Satanism

Somebody said earlier that Satanism was acceptable. It sure as hell isn't acceptable in my school district -- you'll get sent home for wearing Satanic paraphernalia, according to the student code of conduct.

I personally think Satanists need to get a life, but if they want to do that and don't harm anyone else by doing so, then why shouldn't they be allowed to? People, as you said, don't get sent home for wearing crosses, the Star of David, the Islamic crest, or an om, so why should they get sent home for wearing shirts with pentagrams on them?

Remember for a moment that I live in Texas, and draw your own conclusions.

 

I blame the extremists!

But then when you look at the world of today, there are more people, (even though they are so called true to their religion) are more like those of the said 'evil'. They go to their churchs etc, ask forgiveness and everythings alright, because all of their sins god, or gods have forgiven them for. So they are allowed to give into temptations solong as they confess etc!

 

I personally think Satanists need to get a life, but if they want to do that and don't harm anyone else by doing so, then why shouldn't they be allowed to? People, as you said, don't get sent home for wearing crosses, the Star of David, the Islamic crest, or an om, so why should they get sent home for wearing shirts with pentagrams on them?


Because it is politically incorrect, that's why. From what I have seen of America politcal correctness has gone riot there.

speaking of extremism, though this is not extremist just showing how the church needs to set it's house in order.

according to the church communion wafers have to have gluten in them, more and more people now are becoiming alergic to gluten. Unfortunately gluten-free communion wafers are not the same thing.

The story of communion wafers[\link]

Another story

Yet another reason why the chursh is losing people, not the media or music or people like Marilyn Manson. It's becoming too stationary for anyone to relate to!

(BTW if you wish to discuss this little rant with me, PM me and not use this thread. I don't want to be resposible for a lock. Mods if you object you can edit it out)

As for the gluten does it really matter? In wicca it doesn't matter if you don't have all the m,aterial, as long as your intentions about what you are doing is there.

 

As others have said, Satanism is a misleading concept. It originally just meant Anti-Christian, but now has all these Devil connotations. All a bit ridiculous.

When are people going to figure out that good and evil don't exist? It's dangerous to walk around and start pointing at groups saying 'you're evil' purely because they don't think in the same way.

 

When are people going to figure out that good and evil don't exist? It's dangerous to walk around and start pointing at groups saying 'you're evil' purely because they don't think in the same way

i agree with you, somewhat. good and evil do exist, but it is a flawed concept. nothing is completely ever black and white, like yin and yang.

good and evil is inside us, it depends on the choices we make. and saying someone else is evil because they don't believe what you do is not just dangerous its intolerant

 

Somebody said earlier that Satanism was acceptable. It sure as hell isn't acceptable in my school district -- you'll get sent home for wearing Satanic paraphernalia, according to the student code of conduct.

Oh, that could be, yes. Hmm I wasn't referring to being 'acceptable' by governing bodies. I meant normal people, you know? Like, if you're walking down the street, and see someone with some Satanic symbol, or they have a Harry Potter toy wand, you wouldn't step away from them. Codes of conduct apply to shirts with profanity on them. But just because that code is there, at a school setting or having to wear a business suit to work, doean't mean that people, on an everyday personal level, are so limiting.

G-D

 

i agree with you, somewhat. good and evil do exist, but it is a flawed concept. nothing is completely ever black and white, like yin and yang.

good and evil is inside us, it depends on the choices we make. and saying someone else is evil because they don't believe what you do is not just dangerous its intolerant

So the only evil is believing in evil? I see.

 

So the only evil is believing in evil? I see.

not really, the only evil is what you find within yourself. people, like fundamentalist christians, go around saying that they are good and everyone else is bad when we really are all as bad as each other.

not that i am a believer in the original sin, or that i think people are naturally bad. we are all human, we make choices.

GrandDesigner, that's just political correctness

 

not really, the only evil is what you find within yourself. people, like fundamentalist christians, go around saying that they are good and everyone else is bad when we really are all as bad as each other.

That is bullcrap and you know it. Most Christians recognize that we are ALL equally sinful and in need of a Savior. You admitted you realize this fact by mentioning original sin, a Christian concept.

I think fundamental Wiccans are the real problem, stirring up dissention between Christians and everyone else.

 

That is bullcrap and you know it. Most Christians recognize that we are ALL equally sinful and in need of a Savior. You admitted you realize this fact by mentioning original sin, a Christian concept.


"You are focusing on the negative", that's my take on CHristianity's view of humanity. They spend so much time saying how bad people are and bad the things that we do that nothing else seems to get through. Yes, they do look on the positive side of things once in a while, but i would rather enjoy life than worry about how can i make myself good if i am already born bad.


I think fundamental Wiccans are the real problem, stirring up dissention between Christians and everyone else.

fundamental wiccans? ANY religion can become fundamental i admit (even wicca), but we are NOT interested in stiring up dissention. Christians do enough of it one their own with their stance on gays and the celibacy of their clergy in some sects.

I am more interested in going on my own way and not interfereing at all with other religions, they have their way, i have mine. In wicca we say "our way is not the only way" and we do not seek to convert or impose our beliefs on others.

Fireman, i have had many arguments with you but i'd like to ask why are you in this thread? I am in here as Wicca has several similarties with Satanism concerning ritual.

i may be wrong but all you are doing in here as far as i can see is stiring up dissention.

personally, i would like an apology from the church for the burning times, but that's not going to happen

 

I am more interested in going on my own way and not interfereing at all with other religions, they have their way, i have mine.

Hah! Then why on God's green earth do you insist on hissing out some kind of attack or negative comment against Christians or Christianity in general in every single post of yours? It's immature and annoying, not to mention hypocritical, considering what you've just claimed here (and have claimed several times in the past).

In wicca we say "our way is not the only way" and we do not seek to convert or impose our beliefs on others.

Hah, hah! "Your way" is total acceptance of every viewpoint...except Christianity. And you most certainly do wish to impose those same views on everyone...Christians specifically.

Fireman, i have had many arguments with you but i'd like to ask why are you in this thread?

If you must know, I come to the Senate Floor solely for the discussion on religion, for the purpose of defending my faith and everything it encompasses from baseless attacks, simple misconceptions, and outright lies...exactly what my last post was meant to do.

i may be wrong but all you are doing in here as far as i can see is stiring up dissention.

No, you took care of that. I was merely responding.

 

Hah! Then why on God's green earth do you insist on hissing out some kind of attack or negative comment against Christians or Christianity in general in every single post of yours? It's immature and annoying, not to mention hypocritical, considering what you've just claimed here (and have claimed several times in the past).


You're generalising, just because i criticise some aspects of Christianity doesn't mean i attack it all the time. I am critical, i ask questions even in my own beleifs, i don't accept anything as face value. It comes from studying history.


Hah, hah! "Your way" is total acceptance of every viewpoint...except Christianity. And you most certainly do wish to impose those same views on everyone...Christians specifically.


My views are simply my views, just as your views are your views. I am not trying to change your mind, i am merely trying to show you what my opnion is. If you agree, fine we have something in common, if you don't, fine then we'll talk about something else.


If you must know, I come to the Senate Floor solely for the discussion on religion, for the purpose of defending my faith and everything it encompasses from baseless attacks, simple misconceptions, and outright lies...exactly what my last post was meant to do.


Don't you think I want to defend my faith too? I just don't go looking for trouble, and that is what you are doing.(I used to post in the Christianity threads, but since i became Pagan i haven't.)

If you really want to come in here and defend your faith, do it in a less angry, less patronising manner.


No, you took care of that. I was merely responding.

it takes two to start a fight i don't want this to get into an argument, we can discuss this without the need for building a fortress for out views and bombarding each other like this.

please calm down, anger is never a good answer

 

I'm not angry, I'm peeved.

Anyway, there's nothing more to say on this matter. Not right now, anyway. Good day.

 

not really, the only evil is what you find within yourself. people, like fundamentalist christians, go around saying that they are good and everyone else is bad when we really are all as bad as each other.

not that i am a believer in the original sin, or that i think people are naturally bad. we are all human, we make choices.

Do you believe one choice is better than another? If so, then you believe in the concept of good and evil.

 

Do you believe one choice is better than another? If so, then you believe in the concept of good and evil.

i do beleive in the concept of good and evil, but it's isn't a black and white concept IMHO

 

i do beleive in the concept of good and evil, but it's isn't a black and white concept IMHO

Is there something wrong with believing it's a black and white concept?

 

Good and evil are merely concepts. In reality, the distinction is social and anti-social.

Believing that it is a black and white issue is, frankly, dangerous because it increases the likelihood of conflict between two people who disagree. Removing the grey means removing the middle ground.

Of course, religions seek to bend people to one perspective on issues, rooting out dissension and ultimately rewardly conformity, which is why they work so well, and why they're always doomed to fail.

Those familiar with history will know what I'm talking about... Christians, apparently representing the goodies, have done some terrible things, even 'evil' things. Heck, even their God is a murderer. So it clearly isn't a black and white issue.

 

Heck, even their God is a murderer.

False. For God to be a murderer, He would have to have an equal, and would have to take the life of said equal in cold-blood, said equal being innocent and unworthy of death.

God has no equal, and therefore is incapable of murder.

 

God has no equal, and therefore is incapable of murder.

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Hmm, how best to reply to this...?


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No... still can't think of a way. (within forums rules of course)

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Congratulations. I am speechless.

 

Good and evil are merely concepts. In reality, the distinction is social and anti-social.

Believing that it is a black and white issue is, frankly, dangerous because it increases the likelihood of conflict between two people who disagree. Removing the grey means removing the middle ground.

Of course, religions seek to bend people to one perspective on issues, rooting out dissension and ultimately rewardly conformity, which is why they work so well, and why they're always doomed to fail.

Those familiar with history will know what I'm talking about... Christians, apparently representing the goodies, have done some terrible things, even 'evil' things. Heck, even their God is a murderer. So it clearly isn't a black and white issue.

By your own beliefs, there is nothing wrong with conflict. You've simply made an arbitrary choice to support the social side instead of the anti-social side. Those on the anti-social side have simply made the opposite choice, and there's nothing wrong with that.

 

GrandDesigner, that's just political correctness

No, thats everyday people who are actually not influenced by material things. Errr...ok, so maybe there aren't too many like that and just those I seem to meet. But then again, I dont have a magic wand or dont wear symbolic apparel of any kind.

Maybe I should dress up as Satan and test that out. Yes?

G-D

 

God has no equal, and therefore is incapable of murder

What?!

God has no equal.

What about all of the other gods in other religions. I bet Vishnu would probably be able to bite your god's head off.

But, back to the topic.

Slayer Theory: Listening to Slayer is all well and good, but at least come up with a band that is more Satanic, like Venom, or if you want real Satanists, Gorgoroth.

Extremists: I wasn't aware of any Satanic Extremists, other than the church burners in Norway, or Glen Benton in the USA.

I Blame the Wiccans

For what? believing in what they believe instead of what you would want them to believe?
That is just purile. No matter how much you tell someone, there will always be one who objects, and the more you tell them, the less likely that they'll listen in the future.

And if you remember, it was the Christians Purge of Paganism that made the world as bad as it is today. So really, you're god is a murderer, for "Telling" the Christians to burn the Wiccans and Pagans.

 

God has no equal.

What about all of the other gods in other religions.

What about them? They're fake. Yahweh is the only living God.

I Blame the Wiccans

For what? believing in what they believe instead of what you would want them to believe?

Don't be foolish. I was talking specifically to Katana regarding our discussion on Christians causing problems here on the boards.

And if you remember, it was the Christians Purge of Paganism that made the world as bad as it is today. So really, you're god is a murderer, for "Telling" the Christians to burn the Wiccans and Pagans.

Even if He DID tell them that (which I don't believe He did), He wouldn't be a murderer. For God to kill humans is perfectly fine. Now, if there were another living God, that God was innocent, and Yahweh took His life in cold blood, THEN He would be a murderer. But since God is the Creator of humans, He has sovereign authority over their lives.

 

But since God is the Creator of humans, He has sovereign authority over their lives.

how exactly does creating something give you sovereign authority over it?

do parents have sovereign authority over the lives of their children? can your father order you to become an accountant or a baker or whatever? can he kill you if you disobey?

my girlfriend and i once created an embryo. we decided to abort it. i'm fine with that, since i don't believe it was a person, but i gather you would not be, despite your claim that creating something gives you sovereign authority over it.

personally, i believe that all moral authority is necessarily derived from consent. as such, even if there were a God, i would feel no obligation to honor any claims he made as to moral authority over me.

do you have a good reason i should?

please note that fear of his wrath is not a reason. that just makes your God a bully and a tyrant.

also, please note that "He knows what's best for me" is also not a reason. "what's best for me" is entirely subjective and dependent upon my preferences and goals.

 

What about them? They're fake. Yahweh is the only living God.

Says you. Your only conviction that your God is real is based entirely upon FAITH. You have no evidence that he is any more real than any other god... ALL religions are based on faith... ALL believers in gods do so because of faith.

Why are you so special? Why is your faith in a Yahweh any more significant than a Hindu's in Vishnu? Or even for that matter... an ancient Greek's in Zeus, a Roman's in Jupiter, an Egyptian's in Isis? These gods had countless people of faith who believed in them, and so by your reasoning... either ALL gods are real... or ALL gods are fake.