PT Red Letter Media and other Prequel Reviews

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Obi-Wan McCartney, Feb 12, 2012.

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  1. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    I've also wondered about whether the demand would justify the cost and whether those demanding the restored OOT so loudly would be satisfied.

    And if Lucas has done "nothing" to make these people happy, why do they post on Star Wars sites? I don't like the Twilight series, therefore I don't visit Twilight message boards, and I certainly wouldn't do so in order to complain that Stephanie Meyer had done nothing to make me happy. Making me happy isn't really her job.

    I'm also curious as to why anyone who dislikes TPM is spending $12 to see it again.
  2. _Catherine_ Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    Yes and yes. As for restoring the OT not being worth Lucas's time, film preservationist Robert A. Harris publicly stated an open offer to Lucas to restore all of the original Star Wars movies himself, but Lucas never took him up on it. The 05/19/06 post on this page does a good job of explaining why restoring the OT wouldn't be as big a deal as Lucas makes it out to be.
  3. JimRaynor55 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2005
    star 3
    I agree that RLM is a tired topic, and that people shouldn't care about what this guy thinks. That said, this thread seems to have some decent discussion going on, and people are backing up their statements with reasoning and evidence. Don't go around putting people down for lock-worthy "racial, sectarian & political" arguments that haven't actually come up. I also wish that the SW fandom as a whole would leave RLM behind. But if the topic is brought up, it's not "getting [my] panties in a bunch" to criticize the RLM review on logical grounds.
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  4. JimRaynor55 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2005
    star 3
    I've seen quite a few RLM fanboys whose behavior is practically cultish. I mean, it's not even like a rebuttal of the RLM review is even hard. You don't need to be any kind of subject matter expert, on Star Wars or any real life topic, to see through his nonsense. But according to the RLM fanboys (many of whom haven't even watched the review for real), the guy can do no wrong.

    Recently, I had the displeasure of debating some RLM fanboys who told me that Padme was an idiot for not taking up the Trade Federation senator's offer to send a "committee" to investigate whether Naboo had been invaded. Apparently, the guy couldn't understand the idea that maybe the Trade Fed senator was a bad guy (as proven by his flat out denial of the invasion) who was manipulating the useless political system in order to stall and buy time. According to him, there would've been no need for the Battle of Naboo if the Trade Fed's hand picked committee had simply been allowed to do its job...

    I so wanted to ask him how the UN, or those Arab League "observers" in Syria were doing. But before that, they decided to fling some baseless homophobic insults at me. That's when I decided that the thread was no longer worth my time.
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  5. Anakin_Darth Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2005
    star 2



    These people hold RLM up to be this deity-like figure, like he unlocked some sort of hidden passage to enlightenment about these movies, it's hilariously foolish and ridiculous. I remember watching it the first time, and that scene where the "Real People" (read: his friends) talked about the OT characters so deeply, and didn't have anything to say about the PT characters. I couldn't help but laugh at the idiocy and flat out propaganda that was seething out of the scene. When I had a small Youtube channel, I had the pleasure of debunking ANY and ALL points they made, saying that his review was infallible, and when I destroyed all the so-called points, I was insulted, as expected.

    And that plinkett voice that he does : OH.MY.GOD is that annoying as hell!
  6. StampidHD280pro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2005
    star 4
    I have to admit I enjoyed the fist two RLM videos because at least someone was talking about the prequels. It wasn't entirely clear how serious he was, and the tone seemed to be more one of humor and catharsis. But the one for Revenge of the Sith was just pure bile, taking the piss out of Lucas where there was none, talking less and less about the movies themselves, but how bad they could have been, and how stupid their fans were.

    The funniest part is, he clearly spent a whole lot of time with these movies, and missed a lot of strong points about the prequels overall in his attempt to prove his hypothesis that Lucas doesn't know what he's doing. Oh well, one day nobody will remember that annoying voice, and perhaps his fellow will learn to come to peace with his obsessions and maybe even be embarrassed of the videos.
  7. DantheJedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 23, 2009
    star 5
    I hate how people refer to them whenever they bash the prequels, like they are THE authority on how "horrible" they are. It's like people who became Family Guy haters because of that two-part South Park episode, like it converted them or reenforced their beliefs.

    Why not get your own opinion, okay?
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  8. Darth_Nub Saga, Classic Trilogy and Film Music Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2009
    star 4
    I was referring to the last big thread about RLM in this forum (http://boards.theforce.net/prequel_trilogy/b10669/30737825/p1), which was locked because the arguments got so carried away. Take a read of the last few pages.
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  9. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    I prefer to use the much-better-established and less childish filmmaker, George Lucas, as an example of how horrible RLM is. :p
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  10. Mond Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2009
    star 3
    So I wonder how much longer Stoklasa can commercially exploit the Star Wars brand before the Lucasfilm legal department puts the litigation smackdown on him?

    My lord that would be funny. Even if he were to somehow prevail in court, the legal expenses and stress would destroy him. :D

    So far nothing from Lucasfilm about this crap, so I suppose they are taking the high ground by ignoring him. Or perhaps they're giving him enough rope to hang himself?

    (I kid, I kid. There's no way in hell George even knows that loser exists.)

    By the way, the TPM 3D official trailer now has more views than the TPM review, neener neener.
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  11. Sword_Of_Goliath Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 22, 2010
    star 3
    I bet Lucas loves 'em, actually. He seems to like being satirized.
  12. MrFantastic74 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2010
    star 4
    I would not consider a "do-over" the same thing as Expanded Universe. No, I would still want to see THE story about younger Obi-Wan and Anakin, the story of Anakin's rise and fall, the story of the Clone Wars, and the story of the dawn of the Empire. It would just be different. See what I'm saying? A re-do of the episodes we got, but with drastic changes.
  13. MrFantastic74 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2010
    star 4
    Let me put it this way. I was horribly disappointed that Lucasfilm decided to release the 3D movies in episodic order rather than start with Episode IV. The Phantom Menace is, IMO, by far the worst of the series. That does not mean I hate it; hate is a very strong word (that leads to the Dark Side). I don't think it's a good movie by any means, but it has it's exciting moments, like the amazing pod race and lightsaber duel sequence. I'm a SW fan who was willing to buy a ticket to support the cause, if you will. You see, I really want to see the OT in 3D, and I want to give my son that experience when he's old enough (he'll be 5 when Episode IV comes out). I am still worried that the series will lose steam before 2015 and the OT will not be released in 3D. :(
  14. JimRaynor55 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2005
    star 3
    TPM 3D made over $43 million worldwide, in its first weekend. Movies typically make one-third of their total box office during their opening weekend. Even if we conservatively assume that TPM 3D has a subpar hold and drops off very quickly, making 40% of its total this weekend, that still projects to over $107 million worldwide. I seriously doubt that Episode I's 3D conversion cost anywhere near that much, since 3D conversions are regarded as a cost-effective way to cash in on old movies. And of course this release is an effective commercial for the Star Wars brand, introducing a new generation to the series. A new generation who will now be asking for SW toys, and be curious to see the next few films in the series.

    I seriously doubt that Lucas will have any reservations about making 3D conversions for the rest of the series.
  15. MandalorianDuchess Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2010
    star 3
    Well, Lucas always has said that the ideal way to watch the saga is 1 - 6. Only TPM and ANH work fairly well as stand-alone movies; that is always important for first-time viewers. Because the overwhelming majority of the first-time viewers are going to be small children who hadn't been born when TPM first opened, it also makes sense to start out with possibly the most child-friendly episode.

    (TPM also has the characters that children who are watching the Clone Wars on TV are already familiar with. There's a good chance Clone Wars will end its run sometime before 2015... but even if it didn't, it's a nice tie-in to keep the kids interested in both live-action and animated versions).

    Besides, one can only assume conversion technology will continue getting better over the next few years... the software and the computers keep getting better. This is going to mean that the best conversions will, very possibly, be the ones done to the OT. Can you imagine the opening of ANH in 3-D? The asteroid chase or the Hoth Battle from ESB? The speeder bikes in ROTJ?

    Like Yoda said... "Patience!" ;)
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  16. HevyDevy Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2011
    star 4
    I recently watched these reviews. While I find some of the criticisms fair (particularly the ones directed at AOTC), he just goes too far. Sure, dislike the movie, but make movie-length reviews which include cooking and peeing on TPM? Kind of sad.
    I mean, alot of the flaws he points out can be directed at any movie. If you dismiss characters intended motivations, and the logic/ supension of disbelief needed to enjoy movies like Star Wars, of course there are going to be a lot of problems. Meh though, doesn't take from my enjoyment of the films, so whatever.
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  17. CuppaJoe Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 4
    I actually thought the lack of a main character argument was silly. I can name plenty of great films that don't have one central main character. The Exorcist and Pulp Fiction immediately come to mind. But I think if TPM did have a central character Qui-Gon would be the one.
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  18. Darth_Nub Saga, Classic Trilogy and Film Music Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2009
    star 4
    But wasn't that the massive disappointment? That the PT was THE story we'd been waiting to see, after nearly a decade of EU that tip-toed around the 30 year period prior to ANH? That the 'real deal' paled somewhat in comparison to the bold visions presented in the Zahn trilogy & Dark Empire?

    Who's to say what the 'real' story of the Clone Wars, the history of Obi-Wan Kenobi, the fall of Anakin Skywalker and the rise of the Galactic Empire truly was?
    One George Lucas, that's who. He even made three movies about it all. Like them or not, they're THE story.

    A reboot would be just someone else's attempt to improve on what we got, & would come under just as much criticism, while not having the stamp of authenticity, no matter how well-made & hardcore the films might be. They might come closer to what many a fan imagined between 1983 & 1999 that the final days of the Old Republic were like, but they could never step beyond John L Flynn's 'Fall Of The Republic' or the vague hints that various EU authors toyed with. Fan fiction with an LFL label.

    Those of us who experienced SW the first time around & heard about the episodes which would fill in the three episode gap created when Star Wars was re-named Episode IV: A New Hope, we all thought that the real story was there, a solidified plotline & history, in the legendary ring-binders, in GL's mind, and maybe it was. Or maybe not. Either way, we were delivered three 100% authentic Star Wars films which preceded the trilogy of films we fell in love with from 1977-1983, as promised. Buy the ticket, take the ride.

    TBH, the current Clone Wars TV series does deliver a lot of what many might have expected to see in the PT, at least in terms of Anakin & Obi-Wan operating as heroic generals in wartime. It's got plenty of dud episodes & an elephant in the room by the name of Ahsoka, but heaps of it's terrific. A battle to the death by two astromech droids? Awesome.
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  19. princethomas Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2001
    star 2
    What needs to happen, is someone needs to make a counter review. A Video one. Jim Raymer's written rebuttal is excellent. But someone with some comedy roast skill needs to lay the smack down on that guy. Sadly, thats not me. But someone.
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  20. Thegoat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2004
    star 1
    I'm not sure about that part. Spider-man seems to be generating a lot of hype, despite rebooting a series that started jut 10 years ago and ended only 5. I think that if a prequel reboot were to happen, it would definitely further divide the fanbase, likely annoy casual audiences ("Didn't we just see this?"), but probably be relatively well-received in the geek/critic community if for no other reason than the films would do everything possible to appease all of the complaints that are lauded at Lucas' version. It would probably be a much less serious and complex trilogy and much more about the blood-pumping fun and adventure of the originals but made trendily "dark" and potentially indistinguishable from other blockbusters of the day in style and tone. If made today, I imagine somebody somebody like Joss Whedon or J.J. Abrams would be attached to the project for their successes with sci-fi pop culture. Remember when Firefly started gaining its popularity? You can still read reviews saying things like "Has everything that the Lucas' prequels lacked!" Same with the Star Trek reboot. For the record, I think Whedon would take the project with a lot of love and do an admirable job. Firefly itself is a show about smugglers in a beat-up but reliable old ship trying to evade detection by and ultimately do battle against an oppressive imperial regime. I don't think it's a stretch to say he was influenced by the Star Wars films.

    Personally, I wouldn't want to see that happen. As you said, it's Lucas' story, and I love the films we have now, but I do think it is feasible and could still be a pretty entertaining experiment. [face_peace]
  21. _Catherine_ Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    The point he was making wasn't that you can't make a good film without a main character, though.

  22. Alexrd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2009
    star 5
    No. The point he was trying to make was that TPM needs to show the hero's journey (because Plinkett is the one who decides what a movie should or shouldn't have, right?) otherwise it has a flaw. Which is not true.
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  23. Sword_Of_Goliath Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 22, 2010
    star 3
    [I know I'm responding to a quote, I couldn't find the original post.]

    Yeah, but most kids have no problem with TPM. It's adults who have the problem.
    And why do certain directors get a free pass but Lucas *must* adhere to a certain formula? He already did that, 1977-1983. This is a different trilogy, with different rules. It takes place in a different era. Also, I'm an adult who loves TPM and didn't go into it wanting a copy of ANH. I didn't find the film perplexing. And millions of people just voted with their hard-earned cash. They obviously don't think TPM violates some sacred structure that must be obeyed. So it's just one critic's opinion. My opinion is that it's a film that rewards repeated viewing because it breaks the "rules" and has complexities that can't be worked out the first time you see it. Some details were purposely left out because Lucas likes to force the audience to relate to the material the way an anthropologist relates to a foreign culture: to work it out by inference etc. He has always done that. Oh, and lots of other films have scatological humor, from Fellini to Woody Allen. Who gets to be the Almighty Arbiter Of Taste & Acceptable Content and decide which directors are "allowed" to put things in their films and which aren't "allowed"?
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  24. CuppaJoe Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 4
    But The Exorcist and Pulp Fiction are great films.
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  25. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    Exactly. Who died and made Plinkett the God of Good Storytelling?

    The idea that a movie must have one main protagonist is ridiculous IMO. And FWIW, I took a graduate level course in storytelling--and that's probably one more graduate-level course in storytelling than Plinkett had.

    He is, of course, entitled to dislike any story without one main protagonist. But his throwing out his personal taste in films as objective fact is arrogant.
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