Amph SFF Writers' Guild Writing Contest Discussion

Discussion in 'Archive: SF&F: Books and Comics' started by droideka27, Jan 9, 2006.

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  1. -RebelScum- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 21, 2004
    star 6
    Incidentally, whenever the host-whatever is decided tell me and I will PM the sock information. (we made an "official" sock a while back before it even split into two threads)

    -The Scummy-
  2. malcolm-darth-am-i Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2005
    star 4
    I dont know if this is possible. But what if we open up a privet thread. Were only host/sock/whatever and judges can read and post. That way they can have a whole discussion. I also like the PM idea.
  3. Jairen Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2000
    star 4
    That's exactly what I thought YJ. I'm not sure how this one hour deadline window thing even appeared :confused:

    OK, does anyone know what has been decided concretely? I think it is about now that a host needs to be committed to, to ensure that the rules are going to get finalised and defined. Reading through the thread we do seem to go round and round the house alot.

    I'm not sure whether Dorkman is even still interested, so it might be worth actually PMing him to see if he has the time. I know he has several forums that he looks after and the Virtual Prequels project as well.

    I think the co-host thing should be binned, just keep X number of judges and have a host who does all the prep work each month.
  4. LordNeo Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 13, 2004
    star 5
    Why anonomously submiting our stories.
    If I write it I want credit, I want it to be known
  5. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    I'm assuming you mean a private forum, not a thread. In any event, I'd be against that, simply because one judge could influence another judge. I think stories should be judged based on someone's personal reactions, not influenced on what other judges thought.

    I also agree with getting rid of the co-host, in favor of just having a host that does not enter the contest, but helps lead this discussion and runs the contests themselves.

    They would be given to the judges anonymously, so that the names attached to the stories does not bias their thoughts. After the contest, I'm sure you would be able to publically post or link to the story and take whatever credit you want. Some people also do not want their stories posted publically, due to various copyright reasons.
  6. LordNeo Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 13, 2004
    star 5

    OKay, thats one thing that does scare me, is someone stealing my stories, that I work very hard at.
  7. Jairen Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2000
    star 4
    You would get credit for your writing. Once the competition has been judged, the host would link the marks back with the authors for when the results go public.

    The idea is for the judges not to know who wrote the stories until AFTER the judging is completed, to ensure no bias. Perhaps one of the judges was your friend, or didn't particularly like you, then they could skew the marks if they knew which piece was yours.
  8. LordNeo Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 13, 2004
    star 5
    gotcha :p

    that makes sense
  9. Jairen Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2000
    star 4
    I also think it should be up to the individual entering whether or not the entry is made public at the end. I mentioned this is the guild thread and I'll mention it again here, many writer's may not want to give up their First Publication rights by posting it on a public forum.
  10. Coruscant Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2004
    star 6
    The one-hour deadline window idea actually popped up before any of the talk about anonymous submissions, host socks, etc... started. However, this new way is definitely better.

    A one-hour deadline?!? That's absurd. Who is here that can actually write a 2,000-8,000 word story in one hour?
    I think you misinterpreted what the point of it was in the first place. It wasn't that a story would be written in that time, just submitted during that time.

    Anyway, there's a better system now.

    And, YJ, attributing credit doesn't necessarily mean attributing ownership, control, anything like that, as well. You should know that. I mean, for crying out loud, it's two completely different things.

    EDIT: Agreed, Jairen. However, it should be emphasized that it's not that hard to go over to writing.com, set up an account, and submit the short. The rights there, I should say, are non-exclusive.




  11. Dark_Lady_Jada Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2004
    star 5
    When I have hosted "challenges" for the SSA we have given the competitors or entrants a deadline. They all get sent a PM with whatever the challenge is and then they have the responsibility to open the PM, complete the task and send it by the deadline.

    Face it, 8am in London is what, midnight board time? Nah!

  12. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    "I think you misinterpreted what the point of it was in the first place. It wasn't that a story would be written in that time, just submitted during that time."

    I realized that, and that also is absurd, for all the reasons stated before. (Although, digressing for a moment, a "super fast contest" could be interesting.)

    "And, YJ, attributing credit doesn't necessarily mean attributing ownership, control, anything like that, as well."

    Except it usually goes the other way around. You can have ownership or control without taking credit, or those who have ownership or control can take credit, but I can't recall people taking credit for things that they didn't take ownership or control of. You can take credit for the idea of a contest, perhaps, but not for the entire contest, especially without wanting control or ownership of it. And there's a big difference between coming up with an initial idea, and working out the kinks and implementing it successfully.
  13. Coruscant Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2004
    star 6
    Um, why did you quote me about the deadline window? :confused: I notice you left out where I said "We've got a better system now."

    And first off, it's not "you". It's the Guild. The writing organization of this new forum. Secondly, it's rather odd that a Guild wouldn't sponsor or be credited for a short story contest in the same forum. Last, it's not like Scummy, myself, or anyone else is gonna come out and say "Oh, but the Guild has credit and we are ultimately Guild members and you are not" when we strongly disagree on one aspect. No way, no how. It won't happen. There's nothing to be threatened of here.

    So, please, quit pushing it.

  14. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    Indeed. :)
  15. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    I haven't read through this whole thread yet, but just to allay some concerns: first publication rights came up during NaNoWriMo.

    Basically, you can post stories and still not have them considered as having lost their first publications rights as long as they are not publically posted.

    For example, on Writing.com you can set a story so that it will only be accessible to Writing.com registered authors. That is considered private and -- as long as you note that it was privately shared among a writing community -- most publishers don't care. Likewise you could set up a "friends only" livejournal and post stories there, and also keep first publication rights.

    M. Scott
  16. Coruscant Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2004
    star 6
    Thanks for clearing that up, Scott. :)

  17. Jairen Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2000
    star 4
    Thanks for that information Dorkman, that was what I was trying to find out. I was always under the impression that as long as it was on a site that required some form of access be granted to view it, then you were fine, and this confirms it.
  18. Coruscant Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2004
    star 6
    Let's talk about the grading system...

    I had just offered a compromise to Andalite-Bandit yesterday but it got overlooked.

    I proposed this:

    There would be 10 points for each judge, 90 when all combined. Pretty simple, right? But, additionally, each judge must write a brief paragraph after his or her grade on why he/she liked or didn't like the short, what could've been improved, what was done well, etc...

    I do think that this aspect should be mandatory because it brings more to the competition than just winning it. In this way, the winner wins all the best stuff, but other entrants get something out of it as well, which would be a large variety of critique.

    droideka had countered that it could just as easily be brought to the Guild or writing.com, but, face it... where else would one get 9, assured mini-critiques? All in short time, quick enough so the writer can hone his/her skills for the next competition.

  19. Darth_Ignant Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 7
    "Alright, I'm only going to say this once: You have twisted what I was saying and parodied something that wasn't there in the first place. I'm politely asking you to stop. "

    I might stop, if I knew wth you're talking about. Can you provide some quotes, because right now you just look paranoid, and you're jumping at shadows.
  20. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    No more squabbling. We're moving on. I mean it.

    For points having read through:
    -I agree that BRIEF critiques by the judges should be required, if for no other reason than to show clearly why they made the decision they did. For in-depth feedback, maybe we should think to post it in the Guild.
    -I also think an entrant list is unnecessary. What if someone signs up then when they get the monthly "prompt", whatever it is, decides they'd rather sit this month out?
    -I think it should just be, whomever gets a story in by the deadline, gets to have it evaluated.
    -I'm really confused as to the various mechanisms that are being proposed to get these stories circulating. We need to come up with something very simple for when it gets to the point of a dozen stories being juggled to a dozen judges.

    M. Scott
  21. droideka27 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2002
    star 7
    I agree with the dorkman :)
  22. Andalite-Bandit Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2005
    star 6
  23. MariahJSkywalker Poopoo Head

    Member Since:
    Mar 11, 2005
    star 6
    I agree with Dorkman's ideas.
  24. FatBurt Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 21, 2003
    star 5
    I'm of the feeling that 9 judges will be a huge overkill here. I also think it may be difficult to get 9 judges.

    I feel 3 is easily obtainable and 5 may be more suitable but 9 seems too many.


    I may be wrong and we could end up with enough judges but from what I can see only 4 people have put their names forward as judges so far and 2 of them want to write as well.


    It may be an idea to have a minimum of 3 judges with a maximum of 9 and then take whatever we get.
  25. PrincessKenobi New Films Manager of DOOM

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2000
    star 7
    Wow, this is a great idea. I would love to help out anyway whatsoever, considering I use to be one of the editors for the Lit. Mag in High School.

    I agree let it be open to everyone. It's a bit unfair to have a cutoff line.

    I would suggest 5 to 10 judges, depending on how big you think the contest will be each month.

    Another suggestion to help pass out the stories better. Is if the people who are posting their stories maybe put it up on a web page, a blog, or online journal type thing. PM to the head person in charge of the contest and then that person pm's all the links out to the judges. Maybe once a week or ever few days depending on how fast the entries come in, to the judges. This way it's easier to read for one and also allows judges to get thru stories faster and take notes on what they liked and didn't like.

    Also maybe set up a system of where people can pm in their suggestions for story topics each month.

    Also if the judges can get the stories narrowed down to 3, let the JC send in pms of who they think should be the winner of whatever award is deemed apporiate for the winner. But still moving on with the following months contest. It's alot to juggle but it keeps everyone intrested and trying to compete and what not.

    Another thought is at the end of the month posting a link or a thread for each aurthor to post their short story for that month and JCers can read thru them if they like.

    Just a few thoughts. :)

    ~PK~
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