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RotS scenes - Dialogue or Silence?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Lady_Misty, Jan 17, 2013.

  1. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007
    In the novelization/original concepts of Revenge of the Sith just before he dies Dooku basically begs for his life. Sidious/Palpatine then more or less says that he changed his mind about hasking for Dooku's life to be spared.

    The other scene is when Vader kills the Separatist Council. At least in the novelization he spoke to them with dark humor: "we were promised a handsome reward!." "I am your reward; you don't me handsome?" And " . . . we were told that we would be left in peace!" " The transmission was garbled. He said left in pieces."

    From what I remember Christopher Lee stated that he didn't feel that it was in Dooku's character to beg for his life and George agreed.

    I can understand if there was dialogue in the destruction of the Separatist Council why it was cut.

    My question is would those scenes been better with dialogue or are they fine the way they are? Does the silence give something or take something away?

    Are there scenes that are not here from RotS that in your opinion could have been silent or had dialogue to enhance it?
     
  2. Juliet316

    Juliet316 Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    WDTASWITJCC
     
  3. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Sometimes silence is golden, especially in Dooku's beheading scene.
     
  4. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 29, 2000
    Yeah, can't say I feel particularly pleased by the dialogue when Vader murders the Seppers in the novel. The film version, where Vader simply does not speak, is great. Wish it wasn't edited together with Sidious' speech (yes, I know it's a Godfather nod :p ) ; Vader simply coming in, dropping the blast doors, and proceeding to silently kill the entire Sep council is far and away as close to OT Vader as we get in ROTS.
     
  5. mes520

    mes520 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    I didn't like the part with Dooku begging so agreed there, but the dialogue with Vader and Separatists I wish they had kept
     
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  6. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Silence. Right there you mentioned two reasons for why I don't like the RotS novelization.
     
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  7. Ambervikings91

    Ambervikings91 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 1, 2012
    yep
     
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  8. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Dooku begged Palpatine for his life, which I could tolerate better than his begging Anakin, but still...silence is golden.
     
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  9. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    silence

    1)having Dooku beg and having Anakin still kill him would have made him sith like too early in the movie

    he was hot headed, and impulsive, but killing an old man begging for his life?

    wouldn't suit his character that early in the film especially since he acts heroic like saving obi-wan moments later


    2) not having Anakin realise that Palps is a sith at that point if Dooku was begging him to be kept alive would have been moronic beyond words
     
  10. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    3) Dooku wouldn't beg for his life.

    4) The dialogue during the Separatist Council massacre is idiotic and doesn't fit the mood of the characters and scene.
     
  11. Billy_Dee_Binks

    Billy_Dee_Binks Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 29, 2002
    5) "garbled"

    I'm especially thankful that the Separatist Council massacre turned out the way it did in the film. I've heard of that "handsome" dialogue exchange before, but never thought it was ever meant to be taken seriously/ end up in the film. It's comes off as too playful, maybe not for pre-Order 66 Anakin, but certainly for where Anakin's mindset was at that point.

    That being said, I would like to see Dooku's cut line as he ignites his saber to fight Anakin and Obi Wan reinserted. The shot was completed and part of the ROTS video game cut scene.
     
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  12. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007
    The dialogue with Anakin/Vader and the Separatists is macabre in a way. They are terrified and he mocks them as he strikes them down.

    And people are right that the scene doesn't fit Anakin/Vader at that time. I can see Anakin saying things along those lines before RotS but then and in that context? No.

    In a way the silence on Anakin/Vader's part works very well. It shows that he's fallen further and you can get a sense of their fear. They are being cut down by someone they expected to reward them and he doesn't offer a single explanation as to why he's killing them.

    Keeping Anakin/Vader's hood up added further to all of it.



    Dooku's face spoke volumes when Palpatine/Sidious gave Anakin the order to kill Dooku. Dooku was floored that his Master was ordering his death. It also might have dawned on him that he had been used like he had kused others to achieve his goals.
     
  13. Frank T.

    Frank T. Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Are you lost, little girl?

    And to the OP: I love the ROTS novel but you've found two scenes I think were better in the film. And I can't think of any dialogue in the movie that I would remove or add at the moment. Maybe change some lines. Maybe not. I'd have a more interesting answer if we were talking AOTC.
     
  14. Lars_Muul

    Lars_Muul Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 2, 2000
    I wish there'd been more dialogue in the scene with Anakin's nightmare. Something like "Man, that was scary. I gotta go cool off for a moment". As he walks away, Padmé turns around and goes "Where's he going?"
    Cue "The Days of our Lives".





    "Hold me"
    /LM
     
  15. EHT

    EHT New Films Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    The way the movie did it in both instances is much better IMO... one of the reasons I prefer the movie. Dooku begging for his life would have looked silly and weak... his look of shock when Palpatine told Anakin to kill him was all he needed to "say". And those lines when Anakin was killing the separatists on Mustafar were really cheesy... I still remember sighing and rolling my eyes when I read those parts.
     
  16. Juliet316

    Juliet316 Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    A mod must have redirected this thread because it was in the JCC when I commented.
     
  17. Frank T.

    Frank T. Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    sure it was:p
     
  18. Count Yubnub

    Count Yubnub Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2012
    Was the Separatist council massacre dialogue part of the script at any point, or did the author of the book invent it?
     
  19. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007
    No idea, It might have been but discarded early on.
     
  20. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2012
    Normally, it's the other way around when books can describe more without excessive dialouge, and movies have to rely on dialouge to explain a plot point. The fact that Revenge of the Sith can create powerful scenes with minimal dialouge is a testimate to the directing and acting.

    Dooku could have very well revealed much more in addition to pleading for his life, but the fact remains that he was defeated. At the moment he realized the Sith had betrayed him, there was nothing he could do.

    The Separatist massacre seemed to have gotten darker and darker as the film was finalized. No goofy dialouge, just Vader demonstrating his merciless assassin skills that gained him infamy in the OT. Now, I realize that the scehe was greatly toned down in terms of violence, but at least we get the picture with what's been given.
     
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  21. Cryogenic

    Cryogenic Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2005
    If there's a way to say something without words, George Lucas seems to find that way.
     
  22. TheRevanchist

    TheRevanchist Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 13, 2012
    Dooku begging for his life should have never happened. It would have been out of his character.

    Anakin saying that "I am your reward; you don't me handsome?" And " . . . we were told that we would be left in peace!" " The transmission was garbled. He said left in pieces" wouldn't have been right because in those moments Anakin had great anger and hate after what he has done, so it would have been stupid if he was joking.

    What I think should have been in the mobies:
    1) Extended scenes and things with four Masters going to arrest/assassinate Palps. That is Fistu saying that he would have felt more comfortable if Yoda or Kenobi would have been with them. And then Palps saying to "Master Tiin you are telepathic..." and then attacking with surprise and killing the two first Masters. That would have been much better than the way it was in the movie when Tiin, Kolar and Fistu looked like they had never used a lightsaber.
    2) Anakin saying "Don't make me destroy Obi-Wan, You're no match for the power of the Dark Side". And Kenobi replying "I have heard that before, but I have never though I'd hear it from you". Those 2 lines of dialogue for me were the best in the entire fight but they were cut.
    3) The process of Anakin transforming into Vader was much better in the novel than in the movies when it looked like Annie just in a second decided to became evil.