Clone Wars Season 5 [[(major spoilers & video clips!!!)]]

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Coric, Sep 2, 2012.

  1. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    When Filoni has spoken of Maul's 'cheating death' (my words), he referred to it as a subconscious thing. Therefore, I'm guessing that it wasn't something taught to Maul by either Sidious or Plagueis. Plagueis was definitely looking to control such power consciously, and in ROTS Sidious implies that he never learned (he could be misleading Anakin, but I never interpreted it that way). Whereas with Maul it's explained as some subconscious/instinctive thing that called upon the Dark Side to keep himself alive despite his mind being completely shattered.

    The interpretation I put forward before is that I'm guessing Palpatine might be sincerely interested in how Maul survived. Plagueis had not achieved the power to cheat death, as he could not keep himself alive under Palpatine's onslaught of Force lightning. Palpatine even remarks that Plagueis could save others from dying, but not himself. Meanwhile Maul has kept himself alive, something that would be of huge interest to the Sith. I think he might have gone to Mandalore personally to test Maul. If Maul can be killed easily, then there's nothing special about him and perhaps it was just sheer luck that he survived his injuries. But if Maul can survive what Plagueis could not (we do see a very brief shot in the trailer of what appears to be Maul on the ground at the receiving end of Force lightning), then that, IMO, seems like Palpatine would be very interested in studying and a power Palpatine would want for himself.

    As for Maul's motives. He made it very clear that he aimed to make both the CIS and Republic irrelevant and make a power base for himself. I think he's feeding Sidious a bunch of BS, just because Maul fears him and values his life. Maul even refers to Sidious as the most powerful being in the galaxy in Revenge. I think Maul ultimately wanted to take Sidious out, but he did not intend for Sidious to come for him personally so soon into his plans. And I think the implication of that preview is that Sidious knows he's being lied to, since he looks over at Savage with a curious "hmmmm." There can only be two and by Maul taking on an apprentice it's obvious to Sidious that Maul presumed to make himself a Sith Master and had no intention of being apprentice again.

    That's my interpretation anyway.
  2. cwustudent Force Ghost

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    Apparently I did! :p I thought, "Is this guy a noob?" But you know the difference, so that's good. Question about that clip. Why do you think they used the Imperial March there? Its really good for entrances. In ESB, you instantly know its a Vader scene by the music. I'm interested in the musical choices in the show and the movies.
    Last edited by cwustudent, Feb 1, 2013
  3. Nexumaster Force Ghost

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    I'm pretty far from a SW noob :D . When I think of it, maybe I put the words in the post wrong.

    And it seems like they like to use that theme for Sith and other evil characters (I think they've used it before for one or more non-Sith villains but I can't put my finger on which one(s)). At first the theme was pretty much exclusively for Vader but they've since extended the use of it.
  4. herp_derp Jedi Master

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    I'm pretty sure his inner circle knows at this point. as for the lack of showing them perhaps its because they just really haven't spent that much time on Palpatine or his planning in the show. But maylbe that will change since it looks like in this arc they are actually going to show Sidious= Palpatine
  5. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I don't think they're going to show it. No more so than previous holograms of Sidious have shown it (with the exception of subtle yellow eyes peering out from under the hood). But I don't think we'll see him with his hood down or hear an explicit mention that he's Palpatine.

    It's not the most subtle of secrets. Hell, the ROTS trailer completely spoiled that "secret" before the film was ever released. But if kids have been unable to see that they are the same by now, given the character's voice and 70% of the exposed face, I don't think the next episode is going to spoil it any further.

    I really wish they would stop trying to pretend like it's some well guarded secret, because even those that insisted that Sidious were a clone or whatever back when the prequels were coming out still hinged their arguments on the fact that they felt it was too obvious if Palpatine and Sidious turned out to be the same.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Feb 1, 2013
  6. Paparazzo Jedi Grand Master

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    You'd think the identical chins (that nobody else in the galaxy seems to have) would give away Sidious' identity, right?
    Last edited by Paparazzo, Feb 1, 2013
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  7. Nexumaster Force Ghost

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    I wonder why the Twilight is in such a bad shape. We haven't seen it since the first season and it's like this now; has it seen much off-screen action or did a stowaway Jawa on Coruscant get his hands on it?

    (I know I posted this in the episode thread but reposted it here in case the original post gets buried under the Sidious-related discussion going on there, which it probably will).
    Last edited by Nexumaster, Feb 1, 2013
  8. ImNotAStarWarsFanboy Force Ghost

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    Probably just neglect. It hasn't been used in ages and hasn't been given any maintenance so it's fallen into this sorry state.
  9. herp_derp Jedi Master

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    Or that oh so convenient device that identifies people that are cloaked and hooded in holograms :rolleyes:
  10. Jabba_The_Hutt_123 Force Ghost

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  11. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    That device was such a lame idea...
  12. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I feel like they have to address that now. There's a huge elephant in the room as to why Sidious doesn't make a greater effort to disguise himself if there is equipment out there that can render his already lame disguise useless.

    Grievous seems like a proud warrior, seems like he'd want to know who this pretentious Darth Sidious is that he's never met and who presumes to give him orders. Or a CIS leader that wants to learn his identity and blackmail Sidious (with deadly consequences).
  13. Jabba_The_Hutt_123 Force Ghost

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    Grievous seems to respect Dooku and Sidious a lot so I can get that he wouldn't care.
    Gunray in TPM though I'm sure he'd like to know.
  14. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Grievous I can understand having some respect for Dooku. Dooku has trained him and given him opportunities to kill Jedi. And if you go with the EU explanation for why Grievous is a cyborg, the CIS saved Grievous' life (as far as Grievous knows).

    With Sidious though, I know that Grievous respects him, given their conversation in ROTS. But I don't see why. He's just some guy on a hologram that always has his face in shadow and gives orders. Palpatine's got the Clark Kent effect going on where he can disguise his eyes under a hood and nobody knows who he is, but when Darth Sidious is presenting himself as a mole in the Republic Senate, I'd figure a lot of the CIS leaders would want to know who exactly they are talking to - especially if Gunray felt betrayed after TPM.

    When they finally see his face in ROTS, none of them seem to care. Unless they are completely cut off from the holonet and didn't hear about the Jedi leaving Palpatine disfigured and didn't hear Palpatine's speech to the Senate, I kind of suspected (after seeing ROTS) that Gunray and the others may have discovered that Palpatine was their mole some time during the Clone Wars.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Feb 1, 2013
  15. DarthTalgus Jedi Grand Master

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  16. fett 4 Chosen One

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    We are talking about the prequel era Jedi here, not the brightest lightbulbs in the pack by any stretch.

    Dooku pretty much monolouged the whole plot for them in Attack of the Clones and they still didn't know and then used an Army that they know is a potential threat.

    Filloni himself even made indirect comment on Jedi cleverness in his Umbara commentary by mentioning that if they had killed Palpatine in RotS, they would have been in deep trouble, as the senate would not have cared if he was a Sith, he was the guy making the trains run on time and the elected Head of Government. While Lucas himself comments that Anakin actually was right to stop Mace murdering him.
  17. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Filoni mentioned the exact same thing in a Force Cast and specified that was his own opinion and that he had no idea if Lucas would agree with it or not. Lucas mentioned that Anakin was right in the sense that a Jedi should not kill an unarmed opponent, but he did it for the wrong reasons (greed had blinded him).

    In regards to Filoni's comments. He seemed to imply that Mace Windu was going to pull a Batman from The Dark Knight. He'd kill Palpatine and be hated for it, and he might be arrested and sent to prison. But that he would take one for the team and the Galaxy would be better for it. Mace Windu being arrested and being hated would be a small price to pay and a sacrifice he'd more than likely be willing to make if it meant ridding the galaxy of the Sith.

    But IMO Filoni's comments are flawed since it's mentioned right in ROTS that the Jedi are prepared to seize control of government immediately after Palpatine is removed from office to ensure a peaceful transition back to democracy. So it's unlikely that in a Jedi controlled government that Mace would be arrested (unless they did it as a show of good faith).
  18. fett 4 Chosen One

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    Lol what made me laugh about that was that only 2 seconds ago Mace had said he was going to arrest him, then suddenly after defeating him he does a total 360.

    I agree with you there. They had also planned it before they knew Palpatine was a Sith Lord. Also what did the Jedi think the Senate were going to say or do as they took control after murdering there head of Govt. I mean do they depose any senator the Jedi don't like.
    Besides how would a military coup by a group of armed religious hippies with there own private army (the clones were created for the Jedi by the Jedi don't forget) and the the threat of force be a "peaceful transition"
  19. agentkrycek Jedi Grand Master

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    Probably because she'll be our fourth pale skinned bald villainess on the show.
  20. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I agree that it was kind of stupid or could have at least used more exposition in regard to what their plan was actually going to be. I mean Yoda seems hesitant about taking control of the government but doesn't put his foot down firmly either way. I think the script had dialogue (that wasn't in the film) that more explicitly mentioned that the Jedi would oust any corrupt senators, which does seem subjective enough to make the Jedi look corrupt themselves, since they are effectively acting as dictators.
  21. herp_derp Jedi Master

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    wait Aurra Sing and Ventress I count 2, unless you mean Talzin also?
  22. fett 4 Chosen One

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    What do the Jedi do if the Senators they want to get rid of say "No I won't go", do they kill them ? and What if the people/planets they represent say they liked that senator representing them, do they say "tough this is democracy which is what we are transitioning too, you do what we say"
    Last edited by fett 4, Feb 1, 2013
  23. Jabba_The_Hutt_123 Force Ghost

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    I assume the Jedi would just, rule as the chancellor until a new one was elected.
    The Jedi can't actually replace the Senate briefly, or kick out certain politicians without a ridiculous backlash, and as the Seps were still a threat just without Grievous, I could see a load of systems joining just because no Palpatine and the ridiculous Jedi no longer being held back. I assume it wasn't in the film because it would be ridiculous.
  24. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    From the script:

    ANAKIN leaves the room. COMMANDER CODY's hologram disappears.

    MACE WINDU: I sense a plot to destroy the Jedi. The dark side of the Force surrounds the Chancellor.

    Kl-ADI-MUNDI: If he does not give up his emergency powers after the destruction of Grievous, then he should be removed from
    office.

    MACE WiNDU: That could be a dangerous move ... the Jedi Council would have to take control of the Senate in order to secure a peaceful transition . . .

    Kl-ADI-MUNDI: . . . and replace the Congress with Senators who are not filled with greed and corruption. (this line isn't in the film)

    YODA: To a dark place this line of thought will carry us. Hmmmmm. . . . great care we must take.

    It was by no means settled upon that they would do this, but they seemed to be entertaining the idea, and Yoda did not firmly shoot the idea down.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Feb 1, 2013
  25. Jabba_The_Hutt_123 Force Ghost

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    Clearly Palpatine was right to take the Jedi out.
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