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Memph, TN Revenge of the Sith - Kevin Smith review up

Discussion in 'Memphis, TN' started by rhonderoo, Sep 20, 2004.

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  1. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    I fully expect the bad guys to be really bad in ROTS. I just hope it's not done gratuitously to appease blood-thirsty fanboyz or reflect the headlines of CNN.

    I don't expect to see blood and gore everywhere, but it will be dark, heck just like the OT was. Alderaaan was genocide. The Rebel Alliance were terrorists. There will be some implied horrible things that people might as well set their teeth for. In 1976, George Lucas took the Vietnam War, Capatilistic America and Europe, the Communistic regimes in Eastern Europe and Nazi WW2, combined it with mythological aspects and made a kid's movie of it. And you thought you were watching space battles and lightsaber fights... ;)


    Star Wars is a fantasy/space opera about good vs. evil, making the right..or wrong..choices, loyalty to family and friends, taking a stand against wrongness in the world, etc. Hopefully, this movie will bring the Saga full circle to the extent that a bit of moral fiber can still be gleaned from the modern day fairy tale.

    Now, Vader will probably do things that disgust and shock us, but it will still be told in a children's novel - I've seen the advertisment. I don't think any the fact that it is a fantasy/space opera about good vs. evil will change with ROTS. Evil will win in this one, though. More or less. Luke and Leia live, so it's not totally dark, but I haven't seen much else light in anything we've seen come from Star Wars.com. Darth Vader will do the things that gets him to ANH Vader - the Vader that snapped a man's neck in two, I have no doubt about that, but anything else, I expect to be fully recognizable as Star Wars.
  2. Jedi Trace SouthEast RSA

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Dec 15, 1999
    star 6
    Vader will probably do things that disgust and shock us

    You won't believe what was just on SpongeBob when you posted that:

    "F is for fire that burns down the whole town,
    U is for uranium - BOMBS
    N is for No Surviors!"

    [face_laugh] [face_laugh] [face_laugh]


    Sorry. It was funny at the time. [face_blush] Guess you had to be there....

    8-}

  3. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    [face_laugh]

    Whoohoo! I'm ready! I'm ready! ...I'm ready...I'm ready...I'm ready... [face_dancing]


    Burn, baby, burn. :D
  4. WonderPants Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2003
    star 3
    what about the wanton destruction of the Ewok's moon by the destruction of the shield generator

    ????

    Looked to me like it was in good enough shape for a firelit singsong that evening, judging from the end of ROTJ.


    subsequent destruction of the DS and the "children" there?

    Independent civilian contractors, the lot of them. Thank you, Kevin Smith! :D



    And I love that every Star Wars debate now has to end with "remember the children"!!!! Children die in war. It happens. It is happening now. I hate to sound crass - but death, destruction, greed, war and evil are parts of life that come with the good and have since the beginning of time. American soldiers in Iraq are told to shoot children that come to close to the gates if they don't heed the first warning - the Iraqi society has made children believe that martyrdom will get them everlasting life. I know this for a fact. The world (and the GFFA) is gray. As adults we'll have to learn to deal with it. [

    Oh, I agree absolutely, but then why hope that you don't see kids getting killed on screen (or at least their implied deaths). Maybe a step too far for our favourite Sith Lord?


    Hmph.

    I need to go outside and sample some hard reality. I can feel myself being seduced by the Basement Dwelling TFN Fanboy Side. [face_plain]
  5. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    Maybe a step too far for our favourite Sith Lord?

    Are you kidding? The Jedi have brought this all on themselves. [face_devil] I say bring on Darth Vader, it's time for a little balancin'!
  6. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    I say kill everyone and let the Force sort them out.

    :p

    There are things that we know must happen to complete the backstory, and some of it ain't pretty. All I can hope for is a modicum of decency in the way things are handled. I don't want to see 3-year-old younglings getting chopped to bits by Vader or clone troopers.. Doesn't mean it didn't happen, but there are ways to get the idea across without bowing to the fanboys' bloodlust.

    My suggestion is that Lucas springs for a roll of duct tape and uses it to keep Rick "I'm a big, fat, freaking fanboy and I love to curse" McCallum away from the production for the next couple of months. Maybe we should send him a DVD of 9 to 5 for some ideas on how to handle Jabba McCallum: Fanboy Extraordinaire.
  7. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    I say kill everyone and let the Force sort them out.


    That's what I'm talking about!! [face_devil] And it does, I'm sure.


    I get Darth Vader, black suit and fine Anakin. I don't care what happens after that. ;) I'm pretty much going to to be fine with whatever at this point, from everything I hear, it just keeps getting better and better. I won't be disappointed. Is it May, yet?

    With all this new mystical stuff that's being brought in at the end, I'll have to go watch ROTJ again (like I need an excuse).
  8. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    That's what I like to see come back into it... The mystical aspect.
  9. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    I don't really think it ever left, but it certainly will get deep at the end of ROTS. :D
  10. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    That's been the thing with the PT- It's mostly been centered on the political maneuvering that brought Palpatine to power, while the mystical aspect has taken the back seat.
  11. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    I think it's just not as mystical because they've explained everything that people considered mystical - until the end of ROTS. THEN the mystical Force comes in.
  12. WonderPants Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2003
    star 3
    I get Darth Vader, black suit and fine Anakin. I don't care what happens after that. I'm pretty much going to to be fine with whatever at this point, from everything I hear, it just keeps getting better and better. I won't be disappointed. Is it May, yet?


    TPM and AOTC sounded great on paper too....
  13. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    I'm going to hang onto hope, and reserve judgement until I see it. I have high hopes, like everyone else, but I'm going to try my best to not do what I did with AOTC and overindulge in certain preconceived expectations. That's why it took nearly two years for AOTC to grow on me. If people keep telling themselves they're going to hate this film long before they ever see it, then their egos are probably not going to allow them to recant their previous opinion after seeing the film. It's a matter of admitting to themselves, and to others to whom they expressed that opinion, that they were wrong, and not a whole lot of people are going to ever admit that.
  14. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    TPM and AOTC sounded great on paper too....

    They looked pretty good on film, too... :confused:



    I don't care if there is no plot - I get DARTH VADER, BLACK SUIT and FINE ANAKIN. I've already seen it. There is nothing to be disappointed in. The movie is already made for me and 15 million other fangirls. ;)
  15. WonderPants Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2003
    star 3
    Sure, I hope ROTS is good, but after TPM and AOTC, I'm not holding my breath. I still reckon it'll have wall to wall CGI that makes it look like a cartoon, it's share of bad acting/direction, and weak acting/direction, whether it has a darker tone or not.

    Maybe I'll be wrong and it'll improve drastically on TPM and AOTC, but I think that anyone who expects it to beat ESB is living in cloud cuckoo land.


    They looked pretty good on film, too...

    In a cartoony way perhaps, but all the style in the world doesn't compensate for script and acting problems.


    I don't care if there is no plot - I get DARTH VADER, BLACK SUIT and FINE ANAKIN. I've already seen it. There is nothing to be disappointed in. The movie is already made for me and 15 million other fangirls.

    That's fine if all you want is to see Vader, but I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting decent characters.

    I know you love Hayden Christiansen, but as the pivotal character of the PT, he seems to be out of his depth in AOTC (although to be fair, so does Jake Lloyd in TPM and Natalie Portman in TPM/AOTC).
  16. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    I gotta disagree with you about Hayden, Ben. The kid has talent, as expressed in his other films. I think it may be George Lucas that has gone beyond his depth. Stop and think how many emotionally-driven films he's directed.

    None. Nada. Zippo. Zilch.

    That, and he's purposely trying to capture an acting method that hasn't been used since the 1930's or 1940's, which, unless you like old movies and watch them frequently, you won't appreciate or understand. As a man who spent his childhood Saturday afternoons watching classic films, I do understand the reversion to old Hollywood style- to a point. If he'd have gone the other way, we'd have another craptastic cinematic piece of overblown acting and slow-motion tears like the Lord of the Rings series. But, he's going for quiet drama in an age where most audiences take overdramaticism as the standard, and have little else in the way of modern film to give them any clue that there are other, better ways to express character depth.

    Admittedly, there are times when I cry out to the screen "Emote, dammit! Emote!" during a SW film, especially when I know for sure that my feelings would be expressed otherwise if the same thing happened to me. But, in comparison to some of the ways I've seen characters in other films react to the same emotional situations, I'm often glad he didn't go that route.
  17. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    So what did you think was wrong with Hayden? Too wooden? Too monotone? Too stiff?
  18. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    Rhonda said she likes her men stiff.

    What? Whaddya mean you weren't talking about acting? :confused:


    Actually, I always thought that Hayden was trying to be more vocally precise in his annunciations to sound more like James Earl Jones's vocal characterization of Vader.
  19. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    Actually, I always thought that Hayden was trying to be more vocally precise in his annunciations to sound more like James Earl Jones's vocal characterization of Vader.

    He wasn't trying, he WAS being more vocally like Darth Vader. Monotone and precise in his annunications. Walking stiff and upright with long strides - all this was on purpose. I can count at least 3 scenes off the top of my head in AOTC where he reminds anyone you've ever talked to of Vader and fanboys still hate to give him his due because they had some preconcieved notion of how they wanted Anakin Skywalker to look and act. I'm taking Lucas' word that this is how Anakin was, since he wrote it. I have no other "Anakin" to compare his performance in the Holy Trilogy.
  20. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

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    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    I can count at least 3 scenes off the top of my head in AOTC where he reminds anyone you've ever talked to of Vader and fanboys still hate to give him his due because they had some preconcieved notion of how they wanted Anakin Skywalker to look and act.

    That's because most of the fanboys see themselves as Anakin. That's why they'd hate anyone who ever took the role.

    And that scene in AOTC when he and Padme stride up to the homestead.... The boy is so Vader there that it's undeniable. He absolutely works the cape just like Prowse did.
  21. WonderPants Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2003
    star 3
    Admittedly, there are times when I cry out to the screen "Emote, dammit! Emote!" during a SW film, especially when I know for sure that my feelings would be expressed otherwise if the same thing happened to me. But, in comparison to some of the ways I've seen characters in other films react to the same emotional situations, I'm often glad he didn't go that route.

    But Liam Neeson showed that you don't have to be play a role in a formal 30s style and be unengaging. God, I wish Lucas had kept him onboard somehow.

    I should add that this isn't just a pop at HC, it's a comment on quite a few people in the PT and Lucas's screenwriting. Han, Luke and Leia were simple yet brilliant characters whom the entire audience could connect with. Anakin and Padme aren't in the same league! And this failure to sell the characters is the doom of the PT.


    He wasn't trying, he WAS being more vocally like Darth Vader. Monotone and precise in his annunications. Walking stiff and upright with long strides - all this was on purpose.

    But why would he need to do that? It can be argued that the voice and walk all come from needing artificial lungs and being half-robotic.
    The main nod to Vader, which was all that was needed, was the 'reviewing the troops' pose on the balcony. We know he becomes Vader, there's no need to beat us over the head with it.


    most of the fanboys see themselves as Anakin.

    Because he got to play hide the sausage with Natalie Portman? ;)


    And that scene in AOTC when he and Padme stride up to the homestead.... The boy is so Vader there that it's undeniable. He absolutely works the cape just like Prowse did.

    But can he match Dave Prowse's masterful finger waving? Can he, f***!!

    :D
  22. Qui-Gon Tim Memphis, TN FanForce Chapter Rep

    Chapter Rep
    Member Since:
    Apr 1, 2000
    star 5
    But, Anakin is still speaking under that mask, and that's why the vocal inflection and tone need to match. (If James Earl Jones's vocal pattern could be matched by a modern computer, every fanboy in a Vader costume would be running around saying "I find your lack of faith disturbing".)

    Also, Ben, you've had 16 years of life between the end of the OT and the PT to get you all good and cynical. Maybe the fact that you don't relate to the PT characters has something to do with the fact that you've grown up. As Kevin Smith said in an interview about the PT, Lucas can't give us back our childhoods, and that's what a lot of fans are expecting.

    Oh, and AMEN on Liam Neeson, there! Maybe we'll get to see him in EIII.
  23. DarthToddy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 22, 2004
    star 2
    **Steps on soap box**

    For me .... the movie is a visual reference for my book.

    Go book and waiting for the visual references!!!

    TPM and AOTC movies weren't as good as the books, but neither are or were the different OT movies when compared to the books....anyone who's basing their "ENTIRE" SW experience on the movie's acting...effects...musical score and etc. needs to read the books....and I KNOW that doesn't hold any application to our boards members, but that's my opinion!!!

    I can hear what's wrong with SW from work from the gay guy and stutter @ work who claim to be movie makers and all they can do is make artsy films, in which you walk away saying why didn't I watch the SW holiday special!!! (I'm not kiddin)

    It hurts my eyes to read people who ADORE SW complaining about it....apparently there are few of us who actually like the movies openly....so why can't we love them for what George has made them and try not to overly analyze these timeless works of art.

    ALSO!!!!!

    For Peter Jackson's LOTR...........the story was already great....so Jackson had a script......and he worked with tools and equipment that Lucas either brought to a use on a whole new level or he helped create it @ Skywalker Ranch....that goes for every movie with special effects.

    For Lucas to create a story, characters and universe and bring it to a whole new level for different ages to enjoy was downright pretty amazing....been a while since that has happened. He not only revolutionized movie making, but also fantasy writing too. A whole new universe of characters and where the saga never ends!!!

    SO...point being made I hope...love and enjoy it....ROTS may not be the best movie of the saga or everyone's favorite SW story, but it's going to wrap up our favorite saga on the screen....if not forever....a long long time!!!

    Let's enjoy and get our geekasm motors revving and lets enjoy these last few months of looking forward to a SW movie and let criticism (<ms?) lie with those who can't open their minds and enjoy our escape into a "Galaxy far far away"!!!


    **steps of soap box**


    Now off to bring order to the galaxy!!!


    John T. everyone's favorite DarthToddy ( I should make a drink and name it that huh?!?!!? )
  24. Jedi Trace SouthEast RSA

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Dec 15, 1999
    star 6
    [uber fangirl mode]


    =D= =D= =D=


    I'm going to invent a drink called the Darth Toddy just for that post, John! :D

    It hurts my eyes to read people who ADORE SW complaining about it....apparently there are few of us who actually like the movies openly....so why can't we love them for what George has made them and try not to overly analyze these timeless works of art.

    Amen, brother!


    *steps up to podium*


    My name is Traci and, I'll say it out loud peeps, I LOVE STAR WARS MOVIES!!

    I know George can't write screenplays or direct actors. I know the dialogue is campy. I know plot and characterization were sacrificed to CGI and bad editing in the prequels. And I know ROTS is going to be dark and disturbing and "not many people will like it" (-I'm paraphrasing George circa 5 years ago there.) And I know there will be plot holes and inconsistencies between the two trilogies.

    But, kriff it all, there is something in my very soul that snaps to attention every time I hear that opening theme music! Can I get a witness here? ;)


    SO...point being made I hope...love and enjoy it....ROTS may not be the best movie of the saga or everyone's favorite SW story, but it's going to wrap up our favorite saga on the screen....if not forever....a long long time!!!

    Let's enjoy and get our geekasm motors revving and lets enjoy these last few months of looking forward to a SW movie and let criticism (<ms?) lie with those who can't open their minds and enjoy our escape into a "Galaxy far far away"!!!


    And there you have it: "enjoy our escape into a Galaxy far far away"

    It's fiction. It's fantasy. It's supposed to be FUN! It was never meant to be picked apart to a bloody pulp. His Flannelledness is a film maker, not a novelist or moralist. He had a story to tell and we can enjoy it or not....he'll die a rich man either way. :p


    *goes to invent drink*


    [/uber fangirl mode]


    [face_blush]




  25. rhonderoo Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 9
    [image=http://www.rhonderoo.com/FEDSHIP.jpg] <--Fine, tall Anakin. [face_love]

    [image=http://www.rhonderoo.com/maceobiyoda.jpg]


    [image=http://www.rhonderoo.com/bailyoda.jpg]


    [image=http://www.rhonderoo.com/battle.jpg]
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