be proven. Theoretically, marijuana is NOT addictive, neither chemically nor psychologically

    I see the legalisation of cannabis as the gateway to harder drugs rather than keeping it criminal. As soon as cannabis is legalised, the governments will tax it to the hilt and people will move on to something else... in this case, it will be something worse... heroin, cocaine etc etc
     
  5. Ender

    Ender Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 1998
    Of course booze would never be a gateway drug, right?


    It's perfect as a gateway drug as it removes inhibitions.
     
  6. Poodu

    Poodu Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 3, 1999
    I suppose it comes down to the individual... whenever I've been blind drunk I still never consider taking any other form of narcotic. Others might and almost certainly do... in the end it all comes down to choice. The one thing I hate is the abuse side of the drug world.
     
  7. Ender

    Ender Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 1998
    My father was an alcoholic. I've seen the abuse side of booze.
     
  8. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    The government could tax it to the hilt, and it would still be cheaper than having to smuggle it. If grown legally, it could cost about the same as cigarettes, and even if the taxes were quadruple what they are for smokes, a joint would cost about a dollar(20 bucks a pack).

    If we can't stop it, why not tax it? It could also be made safer, if regulated by the FDA, as all the impurities would be taken out.

    I don't even smoke it, but it seems to me that it is much less dangerous than booze.Who smokes a joint and then beats their kids? Nobody, because they are laying on the couch eating doritos.
     
  9. BaneofyourExistence

    BaneofyourExistence Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2001
    Even with taxes and the supposed benefits, I could never agree with legalization. It is promoting a substance that does damage the body, that creates psychological addictions despite many pro-legalize it sources like NORML.

    This thread will be fun... [face_devil]
     
  10. Kessel Runner

    Kessel Runner Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 1999
    I have to say this. I am very much against the use of illicit drugs...period.

    However,

    I have seen very tangible and real benefits to medicinal marijuana and have become a strong proponent of its use in this way. I think that the best, but least likely, solution would be to convert the tobacco fields of the southeast into cannabis fields which could grow and produce medicinal marijuana, as well as use the hemp for clothing products.
     
  11. Master_JoshuaWindu

    Master_JoshuaWindu Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 21, 2001
    just think of the economic ramifications, the economy would sky rocket
     
  12. Shi-Bandarr

    Shi-Bandarr Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 1, 2000
    Here's my take on it.

    I read about a lawyer from Saginaw, Michigan, who was putting together a petition to have a measure put on the ballot for this Nov. This was to have the state constitution ammended so that growing would not be considered criminal. It allowed for 3 ounces, 3 plants, and 3 seedlings on your property at a given time. The plants could not be outside in view of any children. Once they are put outside then they are illegal. This is to try and prevent minors being exposed to them.

    Now the reason that this may be the first measure that will be fruitful is simple. This will not fall under the US constitution as being illegal. The federal government can only step in if it falls under commerce laws. As long as this is not sold then it can't be governed by Federal statutes. As long as this will not conflict with the Federal constitution, then it will stand. This is why the Feds stepped in in Cal. with the medicinal marijuana. They were selling it. Don't sell it and it's not criminal. The states just need to provide for it.

    I haven't heard anything as of late as to if he got the signatures he needed or not. From everything I read, it seemed like he had what he needed to get it passed if it was voted in.

    My personal views are that I would like to see something like this enacted. I am not one to condone abuse of any substance, but keeping marijuana legal while we allow drinking and smoking is completely hypocritical. Something needs to be done.
     
  13. Kessel Runner

    Kessel Runner Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 1999
    Sadly that Michigan situation will never occur. The DEA has raided every club and/or doctor's office in California which dispensed or wrote prescriptions for marijuana based on Prop 217 from several years ago. After the SUpreme ruled it illegal, they acted almost immediately, raiding these places at midnight and seizing everything, including medical records.
     
  14. Shi-Bandarr

    Shi-Bandarr Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 1, 2000
    As far as the clubs being raided, they were selling it. I would, however, like to see the feds rational for raiding the doctors offices.
     
  15. anakin_girl

    anakin_girl Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 8, 2000
    1) I have never heard of anyone getting violent while high on marijuana. I have never heard of homes being destroyed by marijuana. Pot smokers are usually harmless neo-hippie-types with red eyes and the munchies. It's the crack addicts who are extremely paranoid and carry Uzzis. Hell, drunks are more violent than pot smokers, alcohol has destroyed a lot more families, and it is still legal.

    2) Marijuana is not physically addicting. Alcohol is, so is tobacco, and they are still legal.

    3) Marijuana has medical uses. Alcohol and tobacco don't.

    4) By legalizing marijuana, the government could make money by taxing it, and people who enjoy this rather harmless drug could get it safely, without worrying about whether or not it was laced with LSD by some psychotic pusher.

    5) Marijuana is no more of a "gateway drug" than booze. I have never heard of anyone hooked on drugs who was not also addicted to alcohol.

    My point is, if we're going to keep alcohol legal (and I know we tried Prohibition and it didn't work), then marijuana, which is less harmful than alcohol and can have some benefits, should also be legal.
     
  16. Kessel Runner

    Kessel Runner Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 1999
    But, see the thing is, those clubs were selling based upon the laws of the State of California. And they only sold to patients with doctor's prescriptions. These clubs sold a significantly cheaper rate than "street" value. Those patients who still have a need will continue to purchase it, only now it will be from the street, less safe, more expensive, and they will have an increased likelihood of being arrested for buying.

    and as far as gateway drugs, the reality is that smoking is the true gateway to everything else. Have you ever met someone who smoked marijuana or used any other drug who didn't smoke cigarettes first?
     
  17. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Lord Bane, everything you said about Marijuana is true. Of course, the same can be true of Twinkees, fast food, and cold cuts. Should we make anything that is not healthy for us illegal?
     
  18. Lord Bane

    Lord Bane Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 26, 1999
    Ah, I thought this'd come up.

    No, we shouldn't make what exists as legal, illegal. We should try and keep additional harmful products out of the buyer's market. "Buyer Beware" and all that aside, people are dumb as bricks and don't need to be given a new substance to wreck themselves with.
     
  19. Jailcell_Runner

    Jailcell_Runner Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2001
    The key is when it also impacts others. As does cigarettes, and other illegal drugs (through crime, impaired cognition, etc.).
     
  20. Sate_Pestage

    Sate_Pestage Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 31, 2001
    People, it will never, nor should ever be legalized.

    I doubt most of you would want it legalized after you saw the outcome! It would be regulated and controlled by the Govt. The price would go way up because of the taxation placed on it. The restrictions placed on it by law enforcement would be mind-boggleing and I bet it would lose a lot of its luster once it was legalized.

    My view may be somewhat unorthodox but its how I feel. When i was an avid drug user (and wholeseller) I still felt this way.
     
  21. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    It would be way cheaper if it was legal, because the cost of smuggling is what makes it expensive.And smoking it in public, where it affects others, is a seperate issue. It's not ok to smoke cigarettes in public places, but I can smoke at my house. Why not the same thing with weed? And crime? Violence is not a concern, and if it was cheap and legal, who has to steal for it? How many cigarette related crimes are there?

    As far as those who want to jail people for smoking weed- that's terrible. Why would you rather pay $33,000. a year to jail someone who likes to smoke grass on their couch and eat cheetos? What's the harm? They may become listless? So what!They may lack motivation and short term memory? Who gives a crap! It's their body and their mind, and they should be able to do whatever they want with it.
     
  22. Sate_Pestage

    Sate_Pestage Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 31, 2001
    It would not be cheapper!! Think about all the taxes that are put on Cigs....especially in the last few years! I remeber when I used to pay $3.00 for a pack of Newports....now Im paying $4.50-.75. Thats true about others getting high around you.
     
  23. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    20 joints - about 80 dollars
    20 cigs(with tax)- about 5 dollars

    Lord Bane- So, no new snacks or burger shacks should be allowed in America?

    We are not talking about introducing a new unhealthy thing into America. We are talking about taking something that is here anyway, taxing it, and making it safer.The monies saved from jailing people and the taxes raised on selling the stuff could probably end homelessness.
     
  24. That_Flashing

    That_Flashing Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 2000
    "I don't even smoke it, but it seems to me that it is much less dangerous than booze.Who smokes a joint and then beats their kids? Nobody, because they are laying on the couch eating doritos."

    'Nuff said. That alone should be enough for them to legalize it. How many cases are there of a dude beating his wife and it was learned afterwards that he was stoned? About zero. It's cause like they said before, he was just chillin on the couch with some pizza. And I am speaking from experience of course, whenever I get high, I am completely calm about everything. Violence would be the LAST thing on my mind.
     
  25. Pedro

    Pedro Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 30, 1999

    We should try and keep additional harmful products out of the buyer's market. "Buyer Beware" and all that aside, people are dumb as bricks and don't need to be given a new substance to wreck themselves with.

    C'mon now Bane, paternalism just isn't cool. Especially when backed up by the law. Surely you can see what a slippery slope this is...
     
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