Satanism

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Cobranaconda, May 5, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Cobranaconda Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2004
    star 7
    This is a big topic, and I don't see anyone posting about, so here it is.
    I know that America is a country which is almost entirely Christian, and any other religion is frowned upon. I know of only 3 Americans that are not Christian, and they are Muhummhad Ali, Glen Benton(Lead singer of Deicide) and Marilyn Manson.

    I know that you mods will probably lock this before t's even posted, but please can you read it all before locking it, as it should be a discussion, as long as the Pope doesn't visit these boards in the near future.

    I am extremely tolerant of any religion, and being an atheist gives me a certain perspecive on religions that other people can't see because they are forbidden to look at other religions teachings. However, everyone in every religion seems to look down on Satanism.


    Most religions that I know of however, say that the Devil was an angel until he got annoyed with god or Allah, and then he got kicked out of heaven and shoved into hell.

    So why can't you show him mercy? In the Qu'ran, he is on a mission from Allah to tempt and try to sway the beliefs of the Muslim people.

    But people always think Satanists want to kill people and burn churches. Mainly (excluding the Norwegians and Glen Benton) all they do is have fun. And eat, get drunk, and smoke their heads off.

    So is there anyone else that feels sympathy for them, as they are possibly the most despised people on earth to the Christians.
  2. malkieD2 Ex-Manager and RSA

    Member Since:
    Jun 7, 2002
    star 7
    Deciding on a religion is your own choice, why would you feel sympathy for them ?

    I like your post, but my concern would be that the majority of satanists tend to worship the darker things associated with the devil, rather than how he came to be.
  3. Vezner Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2001
    star 5
    I know that America is a country which is almost entirely Christian, and any other religion is frowned upon. I know of only 3 Americans that are not Christian, and they are Muhummhad Ali, Glen Benton(Lead singer of Deicide) and Marilyn Manson.

    Which America are you living in? Now days I would dare say that Christianity is more frownd upon than other religions. All you hear about in the news is how Nativity scenes are banned where Jewish or Muslim symbols are allowed, how Athiests want public crosses to be taken down, and etc etc etc.

    As far as you only knowing 3 Americans that aren't Christian, you must not know too many Americans. ;) I know a dozen people personally that are not Christian. They are Muslim, Jews, Buddhist, and Athiest between them all. Granted, I do know a lot more people that are Christian (of varying Faiths) but there are still plenty of non-Christians around.
  4. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    If that's all you can name then obviously people's religious preference isn't something that you're conspicuously aware and you simply assume they're christian.
  5. Stackpole_The_Hobbit Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 6
    However, everyone in every religion seems to look down on Satanism.

    I don't understand them (to a greater point than any of the other religions) because they're a Christian religion (they use the Christian mythology), but they worship the other guy. It's just like if the majority worshiped Zeus, Athena, or Apollo, but then there was a relatively small sect that worshipped Hades.

    And yet they're not Christian ...

    EDIT: Satanism info click here

    Also, Americans who aren't Christian ...
    Myself
    Jon Stewart
    Sully Erna (vocalist from Godsmack)
    Al Franken
    Woody Allen
    Cat Stevens
    Tom Cruise
    John Travolta

    Just to name a few.
  6. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    First off, from a Christian standpoint, Satan doesn't want mercy. Satan truly doesn't believe he's done anything wrong, but that God acted unfairly towards him. If Satan asked God for forgiveness, it would be granted, but Satan won't do that, because he believes God is the one owing the apology.

    As for Satanism, the problem is, well, they've been seduced by Satan. They give themselves over to earthly pleasures and forsake the spirit. For me, as a Christian, I don't necessarily look down on them (though I'd be less likely to trust a Satanist as a general rule, probably), but I do feel sorry for them. Once their relatively short time here is over, they're going to have to pay the piper for all the "big fun" they had here.

    M. Scott
  7. BLACKJEBUS Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 9, 2002
    star 4
    I read many books on religion, and there was one book (I really wish I remembered which one it was) that was written by a Catholic nun, I believe.

    Anyways, the author of this book I read described a part of an Arab mythology that says that Satan was cast out from heaven because he too loyal to God. This legend says that when God created mankind, he commanded all his angels to bow down to his new creation. Satan refused because he would bow down only to God himself. This angered God so he exiled Satan from the heavenly realms.

    Like I said, I only saw this story described in this one place, but I think it is an interesting take on the story of Satan - it doesn't make him evil, only a rebel of sorts who still has the utmost respect for God.
  8. The_Fireman Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 2001
    star 4
    Sounds like the Koran version, except in that, Satan wouldn't bow down to man because he thought he and the angels were much higher than man, and thought God was foolish for requesting it of him.

    Which is basically the same, except in this version, Satan was proud, and out of spite didn't do it, whereas in yours it sounds like it was more of a positive spin on it, where he only wanted to worship God.
  9. BLACKJEBUS Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 9, 2002
    star 4
    Do you happen to know where this can be found in the Koran?

    I own an English translation of it, but I'm having a heck of a time trying to get through it. I thought the Christian Bible was a difficult read, but the Koran is even more tedious and repetitive. I think a lot of those parts are intended to be read aloud as a chant or song, but I could be mistaken.

    Anyways, I went way off topic. I was wondering where I could find a reference to the fall of Satan in the Koran?
  10. The_Fireman Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 2001
    star 4
    Wish I could tell ya... I heard about it being in there from a few other people, but never actually read it myself. Sorry. :(
  11. Darth_Asabrush Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2000
    star 5
    What irks me is the confusion of many people between Satanism (stemming from the Christian faith) and Paganism (stemming from a faith far older than Christianity).

    These are two wholey different belief systems.

    As for the question. I wouldn't pity a sane otherwise generally intelligent person for choosing Satanism over other religions as long as they took their faith seriously. I tend to get the impression that there are plenty of "quasi-satanists" out there that like the tag or kudos of devil worship. I pity these fools.

    By stating that one doesn't know many compatriots that are of a certain faith or religion assumes that one is making a judgement on.....what? I don't know!

    I know hundreds of people. I'm aware of hundreds more "celebrities" but I wouldn't have a clue what religion most belonged to (except The Royal Family and the family of the Prime Minister). I'm sure the author of this thread knows many more non-Christian "American" people and I assume he/she is assumming too much.

    (Hope that last paragraph made sense).

  12. Darth_Malignent Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2003
    star 2
    Satan was cast out of heaven because he didn't want to bow to adam.. He was, like some other angels, assured by god before adam was created that they we're the supreme beings of his creation.. God said that the angels only bow to God and no one else until he created Adam and changed the rules.. And that was why Satan or lucifer was cast out of heaven along with his followers.. In fact Satan isn't the big grim monster you normally would see.. He's the most beatifull of all angels.. This is what I got out of reading the dead sea scrolls (i think it's called).. Anyway.. The scrolls I'm talking about weren't added to the bible.. Satanist are not people who cut themselves or in other ways worship satan.. They worship human nature.. To follow ones lusts and so on.. While God forbids you to be lustfull and so on.. My poin through all this is that many people have the wrong impression af satanist.. I'm undecided when comes to religion.. I beleive that there's something up there but if it is a God or what it is.. I don't know and I refuse to let myself be persuaded toi think that there is some all-knowing creature controlling me.. I don't like the fact that my path is already lain.. Destiny, that's what I don't like..
  13. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    Just because God knows what you're going to do doesn't mean He forces you to do it.

    Also, just because you don't like something can't make it untrue.

    M. Scott
  14. Darth_Malignent Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2003
    star 2
    Of course not.. It was merely a way of justifying my belief or disbelief in god.. I don't like the idea that he controls my life and and I do not see what all that forgive me father for i have sined thing is about... Sin is not fun committing until it is prohibited... It was my way of showing why I don't beleive in the Christian god..
  15. The_Fireman Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 2001
    star 4
    In other words, you don't believe in Him because you don't want to believe in Him.

    With respect, how on earth is that any way to live your life? There ARE absolutes out there. To deny that is foolishness. When faced with one, or a good amount of evidence of one, it's not logical to say, "I don't like it, and since there aren't absolutes, I don't have to believe in it", and then shrug it off. That's essentially living a lie.
  16. Darth_Malignent Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2003
    star 2
    From your point of view, yes... But I don't see any proof that he or it exists.. There's no substantial proof that says: God exists.. And not regarding satan as well... I didn't say I was an Satanist.. I'm more of an atheist.. But I understand satanists... As well as christians and other beleivers of any religion..
  17. Devilanse Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2002
    star 5
    As for Satanism, the problem is, well, they've been seduced by Satan. They give themselves over to earthly pleasures and forsake the spirit.

    You're joking, right? Seduced by Satan? For one thing...true satanism is not the worship of Satan. Its not a religion...its a philosophy. Most people who say they are satanists....aren't.

    For me, as a Christian, I don't necessarily look down on them (though I'd be less likely to trust a Satanist as a general rule, probably), but I do feel sorry for them.

    Thats cool. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. There are very few christians I trust, or feel sorry for. Does that mean I'm seduced by Satan?

    No...it doesn't.
  18. Darth Mulacki Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 1999
    star 5
    Malignent, you are what is called an Agnostic. IIRC an agnostic only believes what he has seen or experinced himself.
    Most people these days are agnostic, that's the effect of science.


    Satanists are just another form of religion, for better or for worse. I have nothing against satanist, as long as they dont kill to enforce or to act on their religion, just like christians or muslims are okay as long as they dont try to force their views on others.
  19. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    As for Satanism, the problem is, well, they've been seduced by Satan. They give themselves over to earthly pleasures and forsake the spirit.

    You're joking, right? Seduced by Satan? For one thing...true satanism is not the worship of Satan. Its not a religion...its a philosophy. Most people who say they are satanists....aren't.


    I know. But they call themselves Satanists because they follow what he wants them to do. Like I said, they forsake the spirit in favor of fleeting earthly pleasures. Just because they don't worship him doesn't mean they're not doing exactly what he wants them to do.

    M. Scott
  20. Katana_Geldar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2003
    star 8
    What irks me is the confusion of many people between Satanism and Paganism.

    *claps bows and cheers* :D

    thankyou for making that point! as a practicing pagan satan is in now way part of my religion.

    what i have read of satanism, particularly its leader named LaVey who has a church of satan in san francsico.

    his daughter, who looks like a cute little cherub, follows her dad'ss beliefs.

    what disturbed me most about his religious practices was the use of women, rather misuse. Satanists have a living altar that is a woman and practice their rights on her. I'm not sure of the actual specifics but i'm really not interested.

    You could say that Satanism is a perversion of the Christian church led by people who were not statisifed it. I am pagan and the Christian didn't satisfy me spiritually, but that's another story.

    BTW alistiar crowley, while he may be slightly touched, is not a satanist
  21. MaceWinducannotdie Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2001
    star 4
    First, allow me (a hardcore atheist, thank you) to say I'm just waiting for someone to say "I'm not religious, I'm spiritual" so I can have a good long laugh.

    I know of only 3 Americans that are not Christian, and they are Muhummhad Ali, Glen Benton(Lead singer of Deicide) and Marilyn Manson.

    I'd heard Marilyn Manson was actually a practicing Christian. I can believe it, as his stage persona really seems to be a ridiculous image designed to get the money of a bunch of goth kids.

    Which America are you living in? Now days I would dare say that Christianity is more frownd upon than other religions. All you hear about in the news is how Nativity scenes are banned where Jewish or Muslim symbols are allowed, how Athiests want public crosses to be taken down, and etc etc etc.

    What America am I living in? I guess I'm living in the real America and not in some right-wing think tank/cult/militia/news network. You know, the America where most profess to be Christians, and the president and attorney general are fundamentalist ones at that. Where Congress mandated that we have to have the 10 commandments posted in school (Imagine if this was in time to prevent Columbine. "Oh, thou shalt not kill." And yes, I stole that joke from somewhere, but I can't remember the source.)
  22. darth_paul Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2000
    star 5
    I had always assumed purely based on the name that satanism was, in fact, the worship of Satan. If it's not; if it is, in fact, the following of one's natural desires -- what is the difference between satanism and hedonism?

    -Paul
  23. Katana_Geldar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2003
    star 8
    here's your dictionary

    Sa·tan·ism (stn-zm)
    n.
    The worship of Satan characterized by a travesty of the Christian rites.
    satanism Profound wickedness.

    he·don·ism
    n.
    Pursuit of or devotion to pleasure, especially to the pleasures of the senses.
    Philosophy. The ethical doctrine holding that only what is pleasant or has pleasant consequences is intrinsically good.
    Psychology. The doctrine holding that behavior is motivated by the desire for pleasure and the avoidance of pain.

    you see, there is a difference. Alistair crowley could be described as a hedonist. So could an epicurian.
  24. darth_paul Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2000
    star 5
    Well, those definitions are pretty much what I thought.... But that doesn't jive with
    You're joking, right? Seduced by Satan? For one thing...true satanism is not the worship of Satan. Its not a religion...its a philosophy.

    -Paul
  25. Katana_Geldar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2003
    star 8
    paul, you should tell that to LaVey

    he's the big guy of satainsm, i dunno what that i but to him it is a religion

    you may as well say chrstianity is a philosophy on that note, not that it is of course
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.