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Lit Rooting for the Empire (or certain Imperials)- why?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Iron_lord, Feb 1, 2013.

  1. Antlers

    Antlers Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2012
    Oh, I love Impies, but my interest in them didn't blossom until reading The Thrawn Trilogy.
    Love of boots, English gents, and uniforms aside, I found them fascinating in the EU because you never know what might happen to them. Luke, Leia, Han? They're gonna' be fine. You are not invested in them because they're our heroes - they are not going to die (not for a long while, anyway).

    However, you are always at the edge of your seat with the Imperials. They could collapse, become injured, or die at any sentence. Their struggles, desires, and actions seem more genuine. They just feel a little more real.
     
    RebelJoseWales likes this.
  2. Likewater

    Likewater Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 31, 2009
    So you would love a star wars novel written by Harry Turtledove like his Darkness series?
     
    DarkEagle likes this.
  3. MercenaryAce

    MercenaryAce Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 10, 2005
    I had a similar though myself, though you found a much better way to say it.

    I've noticed the more black and white a story is, the stronger the attempts to switch black and white in the fandom - the greater the intellectual challenge, the more fun it is.


    He killed people 1/3 of his own population. He had people tortured to death for wearing glasses. I doubt there is anything in Cambodian history that can justify that.

    Plus, I have to disagree - even if old kings were theoretically absolute, in practice they had all kinds of limitations due to competing factions and the sheer impracticality of enforcing all their stupid rules with the methods of communication they had available.
     
  4. Likewater

    Likewater Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 31, 2009
    And modern dictators have no practical limitation?

    They don't have internal party politics? Rivials, or more powerful orginizations they are beholden to?

    Yes due to media they reach more of their population to easier whip them into a frenzy, but how long does that last? Do you think the lastest member of the Kim Dynasty in North Korea could rule without his generals? Or the North Korean communist party?
     
  5. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    It's like Jello is somehow trolling this thread by not posting.
     
  6. RebelJoseWales

    RebelJoseWales Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 10, 2008
    At this point, I'm starting to worry that he's been in an accident or something.
     
  7. The_Phantom_Calamari

    The_Phantom_Calamari Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Who wouldn't want to be Palpatine's mind-controlled meat puppet for all eternity?

    Beats having to go to work.
     
  8. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    I tried my best to get him here :p
     
  9. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    It just seems odd that you would invoke facts about the Republic having Star Destroyers when we had no clue they did back when these films first arrvied. Thus there was no reason for anyone to think that an Imperial Star Destroyer would have had anything to do with the Republic.

    Edit: Oops, didn't realize I double posted here. My apologies.
     
  10. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    To be fair to rumsmuggler I can see why someone might have thought that a "Star Destroyer" was a neutral thing and that the reason they were specifically identified as Imperial ones was because there could also have been Republic ones.
     
  11. MercenaryAce

    MercenaryAce Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 10, 2005
    Which I think might be the reason the Sepies don't get nearly the amount of support that the Empire does - the clones and their walkers and star destroyers are cooler than battle droids, hover tanks, and doughnut battleships.
     
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  12. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Well naturally, wouldn't you rather be invaded by those cool looking triangles instead of having to look at one of those stupid looking doughnuts above your city? :p
     
  13. rumsmuggler

    rumsmuggler Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 31, 2000
    They are facts since we know now that they did have star destroyers before the empire was declared. If I said it in the films board it would be odd, but not here. Also if your age is correct, then you were three years old at the most when star wars came out , so there isn't much of an age gap between us for you to pull star wars superiority on me. :)
     
  14. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    I'm not pulling any superiority on you, just trying to understand why you would make such a statement. It seemed to me like you were trying to say people shouldn't be Imperial fans of the due to them having Star Destroyers because, in timeline terms someone else had them first. That didn't make sense to me.

    The question at hand is why do some people root for the Empire. A lot of people do because of the cool tech we were introduced to in the OT, back when the only people we knew with Star Destroyers were the Empire. What we know now isn't that relevent, at least in my case, to the reason I first became a fan of the Empire. I can't really turn back the clock to 1978 and insert prequel information into the scenario.

    Canonically speaking the Sith cruisers(at least the one Nihilus was commanding) from KotOR also dead ringers for Star Destroyers, thousands of years before the Republic was around. So they had them first anyway. :p
     
  15. rumsmuggler

    rumsmuggler Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 31, 2000
    I'm well aware of what the question was and I gave my answer in an earlier post.
     
  16. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    This isn't a debate about timelines, continuity and canon though. Thus my confusion.

    My apologies. I was not trying to start a fight with you.
     
  17. rumsmuggler

    rumsmuggler Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 31, 2000
    No worries. I wasn't trying to start one either.
     
  18. Darth_Garak

    Darth_Garak Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2005
    Really, page 5 and no Jello? Or does he think it would be redundant to post here?

    And yes I like all the cool tech the Empire has. I also find it silly to think of every person in it as evil so a lot of them must have had a good reason to join up. The Empire did have proper peace keeping missions as well (see the Ripoblus and whats-their-name conflict in TIE fighter). I admit that I want some novels centered on the Empire - the Fel and Sunber arcs in the comics were awesome.
     
  19. cthugha

    cthugha Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Also we rarely get a believable Separatist perspective in canon, whereas the EU basically began with an Imperial perspective. (Of course this also might have sthg to do with the fact that the Separatists are usually presented as Palps' puppets and nothing more.)

    Which is another reason why we need that Count Dooku novel, like, right now.
     
  20. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Possibly he's said all he has to say the numerous times the topic's come up in the past.

    For example:

    http://boards.theforce.net/threads/...cus-on-the-most.27969440/page-4#post-27973428

     
  21. fett 4

    fett 4 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2000
    He wasn't replaced, it was because a young religious fanatic refused his offer of Palpatines help and instead persuaded his Intern to throw him down a reactor shaft :)
     
  22. Mechalich

    Mechalich Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Even when we do get a believable Separatist perspective (other than Grievous anyway), and there are some in TCW and other places, it is generally rather clear that the Separatists simply aren't very good at this whole 'warfare' thing. That is ultimately as it should be, since the CIS is essentially a group of corporations trying to buy their way to victory rather than fight.
     
  23. MercenaryAce

    MercenaryAce Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 10, 2005
    I too find the lack of Jello disturbing.

    Because there is always room for Jello.

    Well that, as well as a handful of political idealists and a gaggle of pyschopaths for hire - neither of which are that skilled militarily.

    You know, people often complain about the stupid tactics seen in the Clone Wars, but it kind of makes sense when you look at who is actually leading both sides - only a handful of judicial and militia leaders have actual military experience, and even then that was on a much smaller scale. Real world militaries have certainly become complacent in less time.

    Heck, Star Wars in general features long stretches of peace between its major wars or groupings of wars, so it is pretty easy to see why Star Wars military doctrine is often very hidebound.
     
  24. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Lords, ladies, citizens, and droids: why do we support the Empire?

    In short, we do so because it is the right thing to do. Our Emperor courageously risked his life to save the galaxy from slavery at the hand of alien corporatists during the Clone Wars. In due gratitude, we vested him with the imperial dignity and pledged him our eternal fealty.

    Why do we oppose neo-Separatists? Because they seek to fan the flames of division for their own petty gain, at the sacrifice of the public good.

    Why do we oppose the Jedi? Because they sought to overthrow the Senate and depose the Chancellor when their unaccountability and power was challenged.

    Why do we oppose the Rebellion? Because their leaders, jealous of our Emperor, steal from us and ours in order to aggandize greater power to themselves.

    Why do we support the Emperor? Because without his beneficence, civilization would falter, fall, and flounder.

    Vivat imperator in aeternum. Fidemus in nostro principe nunc, in futurum, et in perpetuo.
     
  25. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    Ah, he was just biding his time for a grand entrance. Bravo, Jello!