PT Should Darth Maul have lived?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by darthanku, Sep 18, 2004.

Moderators: Bazinga'd
  1. origjedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 27, 2001
    star 3
    I think, for the overall saga, he needed to die. HOWEVER, the way he died sucked! No way OB1 could be 10 or so feet below Maul, flip about 5 or so feet ABOVE him, land on his feet, then slice Maul without Maul even moving his lightsabre! Ridiculous! As fast as Maul was, there's no way that should have happened! I'm not saying OB1 couldn't have ultimately defeated Maul, it just sucked! Ok, that's my 2 cents worth.
  2. Darkenedsuperman Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 14, 2004
    star 1
    Alot of the things in the whole Sage contradict themselves.. and the way Darth Maul died was one of them. Has anyone forgotten how GL killed of Boba Fett in ROTJ? That sucked just as bad or even worse. Darth Maul is built up as this unstopable enemy and then Obi-wan kills him in a way that looks.... well kind of retarded. I understand it was done because of plot continuity, but Lucas is kind of unfair to the fans at times. Same w/ Boba Fett, at the end of Empire the Fett character is so bad ass, and then he gets killed after he gets knocked over by accident by Han. And to top it off he screams and shrieks as if he's never flown before. Darth Maul was created the way he was because Lucas needed to sell us on his new PT because he knew alot of us would be skeptical about it.

    Personally I would of liked to see Maul survive the TPM. GL could of easily made the final battle between Qui-gon and Maul leaving Obi-wan else where (enter your idea here...LoL). But I also understand that Maul had served his purpose to show how strong of a jedi Obi-wan was. The PT all together makes u look at Obi-wan w/ more respect to his skills w/ a lightsaber.

    On a side note, Jango shouldn't died that quick either. Doesn't do the character justice. Once again he was killed off rather easily just to show how bad ass of a Jedi Mace Windu is... notice the trend?

    But I also agree that us Light Saber freaks will be delighted and not so upset when we see Anakin in Episode III.

    But that just my Humble opinion.
  3. Tyrantus Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 2004
    star 3
    Uhh, Boba never died. He got stuck in the Sarlacc and escaped....
  4. Compa_Mighty Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 27, 2001
    Short answer: no, he shouldn't. As nethanial says, I thought he would be the Vader of the prequels.

    The prequels have suffered of weak villains, a strong one that Anakin took out in Episode 3 would make Vader's rise even more significant.

    Then Jar Jar could have been a gungan general who was vanished after trying a military coup at Otoh Gunga.

    Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon woul've been just partners, rather than master and apprentice, make Anakin a couple years older, and without changing the story you have a stronger darker movie.

    Of course if we changed the story there are some other good things that could've been thrown in...
  5. darthsith19 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2004
    star 4
  6. Fanmenace Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2005
    *Nope. Id have rather had Maul remain Sideous' apprentice until Anakin could take him out. Dooku does nothing for me.
    On another note do the banners in this part of the baords (TPM) never change?*

    Dooku is the front man for Sidious and the separatist movement. DM sole purpose was to kill Jedi and had no personality beyond that and would freak everybody out anyway. Dooku also fit into the mirroring concept ala ESB - an apprentice fighting and old man. I dont see any place for DM in AOTC. Admittedly, Dooku is not the best character in the series - he seems too old to be seduced or manipulated like a naive padawan.
  7. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    Yes, Darth Maul should have died... Wait a minute, he DID die! :eek:

    Dooku wasn't seduced. I think he simply came to the conclusion that the dark side was the right way to go, since it gives more power.
    Manipulated, though, he was.



    Star Wars is six, two and one
    /LM
  8. Chaotic_Serenity Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 2004
    star 4
    Perhaps character-wise, seeing more of him would have been interesting, but story-wise, that would have been impossible. For the Clone Wars to begin, Sideous needed an acolyte who not only was not only a powerful Force user, but someone who could command serious political and financial presence. Dooku provided the catalyst Sideous needed to draw the Separatists from the Republic and create galactic upheaval and instability. Maul, with his utterly mysterious origins and unfriendly mien, would have had neither the charisma, reputation, or monetary backing to fund such a move. Therefore, he had to go. IMO, Sideous' only real use for Maul was to use him as a way to make himself known to the Jedi and create fear and strife amidst them.

    As a note...since when was Maul "invicible"-seeming? At no point in the film did I get the feeling that he was omnisciently powerful. Dangerously well-trained, sure, but who does Maul defeat that gives him such a reputation? Qui Gon? A Jedi Master whose age is starting to catch up with him? And even then, take a good look at the battle scene in TPM. Maul is quick, but Qui Gon keeps him on the defensive most of the time. It was Qui Gon's exhaustion that led to his defeat, which was followed up by Maul's death at the hands of an apprentice, of all things. There is nothing that I see in TPM to suggest Maul, while admittedly a very well-trained warrior, is anything worth comparing to the level of Sith apprentices who came to follow in his wake.
  9. Darth_Takedown Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 20, 2004
    star 1
    I think Maul's death was necessary for the story, but like so many of you, I'm not satisfied with the way he was beaten. After displaying all that skill, to be beaten by the most telegraphed of all strikes was soooooo lame.

    Here's how I might have done it:

    Obi-Wan leaps from the chasm, and Qui-Gon's lightsaber flies to his outstretched hand. He activates it as his feet hit the ground and takes a desperate swing at his dark opponent. But Maul is quick to react and blocks the green blade. The two continue swinging at each other, faster now than before. Soon, the severed handle of Maul's weapon becomes hot, as the end could not contain the energy as well as a properly sealed hilt. As Maul realizes he is about to lose his advantage, he force-pushes Obi-Wan to the other side of the room and flees.

    Later, as Maul reports to Sidious, he is killed by his unforgiving master.

    Now both fighters look good, and Sids looks more evil for killing one of his own without even flinching.

    But.....that's just my opinion, and I'll be at peace with those who disagree.

    DT
  10. Tartarus Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 29, 2005
    star 1
    personally, I was prepared for Maul to be the "Vader of the PT," especially with the amount of hype he was receiving. I was surprisingly disappointed when he was killed by Obi-Wan. I felt it cheapened Qui-Gon's fighting prowess by having his killer finished off almost as easily. I think that if Maul had fought Obi-Wan to a standstill and escaped through the use of some sort of trckery, it would have elevated QObi-Wan's apparent skill without totally debasing that of Qui-Gon.

    Though for Maul to survive and still have the presence of Dooku, one of two things would have to happen: 1) either no Rule of Two to allow Dooku to be Tyranus alongside Sidious and Maul or 2) Dooku would simply be Dooku, and ambitious politician working with Sidious and aided directly by Maul.
    Sitara likes this.
  11. Lucky_Luke Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2004
    star 2
    Personally, I m afraid his character was too underdeveloped to survive the first act. He couldn't have played the count's role in AOTC and the count was essentially necessary (probably from GLs perspective) to "foreshadow" a Jedi turning to the dark side...

    LL :)
  12. Tartarus Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 29, 2005
    star 1
    ooh, an excellent point. I'd never thought of that.
  13. Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2001
    star 6
    Uhh, Boba never died. He got stuck in the Sarlacc and escaped...

    Now, now, let's not canon war. If someone is content with what was shown in the movies and says Fett's dead because of it, that's good enough for the discussion. In an EU forum, that's something else entirely.
  14. Sitara Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2001
    star 3

    Dooku should have been a poloitician pure and simple. Maul should have survived until episode 3. He was just that damn good. He was the younger than dooku, yet still had a superior lightrsaber skill, as well as a much more meanacing aura. Maul never spoke; he
    _DID_

    And while his death was crappily executed, Vaders defeat at the hands of Luke was even more pathetic. A Sith Lord, his hand chopped of by a mere padawan who has not been trained longer than a few months. It only took one kick from Luke to send Vader sprawling on his butt, where he flopped around, but could not get up. :D Obi wan in tpm was trained his whole LIFE. But he was still nearly killed.

    IMO, with Maul around there would have been no need for this Grievous. What a crappy idea. It only goes to show Lucas cares about marketing first and foremost; the real reason for new villains is so Lucas
    can seel more action figures, more saber hilts, more accessories (Count Dooku taking a leak; COunt Dooku having his hernia, Count Dooku's bridal Gown,
    Gay Count Dooku, Count Dooku Eating his favortie meal, Count Dooku riding a horse, Count Dooku on a pogo stick, Count Dooku hangliding...etc etc.). Same with Grievous.

    :( Poor Maul. An ep3 duel between maul and mace would have been awesome; a fight between anakin skywalker and Maul would have been sweet too. Not to mention the dramaic tension; Obi-Wan see's Maul after 10 years in AOTOC, and then 10 years again in ROTS!




  15. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    I don't think that Maul should have died. I would have liked to see Maul and Yoda go it. I think that would have been a really great Jedi duel.
  16. oltars Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Yes, but i didn't want him to.
  17. DARTH-FURBABY Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 9, 2004
    star 2
    I think, for the overall saga, he needed to die. HOWEVER, the way he died sucked! No way OB1 could be 10 or so feet below Maul, flip about 5 or so feet ABOVE him, land on his feet, then slice Maul without Maul even moving his lightsabre! Ridiculous! As fast as Maul was, there's no way that should have happened! I'm not saying OB1 couldn't have ultimately defeated Maul, it just sucked! Ok, that's my 2 cents worth.

    I agree!! It seems to me Maul should have been quick enough to cut OB1 in half while he was still in mid-air flying over Maul!

    Obi-Wan leaps from the chasm, and Qui-Gon's lightsaber flies to his outstretched hand. He activates it as his feet hit the ground and takes a desperate swing at his dark opponent. But Maul is quick to react and blocks the green blade. The two continue swinging at each other, faster now than before. Soon, the severed handle of Maul's weapon becomes hot, as the end could not contain the energy as well as a properly sealed hilt. As Maul realizes he is about to lose his advantage, he force-pushes Obi-Wan to the other side of the room and flees.

    Later, as Maul reports to Sidious, he is killed by his unforgiving master.


    Cool!!! I also agree about him getting "killed by his unforgiving master."

    If Maul had to die in TPM, his death should at least have been more believable. 2 times Maul had the chance to cut OB1 in half while OB1 was flying over his head and for some inexplicable reason didn't do so. Perhaps if they cut those scenes out and replaced them with OB1 cutting Maul in half while Maul was doing a fancy flip over OB1's head?

    I could also see Maul surviving and perhaps becoming the lapdog of both Sidious and Dooku until the lightsaber duels in the hangar at the end of AOTC when he is finally cut down by a now more experienced OB1. I can't quite see him still hanging around in ROTS.

    :)

  18. Latorski Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 14, 2002
    star 4
    Mace Windu: YES, HE DESERVED TO DIE, AND I HOPE HE BURNS IN HELL!!!

    [face_laugh]
  19. Ares505 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 27, 2004
    Its been a long time since ive seen this scene so I cant say whether or not it looks too slow. But plot wise I think its brilliant. Obi-Wan and Maul going at it, Maul's saber cut in half, Obi-Wan kicked into the pit, his own saber gone. How does he win? Out thinks his opponent. Maul being over confident lets down his guard and thus cant even block the 'slow' attack. Typical Obi-Wan resourcefullness, typical Sith overconfidence.
  20. master_organa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 5, 2004
    star 5
    I am glad he died. But they should make a spinoff movie of him. Like Shadow Hunter.
  21. CodeVader1 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    if he didnt die there would be no dooku though
  22. Wesyeed Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2005
    star 4
    For all those who say Obi could not kill Maul by slowly jumping out of the pit and taking his sweet time swinging around: Remember, this is the same universe in which a guy pointing a LASER gun four feet from your head can miss.

    And How do we know he's dead. Getting cut in half and falling donw a seemingly bottomless pit does absolutely equal death.

    Luke lost a hand and jumped to his doom, but survived by going down some slide.

    I think Maul will pop up again in RotS to get Revenge on Obi-wan.

    He's the best Character EVER!11!!!1

    Long live Lucas!!!1
  23. BATTLELION Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    star 1
    I really REALLY liked Darth Maul.

    In my opinion he was the best scariest bad guy of that film and possibly of that trilogy.

    He was cool, collected, and crafty.

    He was BAD. He didn't even say much, but his actions spoke louder than words.

    I think it was actually a waste that Maul was killed so quickly. when I saw the fight between QGJ OWK and Maul I knew that Obi could not die, obviously, and I KNEW THAT QUI GON WOULD DIE (he just HAD to die then).

    But what I saw totally surprised me. I thought Obi was going to FLEE FROM MAUL to face him another day.

    Someone said it wouldve been better if Maul fled Obi, I think it is better for the Good guys to run away in those situations, especially considering it was a motif in that movie.

    I think Maul could have become a central villain of the prequel trilogy the way Vader was to the Classic Trilogy. Sadly, the guy died.

    He would have been a great character in AOTC if it was done differently.

    I would have had Anakin kill him to become Sidious' apprentice (kind of like Luke would have if he killed Vader in EP VI)

    "now fulfill your destiny and take Maul's place at my side" kind of thing.

    Well,

    That's all.

    Battle Lion
  24. Nordom Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2004
    star 4
    I think that Maul was somewhat underdeveloped and he could have benefited by having his character developed more.

    Some things I thought off. Maul could have been on the TF ship at the start of TPM, dealing directly with the TF people and Sidious identity would have been a secret. I think that Sidious took a risk by revealing himself to the TF considering how cowardly and inept they were. If a jedi asked Nute "why did you do this?" he would blurt out everything "oh it was a Sith lord by name of Darth Sidious who told us to do it."
    This way the TF only know Maul and Maul in turn reports to Sidious. Maul gives the order to kill the jedi as he fears that they could detect his presence but he does not do it himself as Sidious has forbidden him from revealing himself too soon.

    Another idea is to make the Tatooine fight longer, that Maul first fights Obi-Wan and wounds him slightly but Qui-Gon saves him and drives Maul back. Maul pulls a dirty trick and gives Qui-Gon a fatal wound but Qui-Gon manages to do a force push that sends Maul away.
    Qui-Gon is taken onboard and the ship escapes but Qui-Gon dies soon after. This way Obi-Wan and Anakin are thrown together sooner and it gives Obi-Wan a grudge against Maul during the rest of the movie. This also builds up Maul as a bigger threat and the JC sends more jedis to Naboo, along with Obi-Wan, who insists to go. During the Naboo fight Maul is clever enough to realise that he is outnumbered so he manages to separate the Jedi right away. During the fight with Obi-Wan he taunts him about his masters death and Obi-Wan looses it and is almsot killed but he later manages to calm himself and prevails in the end.

    Regards
    Nordom
  25. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    I think that Maul was somewhat underdeveloped and he could have benefited by having his character developed more.

    He wasn't supposed to be developed. He was a minor, disposable, mysterious bad guy.

    personally, I was prepared for Maul to be the "Vader of the PT," especially with the amount of hype he was receiving.

    I don't recall him receiving any more hype than the other characters. It seemed to me more that people glommed onto him because he looked cool, and he excited the most chatter.
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