Regeneration through Violence in Star Wars?

Sorry if this has been posted before.
After reading about the Myth of the American Frontier, I think Star-Wars catches up to many of the same elements. Roosevelt, the racialist he was, talked about regeneration through violence. If a race cannot adapt to the evolving nature/civilization, they must perish. This is mainly what happens to the Jedi. They cannot, and will not change. The Sith who are more adaptable will be the new ruling order. The old Jedi order perish. But there is new hope as ANH so plainly tells us

I don't think, however, that this new hope begins with Luke. I think it all along was Obi-Wan. He was the new Jedi, a result of the teachings of Qui-Gon. Obi-Wan is more adaptable - he is ruthless when he must, and compassionate as no other Jedi before him (this we see in his relationship with Anakin).

The downfall of the Jedi is not best depicted in Yoda I think. Mace is the ultimate looser. Ever so powerful he is, he looses. He has Sideous on his back, but ultimately he looses because of his too rigid discourses. He will not let Anakin join because he wants to do it his way.
Yoda, on the other hand, lives on and teaches Luke, the new Jedi Order. So it is in a sense Yoda, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan who combined creates the new Jedi-Order through Luke.
The mythological element in Star-Wars is most certainly there!!

 

Rossa83 posted on 10/20/05 5:00am

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I don't think, however, that this new hope begins with Luke. I think it all along was Obi-Wan. He was the new Jedi, a result of the teachings of Qui-Gon. Obi-Wan is more adaptable - he is ruthless when he must, and compassionate as no other Jedi before him (this we see in his relationship with Anakin). [hr][/blockquote]

Well to be fair it was really Qui-Gon who wanted change first. He was the one who felt the strict rules of the Jedi Order and felt they should be changed ... or at least loosened a bit.

I do agree with you though. The destruction of the Jedi was the direct result of their un-ability to change and adapt to new environments. The Jedi were still stuck on the war that ended the Sith all those years ago. The based their rules and strategies on that war, never changing them. The main difference between the Jedi and Sith is that the Sith lay hidden for years and years, building up their knowledge, adapting with the times. That's why they caught the Jedi off guard.

 

I agree with you there about Qui-Gon being the first, but really didn't Dooku precede him again? So Dooku ca be sign as a sign of the dangers of change!?

 

Mace may be a good representation of the old Jedi ways that were to rigid; but it may also be said that it was his lack of faith in following the strict order that led to his downfall. If he had followed the code, he would not have been in the position of "attacking the unarmed man" that got him wasted in the first place and may have led to Palpatine's full arrest and would give Anakin more time (and more sleep hopefully!) to consider his options.

 

I see your point. But don't you in a way agree with Mace - Palpatine controlled the senate. He would most likely have been set free... most Jedi were killed anyhow, so not that many could testify against him - nobody knew anyway.
But yeah, he didn't follow the strict code of the Jedi, and that was ultimately his downfall...
Can anybody say if Obi-Wan followed it strictly? I mean, look at those who didn't... Anakin: wound up like a sith, nothing even resembling his former self. Mace, got fried. Dooku turned to the dark side. Qui-Gon was killed, perhaps as many of you claim, because he paid too little attention to the ways of the other Jedi, and to much attention to the living force...
That would actually be interesting, and precisely the opposite of what my argument is. Still, I won't dismiss my thought about the regeneration part...

 

I think that it was the Jedi's fault entirely that the Sith returned to power.
Dooku-Left the Jedi order because of strictness.
Anakin-Left the Jedi order because of strictness and unfairness.
Maul-Now this one is interesting. If I am correct in saying that he was the ancient species of Sith that the Jedi wiped out because they used the Dark Side, then he wanted revenge for what the Jedi did to his ancestors.
Palpatine-No idea. No one even knew he could even use the Force. I don't think anyone even knows what his past was. No explanation.

 

No, he's an Iridonian Zabrak. Just like Eeth Koth and Agen Kolar.

 

I completely agree! The strictness of the Jedi order was its ultimate downfall, its incapability to change. But do you agree with me that Yoda did not, actually, front this strictness? I think it was Mace who was the quintessence of the old Jedi-Order.

Strange though, how both Maul and Sideous was not found by the Jedi first...

 

Here's a thought:
If Dooku left because of the strictness, and that is a sign of the downfall of the Jedi, then why didn't Qui-Gon leave? He was rebellious as well. Obi-Wan was also somewhat rebellious, although he might be seen as more of the perfect mixture?

What I'm asking is, is it the Jedi's fault entirely, or are is it more a turn of the tide or something? Is it Yoda's fault, being the senior Jedi - dating back to the old sith-wars (almost anyway)?