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ST Rey's Lineage / Parentage / Name

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by interxavier01, Dec 19, 2015.

?

Who are Rey's parents?

  1. Luke and ????

    84.2%
  2. Han and Leia

    15.8%
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  1. WebLurker

    WebLurker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2016
    Oh, okay.

    Kylo was also not completely trained and in pretty bad shape. (I've also been told that judging by his movies, he's a not a good swordsman, in the first place.) I've said it elsewhere (and I'm sure I sound like a broken record), but in comparison to other newbie Force users, Rey is not that spectacular.

    In the OT, the Jedi are believed dead. Obi-Wan and Yoda were all that was left. And then Darth Vader's kid who they had kept hidden. Luke was portrayed just like he could be anybody. There wasn't anything really special about him, other than he was an evil man's son who was being trained as a Jedi.

    Does the Force control how many medi-chlorians a person gets before they're born? I'm more inclined to say that if the will of the Force was involved, it was probably closer to predestination, making sure Rey was at the right place at the right time to have the opportunity to chose her part in the larger game of events going on.

    The Chosen One prophecy was fulfilled in Return of the Jedi (or unfulfilled in the TCW Mortis episodes, under conditions were there would be no replacement). There's no hint that Rey is that important. In fact, her story plays out more along the idea that she's not living up to her full potential and undervalues herself (for most of the movie, BB-8 and Finn are the only people who really seem to think she's worth more than the sum of her parts).

    I think the order of events states that Rey was left on Jakku years before Kylo Ren's purge.

    When was that?

    Recall in ESB when Luke feels a sense of familiarity with Dagobah despite never having gone there. It's later established by Yoda that Yoda had been watching Luke through the Force.

    Something similar happens in TFA, though it is not spelled out. When Kylo is trying to probe Rey's mind, he sees an island in the ocean, which is conspicuously where Luke is, even though Rey did not consciously know it. I felt like the implication is that she has a subconscious connection to him. His lightsaber called to her, and she could see him through the Force (or where he was anyway).

    I think it's possible that he could have been influencing her from afar. Perhaps he somehow was responsible for the Awakening. At any rate, I don't believe he's her father. But I do think he is aware of her and has been watching her.[/quote]

    It sounded more like Rey had had dreams about the island in the past, long before the movie. We do know that she had a probably-Force-triggered dream about being left on Jakku from the jr. novelization, so it could be like that, except that the island was the location of the Jedi temple Luke was looking for (Rey's Story), which means that most likely Rey was getting a vision of her future, when she went to the island at the end of the movie. If that's the case, there doesn't need to be a previous connection between them.

    In pretty much every canonical book version of the movie (the adult and jr. novelizations, Rey's Story, heck -- even the storybook -- when Rey grabs the saber from him, a surprised Kylo says "It is you." (The narration will inevitably add some variation that Rey had no idea what he was talking about and was too angry to care.) However, there is no context for what Kylo is thinking (does he realize that he met Rey in person before, heard of her, simply had a vision that a Force-sensitive young woman would play a key role in future events?), and since the line is not in the movie (and can't have happened off-camera, the way some of the novelizations' extra lines and scenes do), it's canonicity could be doubtful.

    The one possibility that might save it is that information in most of the other extra lines that cannot be reconciled with the movie's version of those conversations is considered canon, even if the version that they're described in isn't. (Does your brain hurt yet?) So, it is possible that Kylo knows who Rey is in some fashion and did identified her when she grabbed the saber, but didn't say so out loud, which also means that canonically Rey wouldn't've learned that Kylo knows more about her than she does (which may not be saying much, given that Rey has no clue who she is). But only future movies can say for sure.

    Yeah. I think at this point, the only way Rey can be Luke's daughter is if she was the product of a one-night stand and her mom never told Luke about the pregnancy, or something. If Rey had been lost and presumed killed at an early age, that could work, too, but would still feel tacked on without any set-up in this movie (like when Han gives his history lesson, mentioning that Luke had lost a daughter who would've been about Rey's age had she lived.)
     
  2. morrison85

    morrison85 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 13, 2005
    well unless there was an attack on the jed academy before kylo went dark it couldnt have been a safety drop off at jakku as she was like 6 ish years old and ben would have been 16ish. it is quite hard to know 16 years into supposed peace and a little girl gets dropped off at jakku.
     
  3. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    You're right, I wasn't considering the fact that Kylo's age doesn't match up in that regard. That even more so makes me doubt Luke is her dad. Because that means he ditched her on Jakku when things would have been more or less stable, before Ben fell. Which is kind of abhorrent.

    I'm again in favor of "Rey Random." Maybe her caretaker(s) got stranded on Jakku, borrowed a ship from the junk boss and had to leave Rey behind as insurance and expected to come back for her ASAP, but got stranded.

    I don't know. But I feel strongly that her being related to the Skywalkers just doesn't work. Between Maz's dialogue and the implication that Luke or whoever would just ditch her.

    Still, I think it's implied Luke is aware of her/watching her.

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  4. Ubraniff Zalkaz

    Ubraniff Zalkaz Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 26, 2014
    I have no idea who Rey's parents are and what her past holds. I'm just going off of what Trevorrow said:

    “I’ve seen all of the theories… What I do know is that we’re going to make sure that that answer is deeply and profoundly satisfying, because Rey is a character that is important in this universe, not just in the context of The Force Awakens but in the entire galaxy, and she deserves it. So we’ll make sure that that answer is something that feels like it was—it’s something that happened a long time ago [in a galaxy] far, far away, we’re just telling you what happened.”
     
  5. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    Oh, I don't doubt that they'll explain her backstory as to why she was left on Jakku, and her parents would have been a part of that. I think her parents will be important in that sense. But I don't feel she's going to be related to any of the "big" names. I don't think she's Luke's kid, both because why would Luke dump her during a time of stability? And Maz seems to distinguish between finding belonging with Luke and letting go of the past and accepting the fact that the family she was hoping for is never coming back.

    I'm guessing her parents, whoever they are, are dead.

    I don't think it's Luke. It would be ridiculous IMO, if it's Han and Leia. The Obi-Wan concept is an interesting theory but it requires quite the explanation as to when exactly did Obi-Wan, during his exile in the desert, have a kid, and then that kid would then have to be one of Rey's parents.

    It's interesting that Daisy was allowed to keep her accent, which is largely associated with Imperial officers and Obi-Wan. But I still find the theory highly unlikely.

    I don't think she's the second coming of Anakin, considering that Anakin was planned to be in the film at one point.

    Rebels has established that Force sensitive were still being born and Palpatine demanded they either be made to serve him or be killed. After Palpatine's death, I don't see any problem with new Force sensitives, like Rey being born.

    She's approximately 19 in TFA. Same age that Luke was in ANH. She looks no older than 8 or so to me in her vision. But saying she's 7-10 years old there, means she was on Jakku for 9-12 years prior to TFA. I don't see why any of the heroes would strand a relative on Jakku and not come back for her. So I cant picture Luke doing that.

    This would have all been before Ben fell.

    Snoke would be the only "big" name character i could think of that she could be related to, but that's because his history is a blank slate. he could be Palpatine's kid for all we know. But as far as Snoke goes. We don't know his backstory, what (if any) history he has with the heroes, or when he really crops up in Ben's life, or if he knew Luke personally.

    I suppose it's possible that he was a good guy, perhaps a Force user that came forward to help Luke after Palpatine's defeat, but then turned to evil. If Rey was his daughter and immensely powerful, then perhaps Luke hid her from him. With Snoke targeting Luke's nephew as his apprentice in retribution.

    One of the big complaints of TFA though was how it rehashed much of the OT. If they establish that Rey is the light sided offspring of a villain, who was put into hiding to keep her safe. Then it's pretty much copying what happened with Luke.

    Only instead of Obi-Wan and Yoda putting Luke into hiding to save him from Vader and Palpatine, it's Luke hiding Rey from Snoke.

    If Snoke = Snake, they could do a biblical serpent/Satan kind of backstory for him and Rey could be a part of it.

    If Snoke was once a partner of Luke's in building the academy and was a good guy, and someone that Han and Leia would have known. He could have been training some of the new Jedi alongside Luke. But then when Ben enters the picture, he might have become jealous and broke away to form the Knights of Ren and fallen from "grace"/been banned from the academy and taken control of the Imperial Remnant. Rey could have been his daughter and knowing what happened with her father and sensing her immense power, he may have tried to hide her from him. Snoke then begins to tempt Ben and destroys the little "Eden" Luke tried to build.

    This would explain several things. Where Snoke came from. Why Leia and Han are aware of Snoke's influence. When Leia says "that's why I wanted him to train with Luke" it could be that Snoke was there and helped train Ben for a time and may have begun corrupting him right under Luke's nose.

    It would explain why Rey is immensely powerful. And it would give new meaning to when Snoke finds out that Rey resisted Kylo. For much of the movie he didn't really get too excited about anything. Even when Star killer base is falling apart, he doesn't seem particularly upset. A little regretful perhaps, that Kylo was not better prepared. But when Kylo tells Snoke that Rey had resisted him, THAT seemed to pique Snoke's interest. He seemed in disbelief that it could happen and he became very serious and demanding when he orders Kylo to bring her to him. It could be that he suspects he knows who the scavenger is.

    Again, the problem here is it would rehash quite a bit. From the old Jedi exile hiding the villain's kid, to an "I am your father" moment.

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  6. Jedi Rey X

    Jedi Rey X Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    May 27, 2016
    Would have to say Ray's mother was a human female and her father was a human male.

    I am very sure I will be correct on this.
     
  7. Thrawn082

    Thrawn082 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 11, 2014
    Again there's this assumption that, if she's Luke's child, that he HAD to have been involved in leaving her on Jakku. And no, that isn't true. There are numerous ways to reconcile those things. It's not "ridiculous" in the slightest.

    Also I don't take Maz's words as proof of anything, because there's no evidence given in the film that she knows anything about Rey specifically. People are again, making an assumption in that regard. Her comments could easily be more generalistic. Han told her what he knows about Rey, and Maz filled in the blanks. Nothing to do with Maz knowing her specifically, or anything about her backstory specifically. And that interpretation is just as valid.

    Also there's no evidence that Luke has been watching her through the Force given in the movie either, at least not that I could see.

    So really, the whole "her being Luke's daughter makes no sense" is more about certain fans making assumptions/jumping to conclusions than what's actually present in the films at this point.
     
  8. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    I never said Luke watching her was explicit. But we know that Dagobah felt familiar to Luke despite him NEVER being there. Yoda then reveals that he had been watching him his whole life.

    So it's POSSIBLE that Rey and Luke had a similar situation, since Rey thought Luke was a myth and yet she has Luke's location pictured in the mind. There's no way that it's a coincidence that when Kylo is probing her mind, he sees an island and the ocean. Turns out Luke's on an island... in the ocean. Why does she subconsciously see Luke's location?

    And no. It doesn't make sense that she'd be his daughter. For one Jedi do not marry and were forbidden from attachments. So right off the bat it has to be assumed that Luke did these things and had a kid, when there's no evidence of it. He went on to train new Jedi and then went into exile.

    And it is "ridiculous" in that the story would get bogged down to make it work. It wouldn't have been ridiculous, if they had they written TFA in a more accommodating way. First you have to dismiss Han and Maz as having no idea what they're talking about, which you already did. It's like Dismissing Yoda as having no idea what he's talking about when he says Luke is the last of the Jedi because he's been on Dagobah and wouldn't know. It's dismissing exposition to fit a theory. Like saying there are other Jedi (without evidence of any) and dismissing Yoda.

    It's dismissing Maz as having no idea, when what she tells Rey is important to the story. Rey wants to go back to Jakku, when there is a conflict going on.

    It's like Obi-Wan wanting Luke to go to Alderaan and Luke initially saying no. Abrams had even said that Max had a particular ability in reading peoples' eyes. And she states, when looking into Rey's eyes, that who Rey is waiting for is not going to come back, that Rey already knows this, she's just not willing to admit it. Maz says that Rey herself already knows the truth that they are never coming back, while Luke still may. It points Rey in the path she needs to take, and despite her initially fighting against it, she ends up following Maz's advice. She moves past waiting for her parents and goes ahead to find Luke. As someone else pointed out, this is an important moment in Rey's development.

    Plus they then have to explain how, if Luke didn't do it, who took her and ditched her on such a desolate world? When as others have pointed out, one of the novelizations makes mention of whoever left her as being someone that cared about her. So then there's a mystery character that isn't Luke that cares about Rey and snatched her from her father and dumped her on Jakku.

    Again, convoluted.

    Merely having her be a character with new characters as parents is way less convoluted than trying to make her a Skywalker.

    I would argue there's zero evidence that Luke is her dad, and that while he COULD be her dad, it would be just as convoluted as making her Han and Leia's other kid and the multiple explanations (none of them good IMO) to make it work. Poe could be her brother, Obi-Wan could be her grandfather, Han could be her dad. She could be the defendant of a third Skywalker that Yoda and Obi-Wan hid and that Luke never learned about.

    They can do whatever they want. But some theories get a bit out there, like the Snoke/Plagueis one that hinged on dismissing what Palpatine says, etc.

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  9. Jedi Jessy

    Jedi Jessy Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2016
    “I think the amazing thing about [Episode VII] is that Finn and Rey don’t come from anywhere, and they find a place,” Ridley, who’s currently filming Rian Johnson’s Star Wars: Episode VIII, said. “So to me, it’s funny that people think it’s so important because I don’t really think it is.” Daisy Ridley

    "[...]But now I can see all of them in her. She’s a pilot so there’s Han. And she’s a kick-ass woman, so there’s Leia. But definitely the humble beginnings and an incredible story is the same as Luke." Daisy. Kathleen Kennedy referred Rey as the new Luke Skywalker.



    BBE - Years Before the Battle of Endor (Star Wars - Return of the Jedi)
    ABE - Years After the Battle of Endor (Star Wars - Return of the Jedi)

    Timeline

    2 BBE - Poe is born
    Return of the Jedi - The Battle of Endor (30 years before TFA)
    ~0 ABE - Leia and Han marry
    0~1 ABE - Ben is born
    1 ABE - The Battle of Jakku
    6 ABE - Poe's mother, Shara, dies
    7 ABE - Finn is born
    11 ABE - Rey is born
    16 ABE - Young Rey is abandoned on Jakku with Unkar Plutt (vision scene)
    17~18 ABE - Rinnrivin Di's criminal operation is funded to build up the Amaxines as an advance guard for the future arrival of the First Order
    21 ABE - Rey makes a flight suit doll
    <24~25 ABE - Leia sends Ben away to Luke
    <24~25 ABE - Han loses the Millennium Falcon
    24~25 ABE - Anakin Skywalker is revealed to the galaxy to later have become Darth Vader
    24~25 ABE - Leia serves out her last term as a New Republic Senator / Leia creates the Resistance
    24~25 ABE - Leia believes Ben is training with Luke but has been unable to get in contact with them
    24~25 ABE - Han runs a shipping company and oversees racing competition / Chewbacca continues to live on Kashyyyk

    >=24~25 ABE - "The Burning Temple" - Ben betrays Luke and kills the Jedi apprentices / Luke places his robot hand on R2-D2 [13] (vision scene)

    >=24~25 ABE - "The Battlefield" - The Knights of Ren with Kylo Ren (formerly Ben) in the rain (vision scene)
    >=24~25 ABE - Han and Leia become estranged spouses
    The Force Awakens - Galactic peace comes to an end (30 ABE)


    Pablo Hidalgo: "Yeah, I took the question to mean a matter of galactic war. The war ended at the Battle of Jakku. The next one starts in TFA."
    Daisy Ridley (Rey): "When something occurs when you’re 5, you know what went on but you don’t understand the reasoning. She's hopeful for what lies ahead, whether that involves the past or not."
    Jen Heddle (Lucasfilm): "Bloodline is set about 5 years before TFA."

    [13a] Star Wars: The Force Awakens Final Script for the WGA: "BURNING TEMPLE AT NIGHT"

    [13b] Star Wars: The Force Awakens Final Script for the WGA: "Han Solo: [Luke] was training a new generation of Jedi. One boy, an apprentice turned against him, destroyed it all. Luke felt responsible... He walked away from everything."

    StarWars.com Databank: Kylo Ren entry. "A dark side warrior with a mysterious past, Kylo Ren was neither Jedi nor Sith, but a product of both sides’ teachings. Once an apprentice of Luke Skywalker’s, he killed his fellow students and drove Skywalker into exile, becoming a First Order warlord and servant of Supreme Leader Snoke. Kylo was determined to destroy the last remnants of the Jedi, fulfilling the legacy of Darth Vader."

    Pablo Hidalgo: "Let's not call it a 'Jedi Academy.' But it wasn't that long ago. Timeline will be told through stories, not tweets. :)" "Yeah. It was more recent than [14/15 years ago]." "Let's use ''temple". That's the right term." "It happened less than 14 years ago." "We'd likely never use [the term Jedi 'Academy']. That's very EU, not very George. It'd be a temple. As for numbers, can't say now." "I think people like drawing connections between Rey's abandonment and the massacre at the temple based on nothing at all. No info." "I'll leave that to another source (maybe Bloodline, maybe something before that) to specify [how long Luke has been missing]." "There's nothing that says that Luke has been missing for 10 years before TFA." "The burning temple and the nighttime massacre appear to be two different events in two different places." "That's Luke as his Jedi temple is burning. That was the intent of that shot. It's the same hand & robes" "They're two different places and times."

    Pablo Hidalgo: "The big three actually earned decades of peace in this story, which is something the EU refused to let happen." "[Han and Leia split] when their son became a murderer."

    Via MagnarTheGreat
     
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  10. Darth Archimage

    Darth Archimage Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 28, 2013
    Nice work!
    I've tried to create my own timeline, but this is much better.
     
  11. fett 4

    fett 4 Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2000
  12. thejeditraitor

    thejeditraitor Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
  13. fett 4

    fett 4 Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2000
    How do you know it's fake fella ?
     
  14. thejeditraitor

    thejeditraitor Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    because it is and it's terrible.
     
  15. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    And that's also correct regarding the forum we're in: as noted at the top of this forum (The Force Awakens), there are NO spoilers allowed for the future movies in this forum.
     
  16. WebLurker

    WebLurker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2016
    If you're not like me and into reading movie spoilers (esp. months in advance), here's some wisdom I've heard: "Hear all, trust nothing." (Ferengi Rule of Acquisition Number 190).

    I'm 99.99% sure that 99.99% of every spoiler, comment by the people working on the movie, etc. is either to mislead us, generate more questions, and get us so curious that we can't wait to see it. Besides, they kept things well under wraps for the first one. I'm sure they'll be doing it again this time round.
     
  17. Darth_Pevra

    Darth_Pevra Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 21, 2008
    What do you mean "they kept things well under wraps for the first one"? The entire plot was basically out there weeks before release.
     
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  18. WebLurker

    WebLurker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2016

    Oh. I wasn't following spoilers, so I must've missed that. But the point is, this early in the game, I'm pretty sure any leaks, news, stuff cast and crew say, is designed to keep people guessing at best, and plain wrong at worst.
     
  19. Hopeless

    Hopeless Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2006
    Any chance since Rey is clearly neither a Skywalker or Solo whoever set up the poll can expand it to include Random?:D
     
  20. darthweevil

    darthweevil Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2016
    I managed to self-spoil Vader being Luke’s father about half an hour before going into the cinema to see TESB for the first time. I instantly vehemently hated that idea, but in time I learnt to deal with it.

    I think it explains why Ben wore the mask. He was not radicalised instantly, he was slowly turned by Snoke over time. Clean-cut good guy by day, vigilante by night, he needed a way to protect his identity when he was acting up.

    This also makes sense in terms of Snoke investing his energy into Kylo when young Rey arrives and is suddenly a threat that must be gotten rid of.

    It may not be very palatable, but the “Rey being Luke’s daughter, Kylo set to kill her but being unable to do the deed kidnaps her and drops her on Jakku instead” theory very neatly ties up a hell of a lot of the threads in the film:

    Why was she left there?
    Why was the Falcon there?
    Why can’t she remember anything previously?
    Why does Kylo seem to react so furiously when she is mentioned?
    Why is Luke on the verge of tears when he sees her?
    It fits with the force vision of Kylo protecting her from being killed.
    It fits Kylo’s broader story arc of being so conflicted between light and dark.
    It fits Kathleen Kennedy saying the films are about the Skywalker family.
    It fits Daisy Ridley saying the film makes it obvious who Rey’s parents are.

    The theory could be completely wrong. But it's a very simple answer that gives very coherent and straightforward answers to a bunch of different questions.
     
  21. WebLurker

    WebLurker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2016
    Fair enough.

    I thought Kylo wore the mask to emulate Darth Vader.

    The First Order people don't seem to take an interest in her until after the Takodana scenes, and Snoke was investing energy into Kylo long before that.

    That we have yet to answer, but the novelizations do establish that it was family or guardians planning to come back for her, which are a big problem for this theory.


    Since it was stolen by a chain of thieves, I think that was actually just happenstance.

    Rey was really little when it happened.

    It could be just him being mad that there's another person out there foiling him.

    I think it's a little too early to guess what he was thinking in that scene.

    I'm not so sure that was something Rey had experienced in the past; I actually thought she was seeing an event she wasn't present for.

    Maybe.

    Hmm.

    Okay, I'll have to keep that in mind next viewing. However, her being Luke's kid (as much as I like the idea) seems a little too obvious. Also, a lot of the pre TFA books would've mentioned if Luke had a kid, right?

    I honestly feel that it adds several layers of complexity, but we'll have to wait and see what they pull out for the next movie.
     
  22. darthweevil

    darthweevil Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2016
    Again sorry mistakenly thought it was a discussion, not just disagreeing with every single point just for the sake of it.
     
  23. S73

    S73 Jedi Master

    Registered:
    Dec 21, 2014
    I think Rey has some Kenobi bloodline to her.

    I say this because the lightsaber calls to her, OBK had it in his possession for years & then gave it to Luke & now Rey wants to give it back (coming full circle).
    Plus the OBK voice in the vision sequence
    She's kind of a hermit
    The whole full circle thing of Luke being trained by Obi, now Rey being trained by Luke
    The English accents
    The Jedi mind trick to the stormtrooper
    The "poking" around Starkiller base like Obi was "poking around the Death Star.

    I feel JJ Abrams was somewhat ridiculed for al the parallels he designed between ANH & TFA & people said it was a "safe" movie but...maybe it was necessary to set up the last 2?

    JMO.
     
  24. MeBeJedi

    MeBeJedi Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    May 30, 2002
    Possible, but if so, I'd wager he wasn't aware of her until she met up with Han who, I imagine, he would have been more likely to keep tabs on. Vader didn't notice anything special about Luke until Ben talked to him in the DS trench run. "The Force is strong with this one."
     
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  25. darthweevil

    darthweevil Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2016
    I can’t really see how she can be anything other than a Skywalker, Solo or Kenobi. Just does not fit with the whole "family drama" that Star Wars is and with what the cast and crew have said.
     
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