Seiously, what was so BAD about Padme?

Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by jewlmc, Aug 15, 2002.

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  1. Scruffy-looking Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 26, 2002
    star 3
    To quote Master Qui-Gon, "From your point of view." The only reason she seems more 'girly' to me in AOTC is that she falls in love, whereas in TPM she doesn't. ;)

    To your other point, Bail Organa in AOTC is like Obi-Wan in TPM; not a whole lot to do, pretty much a cipher. And no, she is not the only formal character in that scene--nor is she a slab of wood either; "Chancellor, if I may I do not believe...". I only use that term in contrast to the way the main characters in the OT related to each other.

    Don't get the reference to Dorme; I think both she and Padme demonstrated a lot of restrained emotion in their parting. In the arena, this is my opinion but I liked the fact that they seemed much freer and more playful with each other after the love confession; it was really sweet that she kissed him after he saves her from the nexu, and I loved the 'diplomatic solution/aggressive negotiations' line! After all the complaints of her stiffness, when she finally opens up everyone starts complaining. Now I agree that to a degree it takes away from the seriousness of the larger battle, but I would first point to 3PO as the main culprit for that.

    As to the tumble, well, I admit I have no defense for that! ;)
  2. Maverick1115 Jedi Knight

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    May 22, 2002
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  3. Red-Talon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2002
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    Nat really impressed me in her action scenes in AOTC. Whacking that Nexu with the chain, picking up that blaster and then picking off battle droids one by one...she certainly has a lot of fight in her!

    Her action scenes were some of the worst imo, not all her fault however. During the action scenes, as someone said earlier, she's the only one left flirting, telling jokes, and giggling, now that part isn't her fault, however the way she holds her gun, the way she runs around, the way she talks. It sounds like an attempt at mixing a girly-girl and badass chick gone horribly wrong.

    And as I've said about 100 times, during the Tusken scene, she looks way too tired. When she walks over to comort Anakin it looked like she was gonna pass out on him. *shrug*
  4. Red-Talon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2002
    star 3
    Ok, Maverick

    That... or maybe someone who cares about acting skills in a movie. I'm not gonna lie, she looks great in AOTC, but too many fans seem to use that as an excuse for bad acting.

    Believe it or not, you can have looks and acting skills in a character, Carrie Fisher is an example of this.
  5. Maverick1115 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 3
    That... or maybe someone who cares about acting skills in a movie. I'm not gonna lie, she looks great in AOTC, but too many fans seem to use that as an excuse for bad acting.

    Believe it or not, you can have looks and acting skills in a character, Carrie Fisher is an example of this.


    I can see that. I appreciate good acting skills too. Personally I don't think Portman did so bad. The only quirks I had were with Christiansen in the love scenes. I wasn't sold on those to well. Other than that I thought he did well and I don't really have any complaints on Portman's acting.

    EDIT:

    Put it this way. Denise Richards is an example of horrible acting. I thought she made that Bond movie horrible. Yes she is very pleasing to the eye, but she was beyond horrible. When she starts talking about Nuclear core's I want to laugh. Portman isn't anywhere close to as bad as Denise.
  6. Maverick1115 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 3
    Red-Talon, you may want to take off my quote you italicized, I just got a warning for using the last word in that sentence. Sorry if I offended anyone, that was the last of my intentions.
  7. bassethound Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 1
    Just a little emotion when with Anakin, after his Mom dies, maybe the fireplace scene, or at least when you profess your love to him! During the love profession scene where she says "I truly, deeply love you" I kept thinking to myself: "Doesn't sound like it, sister." When she tries to sound professional and boring, she does an okay job, but when she's suspose to be showing emotion she doesn't reach the mediocre mark imo.
    ________________________________________
    One thing that stood in my mind is the opening scene, when Dorme was killed. I can't believe that the way she was acting. It was so awfully done, very mediocre. It looks like she didn't realized that the camera was rolling and she was supposed to be acting. And her tone.. it wasn't just flat, it looks like she was reading from cue cards!





    I wonder if people honestly would have prefered to see the PT as merely a carbon copy of the OT; It sure seems like many would like Padme/Anakin to be just like Leia/Han, or Padme to be just like Leia, etc...Personally, I'm glad characters aren't carbon copies. :/
    ____________________________________________
    I do NOT want carbon copies, I want some enthusiasm, some sparks. Padme is so DULL and she doesn't stood up infront of you as a character. As I said before, she is just a piece of cardboard. A pretty one, but still a cardboard.


    And yes, in Hayden's confession scene, she definitely looks like she's just woken up from a Sunday afternoon nap and should put on some water for tea.
    _________________________________________

    LOLOL! Thank you Red Talon! I thought she must have forgot her lines :)




    PS: Off the rumor mill, they said Lucas dressed Natalie up in EP II, because after watching TPM he realized Nat can't act."

    Again, with the pointless rumors. If you watch the behind the scenes documentaries on the Official Site, you'll here the answer straight from George Lucas himself as to why he chose the costumes in AOTC. Stop using unfounded rumors to bash others.
    __________________________________________
    As I said before, if I were promoting my film, I will say nice things as well. Which is, the main reason I said "of the rumor mill" which means that it could come from the back door. And to be honest, why wasn't she given more roles? In TPM, she is quite the leading lady, in AOTC, apart from the little battle part ( which she screwed when falling off the plane) she is just ( as forever-jedi said) " an eye-candy".



    PS: These are just my 2 CENTS.
  8. Red-Talon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2002
    star 3
  9. Obis-Grl Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 4
    Red-Talon, forever_jedi, and bassethound: I'm gone for a few hours and when I get back I have nothing to say because you guys said it all for me...hah! Right on guys, excellent jobs! :) :) :)

    Oh wait I do have one thing to say:

    Sophita: I don't want a cut out copy of Leia, believe me that is the last thing I want. What I want is Ms. Portman to show us more depth in Padme. Show us a blend of the politician and the woman her all in a smooth well put together blend. Someone who has a quite conviction a sweet naivete flowing out of her at all times.

    That's what I wanted from Padme. But that's not what I got.

    To Scruffy and everyone else I didn't have an opinion to state to: Everything I wanted to say to you post has simple been said by both Red-Talon, forever_jedi and bassethound. Oh well, their will be other times... [face_mischief]





  10. forever_jedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 5, 2002
    star 5
    Scruffy-looking Don't get the reference to Dorme; I think both she and Padme demonstrated a lot of restrained emotion in their parting.

    This is, of course, my POV. It is in Padme's and Dorme's 'goodbye' scene, when we compare the two actresses that NP's acting really falls way short. Rose Byrne, in two seconds and with just a little dialog, shows so much emotion with so little histrionics. Padme looks like she's bored with all this and wants to get away with Anakin ASAP. The expressions on the two actresses' faces are really telling. Dorme shows restrained emotion, Padme shows little emotion (and no, not "formal" acting on her part).

    Also, in the AOTC opening scene, when Corde dies, Captain Typho and Padme come up equally lacking in their acting abilities.

    Red-talon It sounds like an attempt at mixing a girly-girl and badass chick gone horribly wrong.

    I agree with you. The fault in the Geonosis arena is much less with NP than with the character, Padme. It's as if this is all a "cops and robbers" game to her.

    To Sophita, No I do NOT carbon copies of the OT, thank you. Never did. Luke, Han, Leia are unique and it would be silly to clone them. Instead I want fresh new characters who I can relate to, love, laugh with, cry for, etc. Padme leaves me disinterested in her - this is as much a fault with the character as with NP's unimaginative and wooden acting. May be EIII will change my views. In the meantime, I am happy with other wonderful new characters in TPM and AOTC that GL has kindly provided, to keep me happy and content.
  11. Scruffy-looking Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 26, 2002
    star 3
    This discussion no longer interests me. I think Natalie Portman did a fine job of portraying the character of Padme Amidala; bassethound, Red Talon, Obis-Grl and forever_jedi do not. I am not convinced by your arguments, you are not convinced by mine. Neither side is going to change the viewpoint of the other, so I'm happy to leave it at that.

    Have a nice day.


  12. smauldookie Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2002
    star 5
    The only thing Natalie got going for her in the PT'S are her looks. Her acting stinks.

    It's true :D

  13. RangerPrincess Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2002
    star 4
    Maybe as a Senator, Padmé is suppose to conceal her emotion, I know some Senators do, maybe that is partly the reason. Again, it's just a worthless theory. [face_plain]
  14. Red-Talon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2002
    star 3
    Obis-Grl, looks like we're on the same wave length again. ;)

    What a great thread!
  15. Obis-Grl Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 4
    Red-Talon aren't we always on the same wave length... well at least on this subject... :)

    I agree... this is a great thread!
  16. Red-Talon Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2002
    star 3
    Well, I too think Ewan is godly, so that's another thing we agree on!
  17. Obis-Grl Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 4
  18. PMT99 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2000
    star 4
    "Luke didn't seem to get anything from Padme."

    Have you not checked out my post?

    Luke has her compassion, her unconditional love, her "fixing" skills, her ability to control emotions, and her undeniable belief that Anakin can be saved.
  19. Ben-Obi-Wan-Kenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 1999
    star 3
    JediLeiaOrgana and Obis-Grl
    fantastic posts!!

    i have a question
    (so please dont bash me for it ;) )

    What if Nathalie got an "accident/disease or so (and cant play the role for Padme), and they would replace her with , lets say "Rose Byrne" (Dormé)
    would that kill the movie for you?
  20. naw ibo Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 1999
    star 5
    I still don't understand why people think she's weak; it's the decisions of the Jedi and Palpatine which force her to go into hiding, and from the arena on I think she's a very strong character, holding her own in a fight.

    I don't think from what I've read that most people are saying she is weak because she went into hiding. It's how she's acting while in hiding that is weak, and otherwise too. She just really doesn't portray the "gravitas" of a woman who has spent the last ten years being the leader of a planet and a leading Galactic Senator. And we shouldn't even need to see her in the Senate to be convinced of that. It should be something that comes along in her general attitude. Carrie Fisher was 19 years old when she was in ANH and we never saw her in the Senate or anything like that, but I could still believe, even with her wisecracking and temperamentalness, that she had what it took to be a Galactic leader in the GFFA. That's actually something I realized years later in watching ANH--Carrie really showed a lot of personality and spunk for a 19 year old with relatively little experience.

    Personally I wouldn't want "Leia II" out of Padme, but even within what she is supposed to be, that doesn't mean she couldn't project more of an aura of strength and leadership. Yes she physically fought well in the Arena but that isn't the same as having an aura of strenght and leadership. The only person we really see her leading is Anakin--and 19 year old guys with their hormones going wild tend to be fairly easily led by the woman causing the hormonal reaction, so it isn't exactly convincing of her persona as a whole. I'm one of the wimpiest females you'd want to know and even I can lead a guy around if he's interested in me(and if it behooved me to do so :) ). I will say I thought her scene with the current Queen of Naboo was good, but then again, that could just be because I thought it was pretty cool seeing the two highest ranking leaders in the room, discussing the politics of the galaxy, being women. :D

    And as for the criticisms of her being wooden and uncomfortable, I see it more as her acting in character--reserved and formal, especially in the beginning with the Chancellor and with Obi-Wan. The PT is a different time, and we are seeing different kinds of people from the OT; diplomats, high politicians and the Jedi at their height--a more formal, standoffish time, with people acting in their official roles.

    I'd say Palpatine and Obi-Wan are reserved and formal but I wouldn't call either of them wooden or unconvincing and don't see many other people saying it either. There are plenty of roles out there calling for a character to be reserved and formal--the sign of true talent(or at least interest and comfort in a role) is to be able to be reserved and formal but not wooden, to hint at the depth going on underneath, the real person beneath the formal exterior. Now I actually rather liked Natalie, there were certain scenes where I found her more realistic than Hayden frankly. But she didn't convince me she was a Galactic Senator and former planetary leader(she actually seemed better when she was in TPM in that dept.), esp. one who had spent over a year working against the Military Creation act--heck she barely even seemed concerned about it once she was off Coruscant(although that isn't her fault, that's Lucas' fault).

    Yes she is supposed to have many facets in her role as Padme, the real trick and real talent comes from showing all those facets in a seamless fashion, to make them all seem like facets of the same character.

  21. bassethound Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 1
    What if Nathalie got an "accident/disease or so (and cant play the role for Padme), and they would replace her with , lets say "Rose Byrne" (Dormé)
    would that kill the movie for you?
    -----signature-----


    That would be BETTER! ( NO, I don't want something happen to Natalie, but I think Rose is a better actress).
  22. Obis-Grl Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 4
    Thanks Ben-Obi-Wan-Kenobi, I'm glad you liked my posts!

    What if Natalie got an "accident/disease or so (and cant play the role for Padme), and they would replace her with, lets say "Rose Byrne" (Dormé)
    would that kill the movie for you?


    Well, I really hate it when different people play the same character (even though I don't like Ms. Portman's acting it really is to late to change actresses .) But it wouldn't kill the movie for me if Ms. Portman wasn't up to the job. Rose Byrne or Keira Knightly (Sabé) I think would do good jobs.

    Right on naw ibo!
  23. SlowLearner Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 3
    she's the only one left flirting, telling jokes, and giggling, now that part isn't her fault, however the way she holds her gun, the way she runs around, the way she talks. It sounds like an attempt at mixing a girly-girl and badass chick gone horribly wrong.

    When did she giggle? Was she telling jokes left and right? I only recall one brief scene, and I really liked that "aggressive negotiations" line. It was very Star Warsy in the sense that humor is injected into very serious situations. Sort of like when Han, Luke, Leia were about to be crushed to death in the Death Star trash compactor, and Han goes, "Well, one thing's for sure...we're all gonna be a lot thinner." Pure Star Wars.

    Also, I really don't think GL was going for the "badass chick" aspect during the battle. I just saw a smart girl doing her best to survive, and doing it quite well (holding off the Nexu until Anakin comes to get her, picking up a blaster and fighting instead of cowering). It wasn't like she was Xena or something, throwing battle droids around with her bare hands. (BTW, I just read that Carrie Fisher online chat transcript that had question about Princess Leia vs. Xena. Funny stuff!)

    And to be honest, why wasn't she given more roles? In TPM, she is quite the leading lady, in AOTC, apart from the little battle part ( which she screwed when falling off the plane) she is just ( as forever-jedi said) " an eye-candy".

    I don't follow Natalie's career very closely, but from what I recall, didn't she star in 2 movies after TPM? I think she was offered more roles as well, but she wanted to focus on her college education.

    Luke has her compassion, her unconditional love, her "fixing" skills, her ability to control emotions, and her undeniable belief that Anakin can be saved.

    I agree. It's like whenever I watch the OT, I can't help but think of Padme when I watch Luke. Like mother, like son! :)

  24. RangerPrincess Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2002
    star 4
    Padmé is not the war time gal I'm thinking. ;)
    Overall, Padmé cares for her people and loves her planet, she did volunteer to be a Senator I think by the Queen (I believe she said that to Anakin while they were traveling in AOTC). She *didn't* have to, and if she didn't, there would most likely be no Luke or Leia.

    Natalie didn't portray Padmé horrible or *really* badly, there were just some flaws and disconnections that didn't go with another. Padmé is just a teaser to when it comes to love, honestly, the *first* time I saw the fireplace scene, and her in that dress, I seriously thought she was going to admit her love for him, and..*cough*

    Totally the other way. Made me quite upset to say the least. I like to think, the true romance comes in Episode III, but it ends sadly, and you see how deeply she loves him and how sad she is, if that happens (which I am sure it will), I'll forgive what happened in Episode II. Also maybe in Episode III, you will see how they miss each other's presence, I doubt Anakin will be with Padmé 24/7, afterall, there is a war going on. While their world in chaos, they love each other. [face_love]
    I like the heartbreaking romance. ;)

    My first thoughts on Padmé, "No wonder Leia barely remembers her mother, she was embarrassed by her, wearing all those tight clothing and all."

    I hate to compare Leia and Padmé...Leia didn't wear tight or suggestive clothing like Padmé did, and the slave oufit doesn't count, Jabba most likely made her wear that.

    And lately in the 21st century, in music, movies and so forth, actresses aren't setting a good examples for young girls. *sigh* My cousin seems to have this thought in her head, the less you wear, the more popular you are, quite sad actually. [face_plain]

    Just my thoughts, hope I didn't offend anybody. *flees*

    EDIT: Typos and markup codes. *sigh*
  25. forever_jedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 5, 2002
    star 5
    Ranger Princess you see how deeply she loves him and how sad she is, if that happens (which I am sure it will), I'll forgive what happened in Episode II. Also maybe in Episode III, you will see how they miss each other's presence, I doubt Anakin will be with Padmé 24/7, afterall, there is a war going on. While their world in chaos, they love each other.

    It is equally possible that in EIII, Padme will wake up from her "daze" as she sees Anakin become "more friendly" with Palpatine and more oriented towards a dictatorship to bring about order in the clone wars. Padme's sense of democracy and duty may be stirred up to the point where she goes up against Anakin - Anakin's dream in the TPM novel hints at something like this. It will be quite sad if she decides to leave Anakin and not even tell him about being pregnant out of fear at what he might do. This could also explain her "sadness" that Leia remembers. A hurried romance that ends in estrangement, as is so common in today's society. Her awkwardness with the wedding kiss may be deliberate: she is not a happy bride and is already having second thoughts. :(
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