ST Rey & Kylo Ren in Episode IX

I liked how Ben went from 'let me be your teacher' to 'let's rule the galaxy together', I think he must have been very impressed by Rey.

 

He should be by now she gets the best of him at times.

 

You know, I actually wouldn't mind seeing a legitimate case for Reylo. If people can see something great in toxic couples like Spike/Buffy and Damon/Elena (both being relationships involving murderous vampires) I'm sure there is a good argument out there.

 

It's also not entertaining when people in real life make bad romantic relationship choices.

 

@anakinfansince1983

Like I get the tension, the chemistry, and the symbolism, but...to me, it just makes for a great hero-villain dynamic more than anything else. It's like how every great superhero has that one specific archenemy that gets to them more than anyone else. Like Batman and the Joker, Spider-Man and Green Goblin/Venom/Doc Ock, or Superman and Lex Luthor.

Oh no, don't do Miss Whitney Elizabeth Houston like that

 

Sorry, but I need someone to do a Rey and Kylo parody to this song.

 

I’ve read the arguments and found them fundamentally flawed. The two biggest and most common problems:

1. The enormity of Kylo’s murder of Han and it playing out in a way that maximized the visceral horror of it. Anakin killed younglings - but offscreen.

2. There simply isn’t time or narrative space to get Kylo to the place the other villains were at when the actual romance began. There’s a reason those redemption arcs are so long.

 

My firmest spec for Kylo in TLJ was a robust redemption arc, no matter the parentage thing. Especially if Reylo was going to happen.

Nope.

This just isn’t an enemies-to-lovers setup. The trope has key elements and reasons how and why it works...

 

Yeah, but see my thing is that a lot of other people felt that it did. I've even seen people say that Reylo is their main reason for watching TLJ. I'm just trying to understand the perspective. I don't even like Spike/Buffy. It's toxic and insane, but...I get it. It also doesn't hurt the main character's story (at least not that much). Reylo does...nothing for Rey as a character.

See, I don't know because that patricide thing is something else. Pretty big red flag if you ask me.

 

Reylo, from what I can tell, rests in part on the idea of Rey as a self-insert character, like in a videogame or YA romance.

Red flag that it’s not an enemies-to-lovers setup, yes. But still - “There’s still light in him,” etc. Imo textbook foreshadowing. I’m very confident he’ll be redeemed; imo it’s his survival I’m unsure about.

 

I guess I understand what you're saying.

I don't know, I think the movies are pretty clear that the dark side/light side Force model is how things work, with degrees of ambiguity thrown in (like the Bendu), and that others access the Force in different ways then the Jedi/Sith methods. As far as "balance," I'm not sure where that goes, although Star Wars "theology" is kind of an odd thing; it takes a lot from Eastern spiritualism (e.g. becoming one with the supernatural that exists after death, the duality of good and evil in some aspects), but there's a lot from Western ideology, which has had a heavy Judeo-Christian influence (e.g. some semblance of natural law and that good must win over evil, some form of afterlife, views on redemption, etc.).

In other words, Star Wars has arguably taken two mutually incompatible worldviews and tried to put them together and iron out the seams. No wonder some of these things are pretty confusing.

 

In a simplistic-yet-Campbellian nutshell - East meets West.

That’s what I’m describing. There’s naturally a distinct moral dimension, but I think that the “dark side” as an evil, compulsive, corrupting power is not a natural part of the Force.

I think the best in-movie indication of this (from what I can tell, at least) is the two “dark side” caves, in ESB and Achoo.

The cave in Achoo, especially, doesn’t seem “evil.” In fact, it appears to be coded heavily “yin.” It’s a sea cave created by the tides, interestingly enough. It has a mirror - ebb and flow...note the “wave” effect (like an audience in a sports stadium) when Rey snaps her fingers.



Sound familiar?

Interestingly enough, Luke is above, and a woman’s voice can be heard below.

 

No joke. No parody.

For the people in this thread who are legitimately captivated by this strange toxic opposites attract mix there are a ton of pop songs for mixes of any of want to. Pop music thrives on toxic relationships.

Here are a few that come to mind:







Now, most of these kinds of songs are sung from the perspective of the female in the toxic relationship but if anyone is feeling brave and wants to try to cut up a weird video more from Kylo Ren’s perspective (and I fully admit that this has the potential to come off more unintentionally comedic due to how evil he is through 2 films ) but if you’re feeling brave... this song from the Black Keys in a weird way could work for him and the idea that this guy could rule a galaxy if only he could stop having these feelings for Rey that keep getting him into dangerous spots with her.



Cutting something to this iconic song would be an even bigger risk but could be interesting if edited well enough...

 

I don’t think LFL is romanticizing a toxic romance.

 

More songs to consider edits against for any Reylo fans out there:

 

Not at the moment, but you could definitely make a case for Anakin and Padme in Attack of the Clones. Even, the iconic Han and Leia couple has some toxic implications.

 

Last song for Reylo fans to consider editing against for me today. I promise.



I won't run away no more, I promise
Even when I get bored, I promise
Even when you lock me out, I promise
I say my prayers every night, I promise
I don't wish that I'm spread, I promise
The tantrums and the chilling chats, I promise
Even when the ship is wrecked, I promise
Tie me to the rotten deck, I promise
I won't run away no more, I promise
Even when I get bored, I promise
Even when the ship is wrecked, I promise
Tie me to the rotten deck, I promise
I won't run away no more, I promise

 

I don’t see those examples as even vaguely analogous.

When the word “abusive” is brought up by someone directly assisting with the story, it’s not going to be a canon romance.

 

I could write a counterargument but I honestly don't see how this psychoanalysis of Reylo fans is relevant to the characters themselves since it isn't the fans who are writing or otherwise influencing the direction of the story.

 

I have said for a long time that I don't think episode IX will end with them romantic in any way. Lucasfilm are too smart to go with something as controversial as that. I do think that if he's ousted and becomes an uneasy ally of the Resistance effort that he may do just enough to be allowed to escape and live on as an atoner.

The songs for the Reylo fans are more about the chemistry they could have had or could have long into the future in the EU should they cross paths again after IX ends. The idea is more that because he was so awful he ruined his chances with someone who could have been the most amazing person he'll ever have a chance to be with again in his life. It's more about how if these two have this kind of chemistry when he's been at his absolute worst... and selfish and awful... what could have been had he never been corrupted, and he'd never chosen the dark path? Perhaps fate would have brought her to the temple some day and these two could have met and bonded very differently. That's what's intriguing.

 

Exactly.

Seriously, why do people get up in arms over what other people like or are interested in. How does my way of enjoying the saga influence other people's enjoyment to the point where I need to be told I'm wrong. It's fiction. I can like whatever I want.