Religion

Discussion in 'FanForce Community' started by halibut, Mar 22, 2009.

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  1. Ceillean Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 13, 2001
    star 5
    I pose these exact same questions.
    The bible and the texts therein cannot be proven to be true.

    How do you know it is true? Were you there?

    And we don't know for sure that what is written in teh bible has really happened.

    See, same questions. ;)
  2. Lexi Host of Quick-Games

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    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2002
    star 4
    When I was in first and second grade, I had a Christian teacher. She teached us a lot from the bible, including the creationism. However, looking back at it now, I believe it was wrong of her to only teach us of her beliefs.

    Beeing young children, we were all very gullible and thought that what she was telling us really was the truth. Of course it was in her eyes, but as a teacher she should have taught us that there are other theories on how we were made. I never knew about the evolution (which makes a lot more sense to me) until I got a new teacher and to my big regret now, I never got to learn anything about the time before humans.

    That actually brings me to a question. How does the Bible explain the prehistoric animals, such as dinosaurs. They lived on earth long before humans ever did, and yet the Bible claims that the Earth and humankind were created almost simultaneously.
  3. tahiriveilax Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2008
    star 4
    Just answering back a few pages when people were saying 'why does God let bad things happen then?'

    This is what the Bible says. God made everything, he also made Adam and Eve who were the first people. God directly told Adam not to eat from this specific tree because he said that Adam would die, this was a test to see if he would give into sin. Adam told Eve, and the devil confused Eve and said 'God doesn't want you to have the fruit from that tree because its better' and all this. So she had some fruit from that tree, then she told Adam to have some, and Adam did. Now Eve is a bit better because she didn't hear it directly from God, but Adam did and he just went and ate it. Now we live in a world of sin and we will all go to hell (this is the Bible I'm not telling you what to believe) because of what Adam did, he choose the Devil over God. God gave us freewill, but he loves us and wants us to live happily and go to heaven. So he sent Jesus and Jesus died on the cross for all out sins, so that we could go to heaven.

    So we still live in a world of sin, but if we choose God and the way of Christ, then he will guide us through a happy life and we will go to heaven. There will be hardships, and God helps us through them, he protects because he is a loving God, he loves us but he is just as well. He is very forgiving and he welcomes all his children with open arms. If we follow Christ, we will go to heaven.

    I'm not trying to shove it down your throats. I just know how unfair life can seem and there feels like there is something missing, but that thing is God, and he has led me back to him through people (great example is Kim, but also my friend Jess who showed me Boom).
  4. Mister_Master Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2007
    star 6
    I know what you are saying and I have one word to answer it with.

    Faith.

    I believe that There is a God, and I believe that He gave his perfect and holy son Jesus to bear my sins on the cross as a substitute. And I also believe that three days later he rose from the grave, and he is alive. And he did all of this out of love. I have Faith.

    I also know that I believe that Jesus is real because he has changed me, and it is only through him am made clean.
  5. tahiriveilax Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2008
    star 4
    Amen to that.:cool:
  6. halibut Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 27, 2000
    star 8
    God created Adam and Eve as adults despite only being minutes old. Same with the Earth. When the Earth was made, it had the appearance of an "adult" planet.
  7. Lolly_Tolly Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2008
    star 4
    Well, we're technically still in the seventh creative day. So, that would kind of indicate that they were not literal days. So it's true that the Bible does not mention the dinosaurs, but it also leaves room for them to have existed.
  8. Obi Anne FF admin Celebrations, Europe

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    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 1998
    star 7
    In a way I see God as the clockmaker, he started it all with Big Bang, and he has his hands in evolution, but we can't see or proove it. Which means that from a scientific point of view it all happened by chance. For example if I say "God created man" I more think of it that he started the process rather than creating Adam as a grown man. I have no problems with either Big Bang or the evolution.
  9. Lolly_Tolly Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2008
    star 4
    I have problems with evolution and theories like that, when people start telling me that creationism is stupid because it takes such a huge leap of faith. The same could be said of evolution. But other than that, I don't have a problem with theories, so long as they are presented as theories, and not as fact.
  10. Darthrevan4ever Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 3, 2008
    star 6
  11. halibut Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 27, 2000
    star 8
    Evolution should be taught in Science classes. Creationism should be taught in RE classes (Religious Education or equivalent).
  12. Mister_Master Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2007
    star 6
    Rev has a good point which I was going to get to.

    Many scientists have taken theory's of evolution and claimed they were facts. And people believe them. But if a creationism scientist has a theory that they are working to prove, everyone immediately says it's false. That is double standards. If you have no proof then don't claim it is fact.

    I don't know if what the Bible says is really going to happen. But if it does happen, then I am going to be on God's side. I would rather believe that I am loved by God enough that he would send his son to die for me, and pay my sin debt so that I may live eternity with him. Rather then believe that I was created by random chance, and in about sixty or so years I am going to die, and that's it.
  13. Lexi Host of Quick-Games

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    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2002
    star 4
    That's not what I meant. Maybe I was being unclear. My point is that she should have told us that there are other theories as well. I want to decide for myself what I choose to believe in, but how can I do that if I'm just being taught one view on how the world was created?
  14. Darthrevan4ever Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 3, 2008
    star 6
    okay well Now evolution is being taught as the only thing that os true most schools will not allow it
  15. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
    Because the creation theory is abotu one specific religion. If you teach that then you have to teach everything else (so hal's right and it belongs in a RE class). Evolution relies on scientific research and observations, which is why it's taught in a science class.
  16. MasterMonkey13 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 2008
    star 3
  17. Darthrevan4ever Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 3, 2008
    star 6
    yes you can't prove either so both should be taught
  18. tahiriveilax Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2008
    star 4
    Although learning about evolution is extremely annoying, I agree. If you wish to learn about creation and God, you can go to a catholic school or a Christian school or go to Church, or start up a RE group in your school. Benefits everyone. :)
  19. halibut Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 27, 2000
    star 8
    This is the crux of the issue, isn't it. The majority of people see evolution as a scientific process, and creationism as an act of faith hence the teachings in different classes.

    But as for "proving" evolution, whilst that may or may not be possible, I'm pretty sure that there is a lot of evidence supporting it (fossils, bones etc etc) as compared with the faith-based creationism beliefs. I'm not saying either is right or wrong, but to me there is clear distinction between faith and science.
  20. Qui-Gon_Reborn Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 11, 2008
    star 6
    I think that's a pretty excellent definition!

    Consciousness is produced by the mind, so that the mind is proven to exist, and so is consciousness.

    Faith is defined as "belief in, devotion to, or trust in somebody or something, especially without logical proof." Science, however, is "the study of the physical and natural world and phenomena, especially by using systematic observation and experiment." God, or the topic of religion, is not something that can be verified through systematic observation and experimentation, so I don't think creationism should be even touched in a science class.
  21. Lexi Host of Quick-Games

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    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2002
    star 4
    This is a very interesting discussion!

    I agree that evolution belongs in the science class and creationism in religion class. There are scientific facts to support the evolution, but I have yet to see scientific evidence or facts that supports creationism. It's more of believing in something that you can't see, which don't belong in science class. Science is about collecting data and information from actual physical observations regardless of religious aspects.
  22. Lolly_Tolly Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2008
    star 4
    Ok. Here, in Australia, we rarely have any RE classes, and when we do, they focus on love, not creationism, and definitely, not the bible. Evolution is taught in Ancient History, and not in Biology. Now, should either be taught at all?

    Creationism is found in a lot of religions, and it is, from a skeptic's point of view, a valid theory, even without bringing anything overly religious into the situation. (I view it as truth, so I'm not going to call it a theory, y'know?)
  23. Ceillean Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 13, 2001
    star 5
    In Germany, Religion is a general school subject. It's parted three ways now, though. When I still went to school we had protestant religion classes and catholic religion classes. And now there's also muslim religion classes as far as I know.

    It's not a mandatory class. If you have a different belief, you can change the subject.

    The catholic class read the bible and discussed everything and anything that had to do with the bible. Symbolism, word for word and whatever else. I was in the protestant class and we never once took a look at the bible. Instead we were taught how the protestant religion came to be, religious history (all sorts of religion, starting from jews to muslims to hindu and so on) -- I clearly remember half a year of talking about Martin Luther.

    So even if religion is taught in school, you have to again differentiate. Not everyone believes the same thing. Especially when it comes to creationism. ;)
  24. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
    What hal and QGR said abotu creationism vs. science.

    And yes, there are plenty of schools that don't offer RE. Mine didn't. But mine also didn't offer AP Euro, which was hugely disappointing. So if you don't find want you want in a class, study on your own.
  25. Obi Anne FF admin Celebrations, Europe

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    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 1998
    star 7
    Religion is a mandatory subject here, but it's about all religions. I think the way that it's taught has probably changed since I went to school though. For me it was the basic biblical stories in the first years, when we got up to 7th grade it was about the different christian faiths and then in the last years it was about world religions, I don't think we even touched on Christianity. Also at least from the 7th grade it was taught more as an orientation about the religions, nothing was ever claimed to be "right" or "true". I think that today they don't do the biblical stories from the start, and probably start with world religions even earlier.
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