School Uniforms-Yea or Nay?

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by JediOverlord, May 10, 2002.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Darkside_Spirit Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 3
    I was openminded on this issue for a long time (bear in mind that I actually have to wear one). However, I've come to the conclusion that uniform should be entirely done away with, simply because of the tension, conflict, and (on occasion) even physical injury it brings about. Kids who go to certain schools are identified by means of the uniform and picked on, by others who consider that they should not go to the said school. This is especially an issue in European countries, where there is still selective education (schools tiered by academic ability).

    Besides, the amount of time teachers devote to worrying about uniform is a ghastly waste of public money. It's maddening, listening to fascist staff ramble on day after day about how Ties Must Not Be Removed On The Journey Home, Blazers Must Be Worn At All Times, and similar claptrap (they have no more right to tell you what to do walking home than they have to tell you how to spend your weekends).
  2. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
    This gets a big fat NAY from me.
  3. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    I say nay. Everything that has been said against uniforms I agree with. Making a school wear uniforms would not increase creativity or diversity. And it sure as hell will not decrease bullying. A bully is a bully because of his home life not what happens in school. What a bully does in school reflects how he's brought up at home. It's a by-product if you will of a bully for a parent. Also I'd like to tell you that bullies pick on the weak, not the poor, not because of what skin color you are. Creativity and diversity come from being able to express oneself be it in the form of clothing the music you listen to, the art you make. If you take away that ability to express yourself then you've just got a bunch of robots lurking in school.

    America and Conformity do not go together since our society is built upon the right to express yourself. If you want conformity uniforms go to a private school or go to some place that likes having robots in their society.
  4. womberty Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2002
    star 4
    Are we teaching our kids how to think or how to grow up to be pretentious socialites?

    Neither. American schools seem to fail horribly at teaching students how to think. And the other students are the ones teaching our children to be pretentious. ("Why do I have to buy you those designer clothes?" "Because everyone else has them and I need them to be cool!") Individual expression? Please... It's almost always an expression of a desire to be part of a certain group, be it the in-crowd, the preppies, whatever.
  5. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Neither. American schools seem to fail horribly at teaching students how to think. And the other students are the ones teaching our children to be pretentious. ("Why do I have to buy you those designer clothes?" "Because everyone else has them and I need them to be cool!") Individual expression? Please... It's almost always an expression of a desire to be part of a certain group, be it the in-crowd, the preppies, whatever.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're referring to bullies, right? That peer pressure crap is just that, crap. I was asked to do many illicit things, did I do them? Nooooo.....why? Because stupid crap like drugs and wearing the best clothing is meaningless to me. And a lot of other kids at my former high school thought like that too. Uniforms will not solve the problem, it will just create new ones for people. And then what are we going to do? chain them to desks? Make them go to school 24/7 because they're not learning enough? Look, it's definetly not the students who are failing, it's the teachers who are failing the students. I should know, I didn't know that much about math until I had a teacher who got me interested. Same with various other teachers. Hell I probably know more than most people how to fix a press or for that matter run it. Oh also what they etach you in school nowadays is outdated and most of the times isn't needed to advance in society. Like Trig or Calc. You definetly don't need them if you're planning on doing physical work. All I'm saying is that there's more to this problem than what a kid wears. School uniforms aren't productive in solving it.
  6. Darth_Drunk Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2002
    star 1
    Expression? From a 12 year old? Are you kidding?

    I went to Catholic School for 12 years and had to wear a uniform. While I hated it then, I believe it was a good idea.

    Also, have you noticed that most of the kids are trying to look the same anyway? They all say it is "individualism" and I have to laugh.

    And, if the kids weren't so damned worried about "expressing" themselves via Tommy Hilfiger, they might do it via their school work.
  7. JediStocky Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 26, 2001
    star 3
    Mmm . . . school uniforms

    I think they should be cumpulsory for all girls between the ages of 16 and 30. I'm a strict authoriatarian, you see.


    I'm definitely with Duckman on this one. I went to a catholic high school and by God I wish I was back there. |:)
  8. Aralna Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2000
    star 4
    I have a friend who has a uniform, and she doesn't seem to mind, but personally, I'd hate it. My school is really big, and there isn't much of a dress code, as long as it's not revealing or offensive. I don't wear the designer clothes, and I've never been teased for it. All I was teased about was the fact I have no tan. And me, I laugh when people tease me, even if it's meant to hurt. It's not worth getting upset about. :)
  9. womberty Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2002
    star 4
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're referring to bullies, right?

    No ... I'm talking about the elitist additude of the "in" crowd, and the way that less popular people would do anything they can -- dress a certain way, talk a certain way, etc. And although peer pressure doesn't work on everyone, it does seem to affect a great number of young people. The popular peole don't have to be outright bullies to influence their peers. I'm not saying that uniforms solve the problem, but the idea that uniforms enforce pretentious behavior while the lack of them promotes individual expression is simply wrong.
  10. Obi_Wan_13 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2001
    star 2
    I don't express myself by dressing like all the popular people. I express myself by wearing jeans and in most cases a shirt with a Heavy Metal band on it.
  11. Darth_Drunk Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2002
    star 1
    As a matter of fact, I have an idea of a school uniform for all kids. A big, orange jump suit with your ID number on the chest. Plus the electronic ankle bracelets. Maybe even chain them together, that will help some of the wannabe ganstas perfect their "crip walk". (Somebody has to know what that is)
  12. HavocHound Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2000
    star 4
    >>On the other hand, this self-expression leads to a lot of trouble in school such as gang-symbols...<<

    A gang symbol is not a form of self-expression. It is an expression of groupthink.

    ~~~~~

    I think uniforms are fine as long as they're not formal. Formal wear always defies the standards of utilitarianism, and vice versa. Practicality and pragmatism take presidence over looking prim, proper, and prissy. No child, nor adult, nor human being (period), nor animal, nor plant, nor mineral, nor anyone/anything else should ever be made to wear a neck tie. The tie is the Noose of the System. It is a symbol of servitude toward some imaginary greater whole and also represents an artifically-designed standard which impares an individual's ability to live a natural life, as do all manner of formal attire, for males or females.

    I suggest that all formal wear be burned...along with all credit cards. Unlike book burning, which signifies the destruction of imagination and intellect, tie burning signifies the destruction of standardization and the liberation of the individual from the oppression of the collective. It also signifies defiance toward the idea that people should be judged according to their appearance instead of by the heart as God would have us do. Therefore, burning ties is obedience to God.

    Throw your fists in the air and ARISE!!
  13. HavocHound Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2000
    star 4
    People used to make fun of me because I usually tucked in my shirts. I just explained to them that it was because most shirts are too long not to tuck in and end up making me look like I'm wearing a gown (actually not, but that's how it felt to me).

    My usual high screwl attire was a pair of khaki or off-white jeans, black steel-toe boots (just regular lace-up ankle-high boots), a black belt with a nickle or chrome buckle, a tucked-in black sleeveless shirt, and a faded blue long-sleeve button front left open and untucked and worn as an overshirt. I still have that blue shirt. I call it my "Ash shirt." [face_mischief] :p Except nowadays, I wear it with the sleeves unbuttoned at the ends for more wrist flexibility.

    I remember my favorite article of clothing from my elementary screwl daze was my first jean jacket. I can still remember the brand name: 'Electricity' (not that brands are important to me, I just remember it because it was called "Electricity"). I often wore the blue jean jacket in conjunction with a yellow and white baseball glove on my right hand that my friend gave me. Keep in mind that this was the '80s and a glove on one hand was not considered "socially unacceptable." I didn't wear the glove for style anyway. I wore it for practicality, though I didn't play baseball as a hobby (baseball gloves can be used for more than just baseball).

    Here's my idea of an acceptable screwl uniform:

    black leather jeans that lace up the sides with black leather laces; black leather police-style short-sleeve button-front shirt with 2 standard chest pockets, one utility pocket on the left sleeve, and epaulets on each shoulder; 2" wide black smooth leather belt with double-pronged vertical rectangular nickel buckle (like the belts cops wear); black leather engineer boots (worn outside the jeans) with nickel buckles and exposed steel cap toes; black leather driving gloves with auto-adjusting wrists; black leather underwear; black leather socks; black leather sleeveless undershirt; and a black leather taxi driver hat with a nickel chain across the front just above the black leather visor.

    *EDITS: miscellaneous details
  14. Obi-TriceKenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2002
    star 1
  15. Darth_Nemesis Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 3
    No, but I agree that it would make life a whole lot simpler.
  16. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
    " black leather underwear; black leather socks"

    You know I saw the first part of your post and was suprised that you were in favour of school uniforms, but then I read that part and realised you were joking! [face_laugh] You rule, Havoc :D
  17. AdmiralZaarin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 2001
    star 5
    Here in AU uniforms are compulsory pretty much everywhere (only exception would be a handful of private schools). Though wearing them (which I have to) can be irritating, it does away with the whole 'fashion' thing. But I wish it could be cheaper. $22 for a tie, $60 for a shirt and around the same price for trousers. I know a guy who one of the teachers had to buy his tie for him because his family couldn't afford it. If the government is going to put us in uniforms, atleast make them affordable. Though they have downsides, I say yay.
  18. EnforcerSG Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2001
    star 4
    I say nay.

    To me, uniforms are not trying to solve a problem, but ignore it.

    Question, what if a kid does not wear a uniform, yet still goes to school? Will they be forcably removed? Detention? What about a schools responsibility to teach? Shouldn't endcation be about more than a simply peace of cloth?

    My high school had a dress code, but the thing was they didnt do anything if you broke it. The teachers either didnt care or didnt agree with it. The few that did care quickly learned not to since nothing would happen if the offenders were reported.

    Schools in America lack disipline, and this will not help. It is a short term solution, but once the student body gets used to it, nothing will have changed.

    The problem is that some kids are compleat $%%^&*#@ who need either to grow up and place less importance on image, or be taught some disipline. Also that many school officals are weak cowards who cant keep some order, and this is just another pitiful atempt to avoid looking bad.

    In theory, uniforms could help, but not in todays America. Again, with my school, they should enforce the dress code, not add more to it.

    BTW, i am from America, and I am only speaking from my limited experence. Other nations very well may benifite from uniforms, because there is some good in them. However, i dont really know about how uniforms in other countries would be taken.
  19. KitFist0 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2001
    star 4
    YaY ive worn one everyday of school for 11 years, and i have to say Its great waking up in the morning and not having to think at all, at my school i always had a choice on what to wear polo turlte neck or shirt and tie and that was enough to think bout.
  20. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
    "not having to think at all"

    That's not a good thing.
  21. Rebecca191 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 1999
    star 6
    If uniforms are just an excuse to be lazy that's not a good thing either.
  22. QueenDorme Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2002
    star 3
    YEA.

    Makes things so much easier. It also let's personalities shine - not clothes. ;)
  23. westford Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 4
    I went to school in the UK and we had to wear a brown (mmm, lovely :p) uniform. Uniforms are good cos it saves you having to wear your decent clothes to school where you're liable to get dirty/spill chemicals everywhere/get ink all over you, etc. But in spite of uniforms, some kids still got bullied for having the 'wrong' shoes, bag, jacket, whatever... so things would've been worse if there was no uniform.
    Our uniform was relaxed enough that you were allowed some form of self-expression, although you got groups of 'clones' who all had the same shoes, jacket, bag...
    It wasn't perfect I guess, but it had sme definite benefits.
  24. stevo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2001
    star 4
    Yea. It lets kids characterize themselves by their personality, rather than their appearance. Or at least in theory.
  25. dark42 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2002
    star 3
    No. What ever happened to freedom of expression?

    Can't remember the name, but in one case in CA, the Supreme Court ruled that black arm-bands were protected by the first amendment as speech.

    And how do you spot your friends in a crowd, such and such? (Those of you still in school, not those of you whom have graduated already.)
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.