ST Relationships

This is NOT a thread about potential romantic coupling. Instead I created this thread to pose the question that if this current trilogy will suffer from a lack of tight relationships formed between the new characters compared to trilogies of the past.

In the original trilogy we easily got the strongest example of bonding and relationship building. It helped greatly that in ANH all of the Big Three spent the last third or so of the film together with their lives hanging in the balance. In between running away from stormtroopers, escaping a garbage compact, avoiding tie-fighters while escaping on the Falcon and taking out the Deathstar, those three got a chance to meet, argue, work together and come to know one another to an extent. Then you had all three coming together to celebrate at the very end, leading up to the awards ceremony that closed the film. By the time we see them next in ESB they have spent a lot more time together, perhaps at least a couple of years, eventually ending up on Hoth. As a viewer one can imagine what type of adventures they went through in between those two movies. And Hoth was a place in which you couldn't just take a solo hike for a couple of weeks. You had to stay inside the base which meant Luke, Han and Leia (as well as Chewie and the droids) were pretty much always in each other's company and running into one another. So with that setup you totally bought the development towards the end of ESB that Luke would halt his training and try to rescue his friends once he sensed they were in danger. By the time RoTJ rolled around their bond had been completely accepted by viewers.

The prequel trilogy didn't have nearly as strong a setup in the relations of its Big Three. There was a long gap between when Kenobi and Anakin had last seen Padme (between TPM and AoTC) and to be honest Kenobi and Padme hadn't share many scenes together, let alone ones just between them, throughout the entire trilogy. Still Anakin had forged pivotal relationships with both Kenobi and Padme, so that kinda of connected the three of them as a whole.

If we go by the notion that this current trilogy has a Big Three on the hero side (Rey, Finn, Poe) then I have to say it is comes up lacking compared to the ones that came before. Granted Finn had relationships established with Rey and Poe in TFA, but Rey and Poe barely shared a single scene. And unlike in the original trilogy in which we could figure that the heroes had a lot of interacting that went down between ANH and ESB, no such interaction will have gone down between TFA and TLJ because one film picks up immediately after the previous one. And to make matters worse Rey is off by herself with Luke on another planet and Finn remains unconscious.....which means Poe isn't having conversations with either during this time. Further it appears Rey won't interact with Finn or Poe until perhaps the end of TLJ. Meanwhile Finn and Poe apparently will be separated at some time and Finn will end up sharing most of his screen time with Rose. Now of course we can only guess how much they will all interact in Episode IX, but I feel it will be impossible for them to make up enough for lost time in that final film to effectively be seen as having that same type of relationship forging as we got with our first Big Three.

Then again maybe it isn't important. Perhaps this is a way of TPTB giving us something new. Maybe it is in large part the result of JJ making a late decision to not kill off Poe but not having any place for him for the vast majority of TFA storyline.

Last of all there is the issue that Luke, Han and Leia's relationship was somewhat curtailed and put to the side in this current trilogy. There was never meant to be a scene involving all three of them. But there also was never meant to be a moment in which Luke and Han shared the screen for one last time. We may not even get a scene with Luke and Leia. Is this trilogy going to fail at establishing the type of emotional attachments between our main heroes that we SW fans normally expect.?

 

I do not think we are getting a ST Big Three trio and I think that is absolutely fine. It shows that the ST is going to be a new kind of story, despite all the overt OT callbacks we got in Ep. 7.

That does not mean relationships between the various characters in the ST will not be important or play a role. Imo, this trilogy is not going to follow the same beats as the OT or even Ep. 7. I think the characters (heroes and villains) will branch out more and in new ways we have not seen in the OT.

 

IMO, Star Wars is all about relationships, the friendhsip kind, the family kind. the romance kind, the teacher student kind, the eternal enemy kind...

I have posted this before, but this guy explains it better than I ever could.

 

My opinion based on what I saw in TFA is that they've put a different twist on it. The "big three" in this trilogy is Rey, Finn, and Kylo, two protagonists and one antagonist, with the antagonist being the link to the Skywalkers. The initial connection made was actually between Finn and Kylo, on Jakku when Finn wouldn't fire on the villagers. Subsequently Finn and Rey connected, and finally Rey and Kylo. Then in the climactic scene of the film, the three of them are all brought together. Kylo even says to them, "It's just us now." They are the main characters of the new trilogy.

 

I think this is a potential complaint with some validity. I reckon that when Finn and Rey do reunite, it will be skimmed over as if they're old friends rather than people who spent a couple of intense days together. I can handle tha though, it's no biggie.
Wha I do think is that post ST, we'll get more canon stuff featuring these characters than we did with the OT 3

 

There is certanly a debate around this matter. TFA shows us a strong dynamic between Finn and Rey and, to a lsser extent, between Poe and Finn. No relationship at all between Poe and Rey. I guess it all deppens on what happens in TLJ. But KTM has been cast for a reason, and the rumors do not point to Finn, KTM and Poe sharing an adventure, but more like Finn and KTM on one side, and Poe on another one.

This would probably lead us to Episode IX, with Poe and Rey not sharing a scene together, Finn and Rey being separated for all TLJ, and Finn and Poe potentially having less screen time together in TFA than they did in TLJ.

Which maybe it works as a whole, but it looks certanly different compared to the previous trilogies. There is no doubt about that.

 

As someone mentioned in the romance thread, it's probably to give the characters a better arc. Many felt Han and Leia were wasted in RotJ. And there characters were just there, no development.

So departing the ST characters is all part of the plan (learning from previous trilogy's errors)

 

That's an interesting take. I kinda had similar thoughts not too long after seeing TFA but then dismissed it because I had lost faith that this SW story group would actually plan something out like that so thoughtfully.

 

That's the thing. We have a story group now plus the writers.

Rather than just George writing notes on paper, like back in the day.

 

Not sure the SG has a say in these stuff. I can't see Hidalgo saying RJ that the big three need to spend more time together.

My guess it that, if questioned about it, RJ or JJ would say they wanted to tell a story and that, by doing so, they had to do it at the expense of the three main characters not spending too much time together. The approach might very well be having the separate stories that intertwin and end up in the same place.

I understand some fans might no be too pleased with this as it has not been done before in the franchise.

 

By making Poe an X-Wing pilot, they really ended up isolating him from everyone else. Being an X-wing pilot worked well in terms of Finn's escape and in giving the audience a pair of eyes up during the dog fight over Starkiller base, but in terms of other characters interacting with him, he's kind of off on his own.

I do think the concept of the 'big three' will breakdown over TLJ. Introducing Rose and having her go on a mission with Finn almost makes her seem like she's now a big three (four?) member. I'm not saying this is bad, btw. I like Poe and hope they find a way to utilize him well in TLJ and I think from the little we've heard, Rose sounds like a really interesting character.

I do disagree, though, with the idea that Kylo is a member of the triad. His interactions with Finn and then with Rey just show he's the antagonist. He plays a critically important role in both their journeys, but he's not a third member of their group. Saying he's part of the triad is like saying Darth Vader was a member of the team in the OT because he interacted with Leia so much on the Death Star and then had a deep connection to Luke.

 

I don't think these new heroes will be as isolated from one another as was assumed before the SWCO interviews.

When asked if Rey is lonely in TLJ, Daisy responded that she has Chewie as a constant friend and that Finn wakes up. She also talks about reuniting with John on set after spending "a lot of the film" with Mark. That suggests a continuation of the Rey/Finn relationship in TLJ.

Oscar talked about sharing scenes with Finn, plus John talked about Finn/Poe action scenes in TLJ and their "bromance", so they're taking the opportunity to continue that bond. The qualitative experience of fighting for their lives together (like the trash compactor scene from ANH) is more important than the quantity of time characters spend together when it comes to establishing a close friendship. So even one action scene together in the film will do plenty to make them seem like brothers.

And we already know Finn and Rose will bond. So the real question is: Do Rey, Poe, and Rose ever really bond with one another?

And the answer may very well be no. But that still leaves three other close friendships (Finn/Rey, Finn/Poe, and Finn/Rose) that we know will exist in the ST. So it's not like they're all just going to be off in their own little corners.

I agree that it is different from the OT, not to have a trio of friends. But friendship pairs are still relationships.

 

Does anyone think Poe might go with Finn and Rose? Based on Oscar's comments in recent interviews, it sounds like he's going to be with Carrie quite a bit, so probably not, unless those stories overlap. But Rey needs to actually meet him on screen somehow. It'll be weird if she somehow meets Rose before Poe.

 

Hard to say - he has a new outfit that's not his flight suit, which makes me think he does plenty of scenes that don't involve X-wing piloting. I also keep thinking someone needs to fly Finn and Rose to all these different places they're going (unless Rose turns out to be a pilot).

 

I think there has to be some overlap between Finn/Rose and Poe. Until he meets Rose, Poe is Finn's closest relationship on the Resistance base, and both John and Oscar have talked about how they'll be sharing scenes. There might be a separation but I bet they'll be reunited for the climax of the film. And most likely Rey will meet Poe if she comes back to the Resistance in this film. Like you said, it'd be weird if she didn't.

 

In the OT, Leia never met Obi Wan. Aside from Luke and Lando, none of the others met Wedge. Artoo never met Lando. Leia is the only good guy that met Tarkin.

 

Bingo. Rey, Finn and Kylo. Two protagonists and one antagonist. If one takes Anakin-Vader as finally an antagonist, then it's similar to the PT structure. Also, if they are really going the opposite route of the PT, then Kylo's arc will be from the dark side to the light. Finn (just like Padme) will work mostly on the non-Force side, helping the galaxy in general. Rey and Kylo will reflect Obi-Wan and Anakin-Vader's stories, respectively, but kind of in a reverse way.
Poe, Rose are extra new characters (but not mirroring their story arcs). Like Lando. Mon Mothma. Bail. Mentor figures are Han, Luke, Leia.

 

....thats kind of interesting. I'll say that i've always liked vegeta style characters that were once bad, but reformed. I do resist that when it comes to kylo since we've seen redemption be a part of star wars arcs for so long. However, this poster always looked cool to me....

 

Eh, I can't buy the "Kylo is actually the third main character" arguments. And even if they held up for The Force Awakens, they certainly don't for The Last Jedi after CinemaCon, where the three leads were billed as Daisy, John, and Oscar.



Regardless of who's in the trio, or even if there is a trio at all, I'm excited for Rose's addition to these characters's relationships. I hope she has strong relationships with Rey and Poe as well as Finn - Star Wars is massively lacking in female friendships and Rey and Rose would be a step in the right direction.

 

I still don't understand why we're not hearing much about Benicio.

IIRC Rian said at SWC that there are two great new characters that he's introducing, and that one of them was there (KMT/ Rose). And based on the above, I assume the second one he was referring to is Laura Dern's character.

Why no mention of a third? Is Benicio's role simply too small to note? Or are they leaving him as a surprise?

 

Same here, I'm wondering what kind of character Benicio will play... If he's acting as some new bounty hunter-type person, I hope he can bring along the mannerism of his memorable role in "Sicario" - that guy was awesome in this movie!

And as for relationships, I presume we won't really see much of romantic stuff yet, at least in The Last Jedi... We can potentially see very strong friendships such as those between Finn and Poe as well as Rey and Finn, with a chance of these two hooking up - Finn and Rose?

 

I'd love it if there weren't any romances but the film focused on those friendships. They only had a couple of days time to develop over the events of TFA - it would be great to see them develop more and then IX could introduce a FinnRey or FinnRose romance. But TLJ seems packed enough without any romance, and Daisy went on the record saying the love story was more about love between friends than anything else (I think? I'll try to find the exact quote).

 

Actually, he used the words "a couple" and "a few". He never said the words "Two".

 

Lol, so this comes to mind then, with regards to the friendship between Finn and Rey!

 

Thanks for the clarification. I must have interpreted "a couple" as "two." And as he also said "a few," I'm content that BDT will be introduced sometime soon. Just irrationally panicking about him being cut from the film. Probably because he's one of my favorite living actors.